Reflections of a man about telos...

[Diomedes Industries]

I feel that I, and perhaps some of you, purchase knives and other gear as a way of vicariously being in the woods or other natural setting. We cannot get to that setting due to self imposed restrictions and thus we purchase many pieces of gear to feel like we are connected.

Due to this, I have no firm and full idea what I want out of a knife because I have not lives in a situation or environ that I envision I would use the knife in.

I think, then, that I am disappointed by whatever piece of steel I buy because it does not do for me, which is transport me to the woods where I could use said knife.

A knife, I would wager, acts very differently in my garage and other contrived environs than it would for real. Even when I hike, I do not use my knife to live. Any blade can do what I ask of it while I hike. I just carry a large piece of steel to make myself feel better that I have bought this knife.

I take this and I couple it with another observation. Most of the real survivors, the people that I wish to be more like, do not use much of a knife.

Les Stroud used a multi tool or a Buck.

Mors, Cody Lundin and many others use a Mora.

The list goes on.

I wonder if I, and perhaps some of you, are kidding ourselves with our pursuit of the right blade if we have little idea what we want that blade to do.

I think wonder if we really need more than the sub 20 dollar knife than many of the bigger names use.

I wonder if we are not more of collectors and spectators rather than participants.

I want to change this...


TF

 

[Bushman5]

I dont give a rats azz if the "real"*** survivors use dinky little blades or multitools. Those blades are utterly USELESS for me where i live and play, and i can do more and faster with a large chopper than i can just a little blade or multi tool.


*** (no offense to Les Stroud, i have enormous respect for him. )

also, are our survival training trips not survival? it is only the TV shows and book writers that are "real' survivors?

just saying...

 

[Rockywolf]

I feel that I, and perhaps some of you, purchase knives and other gear as a way of vicariously being in the woods or other natural setting. We cannot get to that setting due to self imposed restrictions and thus we purchase many pieces of gear to feel like we are connected.

Due to this, I have no firm and full idea what I want out of a knife because I have not lives in a situation or environ that I envision I would use the knife in.

I think, then, that I am disappointed by whatever piece of steel I buy because it does not do for me, which is transport me to the woods where I could use said knife.

A knife, I would wager, acts very differently in my garage and other contrived environs than it would for real. Even when I hike, I do not use my knife to live. Any blade can do what I ask of it while I hike. I just carry a large piece of steel to make myself feel better that I have bought this knife.

I take this and I couple it with another observation. Most of the real survivors, the people that I wish to be more like, do not use much of a knife.

Les Stroud used a multi tool or a Buck.

Mors, Cody Lundin and many others use a Mora.

The list goes on.

I wonder if I, and perhaps some of you, are kidding ourselves with our pursuit of the right blade if we have little idea what we want that blade to do.

I think wonder if we really need more than the sub 20 dollar knife than many of the bigger names use.

I wonder if we are not more of collectors and spectators rather than participants.

I want to change this...


TF

I too want to change this...any ideas?

 

[Diomedes Industries]

I too want to change this...any ideas?

I think, Rocky, we would need to make changes in our lives to make room for more time in the bush.

Bushman,

I don't think I said you shouldn't carry the blade of your choice - When I used the word 'real', I was simply stating some of the accepted voices in the genre.

I also know that Mears, Koshanski, and the rest would not be caught dead in BC without an Axe.



I was also speaking mostly of myself, and perhaps others. Sorry if I raised your hackles.

TF

 

[Bushman5]

no hackles raised!

perhaps we should get Les to carry a BK7 while on his show, it might subconciously get people to accept the fact that larger blades are extremely useful.

is that sorta along the lines of your post?

edit: I should add that my hiking style is more about taking said tools into the woods and using them, rather than just hiking or sightseeing. I get a new blade or tool and the first thing i do i plan a hike AROUND the blade or tools....

 

[mcjhrobinson]

i use every knife i own and they all serve a different purpose....or can be used in different situations. ive trimmed and sold off the knives that didnt make the cut.

i usually look at a magazine to get my "in the thick" fix.

 

[Rockywolf]

As far as making more time....it is, IMO, necessary to focus on the self more and not the $$. It gets down to how one measures success---for me, time with my sons, growing food, creating a fire in the rain, etc., are more important than adding to my account.

 

[Rick Marchand]

...I wonder if we are not more of collectors and spectators rather than participants.

I want to change this...

You wouldn't be on this site if you weren't you sillybean. Alright then.... stop posting, get out there and do something. You are as crazy as a cucumber.



