Scary sharp blade really worth it?

[db]

It is not clear. The fact that it slice better without any pressure applied does not mean that it will slice better when there is some pressure. Because in this case it will be push+draw. Slicing without any pressure applied is not real world example. IMHO there are more push cut in what mostly knives are used for.

See different people cut differently. I think most real world cutting is more of a slice than a push. I agree real world cutting is more of a combo of both I don't think I ever use a pure push cut on anything.

The problem is that I a not sure how to test At least can we all use same terms - edge angle, edge thickness and edge polish?

In this terms working edge - is like coarse polished edge I guess.

Thanks, Vassili.

Yeah terms scary sharp and working edge seem to be different depending on the person. I think you can surely get a coarser grit edge scary sharp, and if your not careful a polished edge easily dull.

 

[gunmike1]

I agree that different cutting, steels, finishes and angles make the ideal working edge different from knife to knife and task to task. Different steels and different tasks should have different angles and polishes that suit them best. As for real world cutting, that will also vary from one person to the next, as I use a lot of draw on my cardboard and rope cutting as I push away from my body, while others do more of a pushcut.

I prefer the term well formed coarse edge to coarse polished edge though, as if the edge is polished then it is no longer coarse. It should be interesting to see how the testing turns out.

Mike

 

[buckabee]

I my theory, the sharpening motion is also an imporant factor, to get to the right kind of polish. Many people here sharpen moving with the edge towards the sharpener, but others also use other motions, like circular ones.
-With the first, you create a small edge and create microserrations where the bigger microparticles of the sharpener take away little parts of the edge, but because it happens at the right angle, even the smallest parts of the tooths will be sharp.
-When you use another motion, like a motion directly from tip to back for example; you will remove the microserrations as the same particels of the sharpener travel over the entire edge, and will even create some dullness when a particle hooks over the microedge and rounds it a bit for a relative long distance.

I hope what I'm trying to say is understandable, as I haven't got the time now to make a picture of it to clarify it some more.

(btw, same disclamer counts as in my previous post in this topic, I'm not a specialist in the matter, and can be completely wrong with this )

 

[nozh2002]

Yea... It is hard to imagine what kind of edge will be in result of circular motion... Really! May be it should not be used at all, because it will actually removes all tooth - depends on what motion did you finish.

What kind of edge will be if sharpen with parallel to the edge move?

Will it benefit if we try to orient tooth one or other way, but not perpendicular to the edge?

Thanks, Vassili.

 

[the possum]

Jumping in late here, with some thoughts-

The edge degrades much more rapidly at first. Yes, it will last longer on the whole, but depending what you're cutting it may only be for a few extra strokes.

I use my farm blades for all kinds of crap. The next task it may face could completely dull or damage the edge on the first stroke, regardless of whether the edge is finely polished or coarse, or slightly dull/less than sharp. For this reason if I'm apt to carry a stone with me for field touchups, it will be a coarse one, so I can remove damage quickly.

For me, the question of whether it's worth it really boils down to time. This is how I distinguish between getting something really sharp vs. a "good enough" working edge. I'm not gonna spend 10 minutes polishing and removing the burr if I know the edge will likely be mangled again within the hour. However sharp it gets with a few swipes on a coarse stone will have to do. And I can give it a few more swipes in mere seconds halfway through the job/day if I have to.

 

[1Bigdog]

I think you are talking about edge angle.

Angle on the edge has nothing to do with ability to whittle hair. My edges are all 30 degree. Thickness of the edge has nothing to do with angle - this is how wide edge shoulders are - and this is has nothing to do with ability to whittle hair too.

Thanks, Vassili.

Take your "scary edged" 30 degree blade to a 1 degree angle and it would be sharper yet. Take it to an angle which has only an atom or two of thickest and it would be the sharpest that that knife can be made.

Such an edge would not be durable and would quickly roll over on itself and turn dull to a point of being unusable.

Every knife has its own optimum angle for the best combination of sharpness and durability and that is some point before the sharpest that a knife can be made.