Sebenza Sharpening Question

TripleF100

TripleF100

Joined
Dec 30, 2014
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195
If I understand correctly CRK sharpens a Sebenza to a convex edge. Also, if I understand correctly sharpening systems (Wicked Edge, Edgepro, KME, Sharpmaker, etc.) don't really do convex edges but can fairly easily put a primary bevel and add a micro bevel.

First, am I correct in my understandings? And if I am correct, how do you sharpen your CRK knives? Free-hand a convex edge? Used a system and if so what sort of angles do you use? (Like a primary of 30° and a micro bevel of 40° or something else).

My freehand sharpening has been honed with probably 30 years of practice and still sucks!! I use a Sharpmaker now but am considering upgrading but now all my EDC carrying is only CRK so if I'm going to make a change I want to be sure I'm doing the best thing for my CRK knives.

(Since this question is strictly a CRK question I'm putting it here, but if a moderator feels it needs to be elsewhere . . . please move it!

Thanks!!
 
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After about three years of daily CRK carry, I have settled on a KSF leather strop loaded with medium and fine grit compounds as my main sharpening system. Very little metal is removed, and the strop has no issue dealing with the convex CRK factory edge. I default to a sharpmaker for repairing any major dulling or damage to the edge. With the sharpmaker, you are forced to removed the slight factory convex first, to get right to the edge, and this can be a hassle the first time. Once you start using a loaded strop, the convex comes back over time, and if you have to hit the sharpmaker again, you will need, again, to remove the convex to hit the edge with the rods.

Sounds like maybe a hassle, but to tell you the truth, once I started sharpening with a loaded strop, I find I never pull out the sharpmaker. Things just seem to truck along fine as long as I don't do severe damage to the edge doing something foolish. It's really hard to screw up with a leather strop. You remove very little steel, and don't run the risk of ugly scratches on the blade if you slip. Also I feel the slight convex edge it gives you is more robust than a true v-grind.
 
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Heresy, I know, but I just hone my 21 edge-forward on diamond hones, never mind the convex edge, which was pretty subtle anyway. Cuts like a banshee. S35Vn is a fabulous steel.
 
I mostly use loaded strops, like kidcongo. Dull edges or heavily used edges sometimes go to the SM at 40 degrees. I have some CBN paste on balsa that I like a lot as well as a couple of Brommeland loaded & bare strops.
 
kidcongo said:
After about three years of daily CRK carry, I have settled on a KSF leather strop loaded with medium and fine grit compounds as my main sharpening system. Very little metal is removed, and the strop has no issue dealing with the convex CRK factory edge. I default to a sharpmaker for repairing any major dulling or damage to the edge. With the sharpmaker, you are forced to removed the slight factory convex first, to get right to the edge, and this can be a hassle the first time. Once you start using a loaded strop, the convex comes back over time, and if you have to hit the sharpmaker again, you will need, again, to remove the convex to hit the edge with the rods.

Sounds like maybe a hassle, but to tell you the truth, once I started sharpening with a loaded strop, I don't find I never pull out the sharpmaker. Things just seem to truck along fine as long as I don't do severe damage to the edge doing something foolish. It's really hard to screw up with a leather strop. You remove very little steel, and don't run the risk of ugly scratches on the blade if you slip. Also I feel the slight convex edge it gives you is more robust than a true v-grind.
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^^^ this is the post i would post if put in charge of posting to this topic
 
I convex on polish stones. It's not really a true convex, more like 100 bevels that look convexed.

Works well though.

I plan on getting a wicked edge pro 2, if i can justify the price. Stones are cheap and work fantastic, just not as 'neat' photo worthy edges like I've seen on this subforum.
 
spunky45 said:
does anybody recommend these work sharps
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I tried one at Cabelas. I promptly dulled the hell out of my little brother's Don't Tread On Me Sebenza, along with a badly rounded tip. (I wasn't going to try it on my own knife :D)

Knowing how to freehand is the best way, IMO. Just takes a little practice and you caneed sharpen anything.
 
Tripton said:
Knowing how to freehand is the best way, IMO. Just takes a little practice and you caneed sharpen anything.
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Wonder how many more years I might need to be able to free-hand!! Hahaha! I watched every utube video and still dullness! I yield!
 
I use 1000 and 5000 grit water stones then strop with BRKC green and white compounds. If you want more of a slicer, strop on a hard surface to keep more of the "V" edge.
 
I only use the sharpmaker and have been using this and the old vintage crock sticks systems the sharpmaker is based off of for 30+ years. Once I get to the belly, I slightly tilt the blade to follow the convex edge. I can sharpen a sebenza dozens of times and the edge still looks factory. Sometimes, it only takes 1/2 dozen strokes per side to get it back to razor sharp. CRK also recomends the sharpmaker. It's easy to use and you can easily follow the contour, while the fancy wicked edges and edge pros ruin the edges by taking off too much metal. I cringe when I see the proud sharpening jobs people used on those systems. In many ways, all they did was ruin the edge and the knife overall. Learn to use the sharpmaker and you can't go wrong. Use the sharpie trick to get the hang of it and you will be happy.
 
nyefmaker said:
I can sharpen a sebenza dozens of times and the edge still looks factory. Sometimes, it only takes 1/2 dozen strokes per side to get it back to razor sharp. CRK also recomends the sharpmaker. It's easy to use and you can easily follow the contour, while the fancy wicked edges and edge pros ruin the edges by taking off too much metal. I cringe when I see the proud sharpening jobs people used on those systems. In many ways, all they did was ruin the edge and the knife overall.
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Why are the fancy Wicked Edge and Edge Pros applied edges ruining the knife by removing too much metal? Can you explain what you mean?

