Sak Steel

stainless !

as far as i heard, they use so much steel that they have to buy it from different factories, and it may vary a bit. They use average steel (average meaning for me "not top quality, but not crappy one also !)
 
There was an article years ago in one of the knife rags, and the spokesman for Victorinox told the reporter that they purchase steel from both France and Sweden.
 
freddy1 said:
stainless !

as far as i heard, they use so much steel that they have to buy it from different factories, and it may vary a bit. They use average steel (average meaning for me "not top quality, but not crappy one also !)
Click to expand...

I had never thought about it but they must use up vast quantities of steel. Almost everyone I know has at least 1 SAK or has had one at some point in their life.
 
At last look (a few weeks ago) Victorinox makes over 100,000 knives per day. I can see how they need to buy steel from everywhere :)
 
440A, I belive. It works, especially for the price they sell for. The blades on SAKs are ground so thin, that they actually push cut long after the scary sharp edge is gone. I'll never be without at least one SAK.
 
SAK's are great knives. Their blades work great on pretty much all my cutting needs. I doubt a "premium" steel would give you enough performance improvement to justify a higher cost.
 
Well, last I heard they were using Sandvic 12C27. They used to use 420 stainless, the European variety, this has much more carbon than the 420 and 420J2 used in display knives from the Oriental areas.
 
This topic comes up regularly -

Here's a page on the Victorinox Steelinfo over at pizzini.at - an Austrian SAK dealer - the information is/was originally from Victorinox.

QUOTED from that page:
"For both blades we use chrome molydenum stainless steel with 0.52% carbon, 15% chromium, 0.5% molydenum, 0.45% manganese and 0.6% silicium. After a sophisticated hardening process at 1040°C and an annealing temperature of 160°C the blades achieve a hardness of RC 56.
* ​

The woodsaw, scissors and nail files have a hardness of RC 53, the screwdriver, tin opener and awl a hardness of RC 52, and the corkscrew and springs RC 49.

* ​

The metal saw and file, in addition to the special case hardening, are also subjected to a hard chromium plating process so that iron and steel can also be filed und cut.

* ​

The separators have been made from aluminium alloy since 1951. This makes the knife lighter and easier to carry in one's pocket. Formerly these separating layers were made of nickel-silver.

*​

The rivets are made of brass and the outer casing of cellidor, made in the USA.

* ​

The spring exerts a pressure of 12 kilograms on the large blade and 8 kilograms on the small blade. The combined 20 kilograms exert pressure on the corkscrew. With two springs and six pressure locations a total of 70 kilograms pressure is achieved. To close the blades high pressure is necessary since the ratio of the pressure points between the axis and the thumbnail recess is 1 to 20. In the case of the "SwissChamp" model with 8 springs and 24 pressure points a total of 300 kilograms (660 lb) is achieved. "

--
Vincent
http://UnknownVT2005.cjb.net/
http://UnknownVT.cjb.net/
http://UnknownVincent.cjb.net/
 
I was impressed the first time I read that Victorinox use different hardness for different tools. Then they know exactly how strong all of the springs are too. They really think about what they are making.

There are a LOT of basic steels out there which perform better than you would think. Most of them have less Carbon than 440a, and yet don't suffer much from it. Maybe just updated formulas. Some cheap German slipjoints I have used (Boker, kissing krane) had unspecified steel, but worked better than unlabeled steel from the US or China which is often a crummy version of 420. Victorinox is similar. Definitely better than 420j2, though not anywhere near top end stuff.

Too many fancy knives with good steel are not hardened enough and have stupid blade shapes and bevels. Compare a Victorinox at 56rc to some fancy looking knife with fancy steel only hardened to 57rc and a bad bevel, and you will wonder why people buy expensive knives. You have to compare it to a blade made from better steel AND still has a sensible blade shape AND is hardened more to take advantage of the better steel.
 
What would be interesting is what would happen if Victorinox started making some "tactical" folders.

Something along the lines of the Griptilian or the Delica. I bet they could make a kick butt knife.

:)
 
I can imagine it now:

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bladefixation2 said:
I would pay twice as much for one with a 440c blade ...
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What's the point of "upping" the steel if the previous works, and more than adequately at that. If my experience counts, I have found SAK steels sharpen to a very keen edge and although it can't hold one like say ATS-34, it can sharpened to a nasty edge quicker than the former. Inexpensive bragging quality, a SAK has and I believe that was the entire Victorinox philosophy.

May I add that SAK steels are second to none in stainlessness.
 
That sounds pretty much like 425 mod. steel.

Given the low hardness and the low carbon and zero Vanadium content it is actually quite astonishing that SAKs are so popular.

If CRKT would start making their blades out of 425 mod. there would be a roar of protest (well, I am not so sure that AUS-4 is that much better). Not to mention if Spyderco would switch to 425 mod. on their Delica.
 
My take is that the ease with which I can resharpen my SAKs is wonderful. In my "world", I typically don't use them so much that I don't have an opportunity to touch them up within a day or so of heavy use, so I kind of appreciate how easy they are to sharpen (as opposed to harder steels). To each their own...

Don't mean to hijack the thread, but at the risk of doing so, what do y'all who know more about VNox models suggest as a minimalist model that has:
- scissors
- short blade and long blade
- saw
- (and whatever else that could come with those minimal requirements) ?

I have a super tinker and a rambler - just wondering about thin alternatives with a saw...

Thanks
 
Im not saying the steel is 'bad' Im just saying I would like it better with a better steel. Like Leatherman tools, the wave steel wasnt 'bad' but with the 154CM steel on the charge im sure its better (I dont own one, Im assuming! I have a wave, I cant carry them because of the locking blade.)

The stronger finer edge you get on a harder steel bites into things better IMHO, plus I like not having to sharpen knives too regularly and as Im in the UK my SAK or low end leatherman Juice tend to do almost 100% of my cutting work because its all I can carry.

edb - do you want a metal saw or a wood saw?
 
HoB said:
Given the low hardness and the low carbon and zero Vanadium content it is actually quite astonishing that SAKs are so popular.
Click to expand...

The knife blade is only one part of it. You don't just have a knife, you have a knife, screwdriver, bottle opener, tweezers, etc., all good enough to use.

I also wouldn't call 56 "low." More like the lowest end of medium (I would say 56,57,58 are all medium). It's reasonable for a just-in-case knife and you wouldn't be mad at it if you had to use it. Make a usefully-shaped blade and it works out OK.
 
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