Request : Marine Tuf-Cloth vs wear

C

Cliff Stamp

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Some time ago I wrote up some work on a few corrosion inhibitors and how they worked (or didn't actually) if the blades were used after the coatings were applied :

http://www.bladeforums.com/ubb/Forum3/HTML/001904.html

Shortly after that I commented on this in a thread about such products :

http://www.bladeforums.com/ubb/Forum54/HTML/002167.html

Mark Mrozek, President of Sentry Solutions Ltd., replied and stated that their products do not work in the manner I have described, fair enough.


My request is as follows, is there anyone who has noticed Marine Tuf-Cloth offering any protection after the blade has seen actual use? If so would you be willing to do a simple experiment?

Take a piece of metal, doesn't have to be a knife, mild steel rod would be best actually, coat it with a Marine Tuf-Cloth and after it dries go out and beat it around in some vegetation (not just light grass and hay) for about 250 hits, around 10 minutes work. Decent speed and force as if you were cutting through it.

Now put it in a very corrosive enviroment (salt water) along with a piece of similar metal that was not used or coated and see if there is a significant difference in how the rust forms.

-Cliff

[This message has been edited by Cliff Stamp (edited 09-22-2000).]
 
I've got the perfect knife. I bought a 12" el cheapo bowie to learn a little on sharpening a recurved edge. How 'about if I use the Marine TC on all but the first 3" next to the handle and avoid using that portion to whack with? I've also got some weeds/saplings that need to be trimmed back.

I'll try to do it this weekend, but I may not get to it. Have a football game and several houses to check out, so it might be next week.

------------------
Knowledge without understanding is knowledge wasted.
Understanding without knowledge is a rare gift - but not an impossibility.
For the impossible is always possible through faith. - Bathroom graffiti, gas station, Grey, TN, Dec, 1988

AKTI Member #A000831
 
Sounds good to me, be warned though, salt water soaks can induce significant pitting on stainless steels and can also leave large amounts of carbon steels covered in patches of black iron oxide (the orange rust comes off easily and usually doesn't penetrate far).

-Cliff
 
Thanks for the heads up. I only spent $12, so I'm not worried about it.

------------------
Knowledge without understanding is knowledge wasted.
Understanding without knowledge is a rare gift - but not an impossibility.
For the impossible is always possible through faith. - Bathroom graffiti, gas station, Grey, TN, Dec, 1988

AKTI Member #A000831
 
Cliff,

I'm still planning to do this, but it probably won't be until November. I just signed a sales contract for a new home and have a great deal to get done before we close.

Maybe someone else could do this quicker, but I'll keep checking the thread.



------------------
Knowledge without understanding is knowledge wasted.
Understanding without knowledge is a rare gift - but not an impossibility.
For the impossible is always possible through faith. - Bathroom graffiti, gas station, Grey, TN, Dec, 1988

AKTI Member #A000831
 
This is what I did:

Took a 15" Pakistani Bowie; good enough knife, full tang, hickory handles (believe it!), and ok steel (5160). I taped half the blade with one layer of masking tape, and sprayed a thin film of lithium soap/grease over the exposed steel. I then removed the tape, and simply rubbed two swipes with my Tuff Cloth (Marine Type) across the half that was previously covered.

I took the knife with me to the shop, and proceded to clear the ivy behind my garage. The knife was try, but a little tacky. After work was done-about an hour of HEAVY vegatation removal-I swiped both sides clean seperately with a dry towel, and left the blade standing in the sink of the garage. Next day...SUPRISE!!! Tuff-CLoth side had no RUST...but it did pit alot, and had all little blackish gray dots all the way up to the "LINE" that the taped marked. The other part of the blade, and in all honesty, the part in contact with the bushes the most, HAD NOTHING ON IT!!!

I was subsequently unable to remove the pitting from the aft section of the blade. No biggy, knife still good worker, just not pretty. I have actually started to THROW this puppy!

Steve in NYC



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What we do today in life...echoes in eternity...
Every man dies...not every man lives...
 
Cliff: Not sure what your read is on Tuf Cloth, but, my understanding is that you need to reapply after the type of usage you refer to. There is no product of this type that penetrates INTO the metal-it is all on the surface, so, if you wipe/wear it off, it, and the protection it offered, is gone.

I have been using Tuf Cloth and other Sentry Solution products for years now, and, I've had no problems-pretty good testimony, since I primarily use A2.

I like thge cloth to be wet with tuf Glide, and, when you get the heavy, waxy film, you're set.

RJ
 
Originally posted by rj martin:
Cliff: Not sure what your read is on Tuf Cloth, but, my understanding is that you need to reapply after the type of usage you refer to. There is no product of this type that penetrates INTO the metal-it is all on the surface, so, if you wipe/wear it off, it, and the protection it offered, is gone.
Click to expand...

I think if the Sentry Solutions people would just admit that, this thread would end. Part of Cliff's question seems to be that when he informed them of real-world evidence that their coating is not "effective after use", they claimed that it was.

The directions on mine say to apply after heavy usage. But they are claiming that a group of people who went hacking vegetation in the rain forest, had absolutely no rust on their blades after several weeks. Cliff's info is useful to me, because now I won't trust that just because the blade was coated once, that's enough for anything but storage.
 
Originally posted by Cliff Stamp:
Some time ago I wrote up some work on a few corrosion inhibitors and how they worked (or didn't actually) if the blades were used after the coatings were applied :

http://www.bladeforums.com/ubb/Forum3/HTML/001904.html

Shortly after that I commented on this in a thread about such products :

http://www.bladeforums.com/ubb/Forum54/HTML/002167.html

Mark Mrozek, President of Sentry Solutions Ltd., replied and stated that their products do not work in the manner I have described, fair enough.


My request is as follows, is there anyone who has noticed Marine Tuf-Cloth offering any protection after the blade has seen actual use? If so would you be willing to do a simple experiment?

Take a piece of metal, doesn't have to be a knife, mild steel rod would be best actually, coat it with a Marine Tuf-Cloth and after it dries go out and beat it around in some vegetation (not just light grass and hay) for about 250 hits, around 10 minutes work. Decent speed and force as if you were cutting through it.

Now put it in a very corrosive enviroment (salt water) along with a piece of similar metal that was not used or coated and see if there is a significant difference in how the rust forms.

-Cliff

[This message has been edited by Cliff Stamp (edited 09-22-2000).]
Click to expand...

This may be a great product, but how can you stand the smell long enough to use it? When I opened the package the fumes nearly knocked me over and I'd barely finished wiping down the first knife when my wife came from the other side of the house to inquire about the "horrible chemical smell" I think I'll stick with WD-40.
 
R. J., I never disputed that part of the ability, in fact I have referenced it many times, including in the reports where it failed to offer an wear based protection.

John :

Part of Cliff's question seems to be that when he informed them of real-world evidence that their coating is not "effective after use", they claimed that it was.
Click to expand...

Basically this started because I found a rust inhibitor that claims to be wear resistant. I tested this on a blade and found that it came off almost immediately after use. Ron from Sog brought up Sentry Solutions products and so I repeated this with a Marine Tuf-Cloth. It fared no better and basically offered no protection.

When I brought this up later on in responce to a question about such products, Mark from Sentry Solutions, as John notes, comes on very strong saying that the product does not behave as I have described, my conclusions are erroneous etc. . He brings up a number of faults in my procedure, none of which are relevant and again as John states, makes several very strong claims, such as even the regular Tuf-Cloth will perform much better than what I have described.


-Cliff
 
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