To me an edge that looks like a factory edge means it is at least 17-20 degrees per side dull (34-40 inclusive, sometimes 50), so very dangerous to use, no matter how well it shaves. An edge that looks "factory" is often the worst thing you can have on a knife...

Gaston
 
Gaston444 said:
Why are the fancy Wicked Edge and Edge Pros applied edges ruining the knife by removing too much metal? Can you explain what you mean?

To me an edge that looks like a factory edge means it is at least 17-20 degrees per side dull (34-40 inclusive, sometimes 50), so very dangerous to use, no matter how well it shaves. An edge that looks "factory" is often the worst thing you can have on a knife...

Gaston
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So the factory edge on a CRK is the worst thing you can have on a knife....??? Maintaining that factory edge is the worst thing you can have on a CRK.....??? Comical to say the least.

These systems work so so for the flat edge of the blade, but when you hit the belly to point area, they keep taking metal from the shoulder to compensate for their lack of contour. There are tons of pics of sharpening jobs showing this. So now you have a sebenza with the blade sharpened 1/8" in that belly to point area. WAY too much metal removed. Could show you many pics of what I am talking about but photobucket is being a pain in the but lately.

Do a google search of " sebenza edge pro edges " then click images and you will see what I mean. Belly to point area is completely ruined. Try telling me these butcher jobs is better than the factory edge....????
 
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As long as you bring two parts of the edge together to form a nice apex no matter what you use enjoy your knife.

With regards to the below though.

TripleF100 said:
My freehand sharpening has been honed with probably 30 years of practice and still sucks!! I use a Sharpmaker now but am considering upgrading but now all my EDC carrying is only CRK so if I'm going to make a change I want to be sure I'm doing the best thing for my CRK knives.
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I would ask what stones do you have? Buying a good quality extra-coarse stone, spending the time on it to bring the apex together and then use the other stones as mere refinement can be greatly beneficial.

Finally, yes, you can easily convex an edge with freehand.
 
To me an edge that looks like a factory edge means it is at least 17-20 degrees per side dull (34-40 inclusive, sometimes 50), so very dangerous to use, no matter how well it shaves. An edge that looks "factory" is often the worst thing you can have on a knife...
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First off I'm lurking here and have no business talking about a Sebenza because I have never held one let alone sharpened one.
BUT
What you have said about factory edges is so bloody true I can not just sit here silent.

As far as the Edge Pro, and factory edges and freehand sharpening :
I can get hair whittling by hand on stones without stropping.
I have diamond plates piled here.
I have super nice Shapton stones and before that a full set of Nortons piled over there.
One of the very best factory edges I have ever experienced was on my Spyderco Dragonfly ZPD-189

At work twenty five years ago I had set up a box knife strop station with the best yellow stropping abrasive a rough side out strop quite long on a one by two wood board hanging on a nail . When the box knife started to be a little dull we would strop it on the spot.

My points are :

The edge on the dragon fly had been sharpened once on the Edge pro. As I do from time to time I began to whittle my finger nails into some kind of civilized shape with my knife because I am too lazy / comfortable on the couch to get up and get nail clippers (OK you got me . . . I would rather just play with one of my knives). I just could not believe how much better the Edge Pro edge profile cut through my nails, how much control I had over hand sharpened hair whittling edges that I had been using previously and rather than taking a whole lot of little chips and having the nail start to tear some times rather than be cut the Edge Pro edge was just a whole order of magnitude better (more material removed per pass and more control).

IT WAS AN EYE OPENER
All I expected from the sharpening jig was to acheive the same level of sharpness that I had been getting by hand but with less time and concentration and less stone wear and blade wear.

Factory edges and Especially convex edges can go take a flying F in a rolling donut.

As far as the stropped box knife edges they were OK but were improved by using a stone to get the edge geometry thinned out. The stropping alone, at least on a soft strop was not enough to keep the area behind the edge from becoming too bulbous.

I say try it both ways; you can always go back to the factory "edge".

(if you loose your mind)
 
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marthinus said:
As long as you bring two parts of the edge together to form a nice apex no matter what you use enjoy your knife.
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Technically speaking, one could bring two parts of the edge together to form a nice apex, achieve an inclusive bevel angle that is far too high or low, and/or overheat the blade to the point of tempering it....so while I agree that there are many ways to do it right, some caution needs to be advised.

I agree though, it is often overly complicated, but occasionally, it is trivialized to the point that we see some pretty jacked up knives (most often shipped in for repair rather than posted directly for people to cringe over).
 
IMHO the sebenza does not have a convex edge. It has convex character due to the final edge being put on with a belt; but is not convex enough to be a true convex edge. That's why you can readily sharpen it with a Sharpmaker. If you want a convex edge, use sandpaper on a soft surface. I have a Don Hanson custom with a convex edge, that's how he told me to do it and it works well. I use different grits of sand paper on a small pad of paper or cardboard.

For my sebenza I use the Sharpmaker. I needed a little bit of work to get the factory edge ground to the same angle, but not much. Works great for me. I have a polished blade and don't want to use stones or sandpaper due to the risk of an errant scratch. I do however occasionally do touch ups with sandpaper to give it some convex character.

I too tried out the WorkSharp at Cabelas, not very impressed. The ability to severely goober up a knife quickly was more impressive than the edge it gave. Don't use it if you drink and sharpen :) For the knife I tried on the WorkSharp, it lowered the quality of the edge I had originally put on in it.
 


We'll why don't you looky here...a Wicked Edge sharpened Sebenza that's not ruined. An even bevel from heel to tip? JAYZUS, heresy I tell you! I'll keep my V edge over the dull 45 degree inclusive convexish thing, thanks. At least it's shiny?
 
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