Rick

 

[Arpaio]

I would love to be able to take more time in the bush. With my new sales job just starting up it has been extremely difficult to take time away. Anyone here in South Carolina have any trips they take regularly on the weekends?

 

[hiwa]

Great philosophical topic. I had to quell my thirst for collecting , and I do not have anywhere near the quality, amount, or type of blades most members have here. I have a modest collection to be sure, but as far as practicality goes, I have more than enough steel to get me through anything.

I bring my knife bag with me when I can on a trip,and it allows me a choice for different blades and lets me see how and what performs what way. In this way I am participating as a knife enthusiast, and the bush is just an end to the means. In other words,I go into the bush to use my knives , as opposed to, I used my knife while I was in the bush. Same thing with guns. Did I go hunting to use my gun?, or did I use my gun to go hunting? Maybe I'm making no sense,LOL, but really in the end a cut is a cut.
If I kill something with my old, beat up 30-30, it's just as dead as if I used an expensive custom rifle. I'm not gonna hunt elephants with the thing,same as I'm not going to baton through a log with a Mora.

I love hearing about the old timer who used some old Marbles knife he had for 50 years, and never wanted (or needed) anything else. I've even wondered myself if I ever find the perfect knife, I'll buy two in case I lose one,and that's all she wrote. But it always seems something else catches my eye. Sometimes I grow tired of it (and poorer) as well. If I am not using the knives I've bought,aren't they just safe-queens and a waste of my hard earned money?

I pick and choose carefully what I want with me on a specific trip, wether I'm going to the jungle in the Philippines, or the nearest campsite down the road. Truth is, I've never had a bad bush experience by bringing the "wrong" knife, nor did what ever knife I use catastrophically fail it's intended task. We use knives for so many different tasks that we have to have a variety of blades to perform best on the tasks we intend to do.
We don't go bushwacking with a filet knife,do we ?! So there's a point where you have the knives to do the job at hand,and anymore than that to me is construed as collecting and fascination. Nothing wrong with that.

Horace Kephart said it best,in the opening of "Camping and Woodcraft." - " We go to the woods to "smooth" it. We get it rough enough about town." I for one say," let's get out into the bush and nature more,and use our knives to make our experience better."

 

[TheGame]

As someone said in the chat earlier tonight, this is a knife website, so we get knives because we are enthused about them. When I get a new knife, I go to the woods, to see how it performs. However, this is only because I have a woods in my back yard. If I had to drive an amount of time to use that blade, I wouldn't do it immediately upon getting one knife. After I acquired a few, I would go out and use them, and see how they do.

I buy gear to use, not to just have. Anything and everything I purchase will get used. There is nothing I own that I will not use. A lot of the gear we buy for our bushcrafting or woodsbumming, I use regularly around the house also. Especially cooking utensils and fire starting implements.

Perhaps this may not be true, perhaps it may, but if we ONLY bought Multi-tools, Moras and Bucks because that is all we see them with, than wouldn't this post be about why we don't go further into knives, and not just what they use? I don't know. It just seems like that would be the thing to happen.

 

[Rotte]

I wonder if we are not more of collectors and spectators rather than participants.

Absolutely. I passed owning a reasonable number of knives a long time ago. I never wanted to be a collector, yet that is what I've become. And each new knife represents some new adventure or trip, fills some perceived 'need'. I keep telling myself to go out and do more vs. collect gear. But time is the most precious of commodities in my life right now--I have more knives than time in which to use them. You are right, the priorities have been turned on their collective heads.

Yet again there is more than that to knife collecting. There are intrinsic qualities that making collecting a pleasure as well.

A year ago I tried to pare my collection down: I sold a few and gave several away. But damn, if I didn't end up getting 'replacements'. So for the moment, I surrender to this ridiculous hobby. So many knives, so little time....

 

[mtnfolk mike]

this is an interesting topic... hhhmmm....

i agree with a lot of folks so far.. like most of us, i have always been into knives, and i use the vast majority of the ones i own, with the exception of a few.. i have many different blades that cater to different needs/uses... i like having variety..

 

[PayetteRucker]

I like to think I have it good living at the base of a mountain range with endless trails, and in the last few weeks have gotten outside of the immediate area to hike (climb and swim in some other cases) other systems as well. I have recently revamped my bush knives, going from using Kabar fighting knives and a Gerber LMF to a RAT RC5 and a Koyote Leuku. The Kabar and Gerber obviously performed as I am here to tell about it, but I was gentle with the kabar and the Gerber came back dull and chipped after a 3 day backpacking trip. After being used and abused my RC5 and Leuku are both hair splitting sharp. It's not about performance, it's about how long that knife can perform and what options it gives you. With that Rc5 I have cut down entire trees and trucked them down a mountain to feed a fire for 30 people. It opens the door for more options which can greatly help in a survival situation, and just the peace of mind that that knife will NOT fail you... arguably the most important part of your kit... Can you get by with a 15 dollar knife? sometimes yes, but the question is for how long and in what situation?

