Rolling lock question / Poll

[cpirtle]

I've gotten my Rolling Lock collection up to a couple and plan to add a FS Carni soon.

My Pioneer II came with a lock release that slid all the way forward when the blade was opened. My Carni Cub's lock release is about 1/16 from being all the way forward.

After having gutted my Pioneer several times (for fun AND excercise) I get the impression that if the slide is not all of the way forward then you don't have as much lock in the blade path because it is not fully rotated into place.

I've spent the evening looking at photos on the web at dealer pages and it seems some go all the way forward and others have up to 1/8" distance from full forward.

My question; is this what REKAT means when they say--

"The Rolling Lock is cammed to self adjust for wear giving a life time of service."

As the lock wears the rolling mechanism will travel forward more?

Or, should the slide be all the way forward offering the most amount of lock in the blade path as possible and the ones that do not just need adjusted, polished or broke in?

I'd also like to see a show of hands regarding slide position on your REKATS(more for curiosity than anything).

BTW, very minor annoyances aside, I think my REKATS are the best pieces I own right now. These GD things are addicting, my REKAT virus has me sifting through the FS section here every night for more of them!

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"You can go a long way with a smile. You can go a lot farther with a smile and a gun" Al Capone

 

[AntDog]

My pioneer, carnivore, carnivore cub, and sifu all locked up with a little space. None of them lock up all the way at the end like you describe. I have not taken any of them apart, so I don't know if it's better to have your locking mechanism slide all the way. Does your pioneer hold up to the "whack test" etc.?

 

[cpirtle]

I used 2 of the images from REKAT's old page and edited one to illustrate my point. Hopefully I won't get sued

Image 1 shows the Rolling lock fully engaged in the Tang, the way I think it should be when the slide is all the way forward.

Image 2 is my rendation of where the lock is positioned if the slide is only partially forward.

Image 3 is the lock releasing the blade allowing it to close.

You can see from my rendition (Image 2) that there is not as much lock material engaging the blade, this condition would happen when the slide is not forward and does not push the lever controlling the lock all the way forward.

I am 95% sure that the blade would not close in image 2 but I'm 100% sure in image 1 (under normal use that any folder would be subject to). There is just far more steel blocking the blade in Image 1.

To answer the question about the blade whack. I gave my Pioneer a medium whack when I first got it and it passed even with slight blade play and the lock not being fully engaged (it is now perfect after a little tweaking and polishing).

After having my Pioneer apart I would not do the whack test again on one of my REKATS for numerous reasons.

Mainly that if the lock is fully seated, in order to make it fail you would have to nearly shear off about 1/8" of bearing grade steel. I have little to no concern about this lock failing under most (if not all) uses most people would have for it. I think the ONLY thing stronger is a fixed blade and nearly equal would be an Axis lock, but I like REKATS better. (toss up with the McHenry's though, REKATS just ahead)

IMHO, if the lockup is tight, just because of the lock design it will pass the whack test.

If you are not concerned about the warranty (and you're handy) I would reccomend taking yours apart to see how it really works, you'll be amazed at how simple yet effective the design is.

I'd like word from REKAT or someone who knows for sure if the failure of the slide to go all the way forward is by design or mfg error.

[This message has been edited by cpirtle (edited 05-19-2001).]

 

[Safety Guy]

My Sifu's lock button does not go all the way forward. It's at about 75% forward. I can see on the tang notch a little polishing from the wear. The lock just doesn't engage all the way. I don't know if it is supposed to be like this. I too, would like to know!

Karl

 

[cpirtle]

Safety Guy, after having my Pioneer apart I just can't see how the lock is fully engaged without the slide being forward all the way.

My Carni Cub is 80% but I was hoping to hear other opinions before I polish her up and get her to 100% forward.


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"You can go a long way with a smile. You can go a lot farther with a smile and a gun" Al Capone

 

[Willie Boy]

I have often wondered about this question too. I have three REKATS currently and on all of them, the slide is about two-thirds forward. I did have a Carnivore on which the slide was all the way forward. It also had verticle blade play. Therefore, it is my assumption the slide moves forward as the lock wears.

It sure would be nice if Bob Brothers or Bob Taylor would answer this question.

 

[Easyrider]

Willie Boy nailed it! As the Rolling Lock wears the slide will move forward more. Once that lock engages, I can't imagine the blade folding up on you!

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A Pat on the Back is only a few inches from a Kick in the Butt.

 

[cpirtle]

That was what I was thinking "cammed for wear" meant. If you read REKAT's description of the rolling lock they use that term.

I also looked at the pictures of the Savant from another thread and they have a 5-up picture, every one has the lock 60-70% forward.

I agree now, that is the way they intend it to be. Then that should mean the ones that go to 100% out of the box will have less room for wear.

 

[cpirtle]

I just checked my BM 705 axis lock and it is the same way, the lock only moves about 85% of the way forward so as it wears, the lock will still be tight.

Cool

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[milcaztra]

Cpirtle, do you still intend to polish your blade tang so that the locking pin locks-up completely? If so, I'd like to know how it turns out. I've been considering doing the same thing myself.

 

[cpirtle]

<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by milcaztra:
Cpirtle, do you still intend to polish your blade tang so that the locking pin locks-up completely? If so, I'd like to know how it turns out. I've been considering doing the same thing myself.</font>

I've already done this to my Pioneer II. I was holding off on the Carni Cub to hear the results of this thread.

Here is what I polished;
Back of blade Tang
Rounded section of lock
Outside surface of liner, lock side
Steel lock lever (section between liner and g-10)

What I did not polish;
The notch in the lock
The notch in the blade where the lock pivots

Results;
The knife is 10x smoother in operation. I never have a problem releasing the blade lock now (because the lever is smooth) and the grittyness is 95% gone. Lock-up is tighter than ever, but my slide is all the way forward. If you're handy I'd say go for it!

I'm still planning on doing my Carni Cub but I want to keep my lock from going all the way forward since I now feel that it's not supposed to.

I sure wish someone from REKAT would chime in on this one for an "official" ruling.

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[Bob Brothers]

The slides should travel at least way to the front of the slot when new. Most of the knives when manufactured the slide stops some where from .040 to .150 from the front of the slot. As the knife wears the lock will rotate further into the back of the blade and the slide will move forward until it runs out of travel. The difference in strength between the slide being at .040 verses .150 would be a very small amount.
A knife that the slide travels all the way to the front as long as the blade has no vertical play would be considered 100% the lock is still taking up slack. Even after a knife has worn to the point that there is vertical play there is no more or less danger of the lock failing than before any vertical became noticeable.
Bob Brothers

 

[cpirtle]

Beautiful! Just the answer I think we were all waiting for, thanks Bob

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