Reality Check

harronek

harronek

Joined
Nov 29, 2013
Messages
2,493
I've been contemplating this for quite a long time and thought I'd throw a few of my observations and opinions out there .

For many years now I have carried a knife of some description every single waking hour with the only exception being airline travel or the occasional government building visit.
That means that every year if I do some basic maths I carry a knife for approximately 5840 hours

365 ( days ) x 16 ( hours per day ) = 5840 hours

For the last three weeks I have been monitoring and recording the time I have spent using my knife ( not handling , playing , fondling , but actually using it to cut something )

The average usage over those three weeks has been 49 seconds per day , and I honestly believe I use my knife a lot more than the average member here on the forum due to the type of work I do . ( do your own study and you will shocked at how little you actually use your folder )

365 ( days ) x 49 ( seconds ) = 17885 seconds = 4.96 hours

So I carry a knife for 5840 hours and use it for 4.96 hours per year .

Now I come to the point of this thread .

We spent a huge amount of time carrying our knives and not using them .
Why is there not more emphasis placed on ease of carry and closed shape and size and minimizing pocket disturbance .
A couple of my most recent Spyderco purchases have begun to really annoy me in regards to closed shape and dimensions to the point where I have started to carry a non Spyderco knife during the evenings and weekends to remind myself that a knife doesn't have to be so wide when closed .

The Delica has been my preferred carry for quite some time and I have many different versions of it to play with . I recently got the new Wharncliff version and immediately realized that the curved full spine of the blade while only slightly larger than the standard Delica makes a huge difference somehow of the closed dimensions .
Next came the Urban sprint and again the closed shape is ridiculously deep or wide , to the point where I took one look at it and decided never to carry it .

A lot of the design reasoning behind the handle and blade shape of knives is " In hand ergonomics " and " prolonged usability " , well in reality the only thing prolonged about my knives is the time I spend carrying them , it's certainly not holding on to them and using them .

I know the Spydie Hole places some limitations on how thin you can build a knife , but some of the current leaf shaped models are just to wide and pocket filling for the actual size and type of blade you get from the package .

Here is a pic of a GB Air , New Urban Sprint , and a Delica
Look at the size difference between the Air and the Urban . The Urban takes up a ridiculous amount of pocket space for its usable blade edge lenght .



Now look at the usable blade edge of the two knives .



Now I am the first to admit that the handle length and in hand ergonomics of the Urban probably exceed the Air's but remember I'm not using it continuously and for prolonged periods so that is an insignificant problem , and they are not touted or marketed as hard use knives anyway .

As a matter of interest you get a lot more blade in a Delica for the same width or depth of closed knife . The Delica has a longer handle , but my observation is that a longer handle is less pocket obstructing than a short fat one .




So in this western world of expanding waistlines it seems Spyderco is doing very little to buck that trend and that sadly doesn't suit my requirements or tastes . My knives are going on a fitness regime where leanness , weight and portability are number one priority .

The beauty of Spyderco is there are many options to choose from and hopefully a model to suit all .

Ken
 
Interesting post. I'd say you raise some valid points regarding how much pocket space a knife, specifically, a Spyderco knife, takes up in the pocket. Have you thought about getting one of their slim models? Something like the Mantra 2, Positron or the Southard?


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This is like that gun that came out recently, the Taurus Curve. I think it was a great idea, a gun that is designed to be carried...how often do you shoot?

Swords in old times were designed to be comfortable to wear sometimes at the cost of better hand protection. It is a really interesting point and I actually think it is widely overlooked.
 
All my pants have pretty much the same size pockets except one pair from Arcteryx. The knives never really seem to have a real estate issue.

Phone yes, wallet yes. Knives are inconsequential.
 
I always manage at least 2 to 3 times per year where I use my folder for a 9 hour stretch (whittling while everyone else sleeps during camping) at minimum.
Even if it was 2 times, that would be 9 x 60 = 540. 540 x 2 = 1080. 1080/365 = 2.95 minutes per day.

So, I already use my folder more than you, before I even consider any EDC usage or food prep. :D
 
I don't see an issue with size or shape to pocket. Since I started pocket clipet carry in 1987 nothing else goes in the knife pocket.