 

[PayetteRucker]

I too want to change this...any ideas?

I changed my entire lifestyle. I too spent my life longing for time outside, and when I lived in Houston all I could get was a 100 meter long ditch full of turtles and herons behind some apartment buildings. I was single, had no job, my lease was up, and decided it was an opportune time to make a real change in my life, one that will make the quality of life for both me and my future family much better. I stuffed all my life belongings in the back of a moving truck (the important stuff in my pack) and drove 2200 miles to Idaho. You may be tied down with a lease or a house or a job or a family... but I can guarantee you it will take less effort to pack your life up in a moving van, relocate to a town like Bozeman or Boise or Colorado Springs, find a new job and resettle than spend your entire life longing and urging to have more access to the outdoors. You have to get your priorities straight. You may not make as much money, but who needs money when your recreation is free?

 

[Mentor]

"A Teleological Treatise on Knifenuts", by Talfuchre

It is an interesting question. Does the knife or item of gear act as a proxy for something 'more authentic'? Is it the commoditized representation of the idealized wilderness we wish to escape to? Do we collect bushcraft knives in an attempt to experience some version of Walden's Pond, without actually doing what Thoreau did and "going to the woods"?

For some, I'm sure this is the case (actually, I will go so far as to say that there is a grain of truth in this that applies to us all, particularly insofar as it describes a general relationship between objects and desires). I don't think that it always operates in an extreme form, though, and particularly not around here. I think that this is a community of knife enthusiasts who generally - as compared to our peers - spend a considerable amount of time (often as much as possible) "getting out there". I look around my home and see images and objects that remind me of past trips and outings to come. I certainly don't see them as evidence that I have fallen short of some kind of an authentic minimalist-survivalist ideal, and have subconsciously compensated with objects.

I have a lot of respect for Les Stroud. He is a survival expert, and he knows how to get the most out of a basic knife when he's in the wilderness. Same goes for Cody Lundin, and the others. Neither of them are self-professed knife enthusiasts or appreciators of fine cutlery, though.

By contrast, I am not a survival expert. I am someone who appreciates the outdoors and tries to spend as much time there as possible, and has a good grasp of the basic skills that I need when I'm on an outing. AND I am a knife enthusiast and appreciator of fine cutlery.

I do not consider their lifestyles, philosophies, or experiences to be a benchmark for my own, or vice versa. Further, I would like to think that I have the ability to appreciate the attributes of the simple things in life - but this doesn't automatically translate into a minimalist interpretation of the gear / skills question.

All that being said, I think that there is truth to be found in theories that suggest that modern and late modern societies are in many ways defined by systems of commoditization, where the acquisition of objects as the means to an experiential end gives way to the acquisition of objects becoming both the means and the end. And bearing this in mind, I think that there are plenty of people who look into their wallets to find the wilderness.

Me, I just like hiking, sharp stuff, and long walks on the beach ...

All the best,

- Mike

 

[skitertank]

i love knives but i wouldnt say that i collect them(i dont even have that many). i dont buy any knife i cant use.

 

[myright]

I want to change this...


TF

I do too...

For a year or so now I've been trying to figure out a way make the career change I want to make and be able to support my family taking a 60% pay cut. It's a tough pill to swallow but I'm not getting any younger. I'm back in school now so I can maximize my potentional for promotion in the LEO job I'm looking for.

I try to get out as much as possible but sometimes feel rushed as if I have to be somewhere or have to do something. I grew up playing in the woods and somewhere along the way ended up sitting at a desk instead of having fun....

 

[JK Knives]

About a year and a half ago, I drastically changed my lifestyle. I "left" my job of 37 years to do what I really wanted to do, before stress killed me. So far I`ve managed to pay my bills even after taking a $60K pay cut a year. My wife works part time, and is usually home by 10 am, so we do get out and take a lot of hikes, not wilderness, but still getting outdoors at least once a week. After years of working 60 - 65 hours a week, I`ve finally got the time to spend with my kids and grandkids that I was missing out on before. Hell, I don`t even own a watch anymore, time means nothing now.

 

[Loosearrow]

Good posts.