I'm a Police Model man from the beginning. So the Military, Szabo, Tatanka seem to find plenty of room
 
I've never really had an issue sliding a hand in and out of a pocket with a Spydie clipped in it.

I just checked my current setup:

UKPK, ~1.5" wide
Hand, flat on table, ~4.5" wide
Jeans pocket, >6" opening

Not saying anyone's right or wrong. Just different strokes I guess and not an issue for me.

To Danke42's point on the phone, I pocket carry a Galaxy Note, which makes a Military look dainty lol. Lately it rides in the same pocket as my UK, still no issues, they're both flat.
 
I've carried a Superhawk in the right front pocket along with my wallet, and never had any issues with it.
The knives in the original post would not seem wide in the pocket to me at all.
 
I understand the OP's point and post, but I do not share the same concerns at all. If I carry a firearm for just 12 hours per day over the course of 30 years, I am looking at more than 130,000 hours of carry. And for what? Never needing it to defend my life or that of someone else? I'd much rather have it and not need it than need it and not have it. Yes, it's a pain in the butt, it's inconvenient, it may even be a liability under some circumstances, but if and when I need it, it will be worth every second of those 130,000 hours. YMMV.

If you really lack space in your pockets when you carry some Spyderco knives, switch to something else like a smaller Spydie or maybe even a small traditional (a Peanut perhaps?). I would not let it bother me too much though; it's really just all in your mind. For example, if you live in LA, your commute might be horrendous. Tucson (where I live) is nothing like LA though, yet I sometimes think traffic here is horrendous. Yet, for a visitor from LA, I'm sure Tucson traffic is almost non-existant comparatively speaking. It's all relative.
 
I don't blame anyone for their preference, and I honestly believe your method of thinking makes a ton of sense. That said, weight and size in pocket have honestly never bothered me much, but I do enough extended cutting that bad ergos and hot spots are a a major deal breaker.
 
It all comes down to what and where I am carrying the knife. My work pants are all Carhartt and all have the "tool" pockets on the leg allowing me to carry a lager knife . Although I did have to switch sides of carry after bending a couple clips sliding across truck seats. When off work and in jeans I prefer a smaller knife like the delica.
 
Interesting thread, Ken. I appreciate your insight on the subject.

My first Spydies were a Tenacious and Manix so I got used to the real estate needed to carry wider folders.

I've had my jazzz Delica in right front pocket all week. It doesn't take up as much space as I thought it would.
 
I carry my knife in my rear pocket and nothing else shares that space, so it doesn't bother me. The other thing I find funny is when people complain about the weight of a 5 ounce knife for edc. On an everyday basis I'm carrying relatively little weight, an extra ounce or two on my edc just doesn't matter. I totally understand if the subject was backpacking. When the ounces really matter
 
It makes perfect sense to me. For me, its often thicker knives that are troublesome, as I have some hiking pants that are quite slim fitted. My normal work pants (a hiking style pant) have too much waist, so the difference between my pingo and a Vic farmer is noticible in how it pulls my pants. It can also be where the pocket is situated, does the knife ride more towards the front of the leg, or beside.

All things being equal, I do notice a relatively small difference in weight. Does that mean I won't carry a certain knife, not always, but it is a factor to weigh in. Horses for courses and all that, but I do get the OP in as far as sometimes something that one wouldn't initially take as a factor for knife carry really can be.
 
What are you carrying that you need so much room? Let's be honest, part of owning knives is fondling/looking at/admiring - not just carrying and cutting. Otherwise, they could be ugly as sin. I agree to a small point - I don't like crazy wide knives, but pockets are pretty big. Now, really heavy knives, I don't like.
 
Ken,

I carry GB1, (previously Resilience) in my RFP, clipless, in a cloth pouch, next to my phone. No problem.
I can try the jazzlica carry if you send me yours ;)
Caveat: my office pants have that inner pocket that fits my iPhone 5, and the GB os outside that inner pouch. The cloth pouches is to prevent it easily going horizontal.

I can see your point but I tend to agree with Jazz. The enjoyment includes also fondling and admiring the craftsmanship and not always usage. My use probably is less than you and I carry them 16-18 hrs a day.
At home I carry 4 of them (Endura, Stretch , GB1 & Atlantic Salt) ;).
 
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