Security Concerns?

[Kevin Jones]

There are obvious security concerns in listing any information on the internet these days.

We have had potential CKCA members ask questions concerning security in regard to, among other things, distribution of member contact information and exposure of their collections.

I myself have toiled over the exposure I allow my modest collection over the internet waves, however after weighting the pros/cons have decided that the benefits of opening my collection to the world in gaining new interest and promotion of the custom knife industry out weigh the risk. I don’t think anyone will disagree that showing a potential new collector a photo of a beautiful custom knife is more impactful that telling them about the knife in your safe.
Now I’m able to provide a very secure environment for my collection which is certainly a factor in my decision, and I’m in no way condemning other collectors for keeping their knives private.

So as not to surprise anyone, I (as usual) have some questions for consideration:

• How big a risk do you consider sharing photos of your knives via web/photo sites?

• How about the risk of taking your knives to shows to share with fellow enthusiast and/or to be photographed?

• Makers, I assume you have security concerns as well in transporting, storing knives at home and at shows and advertising your knives on the internet?

• How do you feel about displaying your knives in your homes as opposed to being locked away in a safe or even in a bank safety deposit box?

• Even though insured, (by the way, the CKCA has a discount program for members with CIS/formally CIA) how concerned are you in shipping your knives in that many are one of a kinds that in most cases can’t easily be replaced?

• I do feel one thing the custom knife community has going for it is the fact that we are a close-nit community so stolen knives are hard to re-sell. Agree?

• The CKCA doesn’t allow “screen names” (except for extreme and very limited circumstances), on our forum. How do you feel about that?

As always, thank you in advance for your opinions, views and participation.

 

[Kevin Jones]

Not much participation?

Perhaps there's a "Security Concern" with discussing "Security Concerns"

 

[bandaidman]

i remain "anonymous" by choice. not out of security concerns but privacy

you can discover a lot on the internet. in less than 10 minutes of free searching i could find the address and home value of someone involved in the website, the addresses of several of the principals and the published salary of another committee member.

 

[peterinct]

I think the biggest risk threatening collections is getting them elsewhere whether by airline or shipping.

I still haven't heard of a happy ending to the knives that went missing on a trip Ken Onion took on one of the airlines.

I have also read on the Internet of various instances of knives getting lost in transit by USPS, UPS, FedEx etc.

I think if you have a secure place at your residence, showing pictures of your collection here or elswhere on the Internet would be of minimal risk.

Just my opinion,
Peter

 

[Ben B]

I'm with bandaidman on this one.

For me, having to use a full name instead of a screen name is more about privacy than security. Everyone has their own threshold for privacy. But with the internet, you can find out a tremendous amount of information on a person with just their full name (unless you have a common name like Kevin Jones!).

Here's just one of many examples: Employers are routinely doing internet searches on new employees. If a prospective employer finds 1000 posts by me on knives, will it affect my chance at the job? Maybe.

Security is a concern, but the risk seems smaller to me. Still, I would not post my full name and then proceed to tell the internet world about my fabulous gold collection or join a discussion about safes for collecting and explain where I keep it in my house. People do that because they think they are anonymous. And if they use a screen name, they are for the most part.

 

[ryan9977]

kevin....i hav recently been thinking about security for my knives....i might not have the total value that big tier collectors have but many would be near impossible to replace at this point and alot would cost more than double what i paid.....i have most of my knives displayed in my office .......do i want them locked up in a safe?......i won't enjoy them as much......i have not sent some of my knives for photography for fear of them being lost or stolen.....that has affected me the most i would say......i'd love to have professional photos of some ......i don't share too much personal info about myself.....i like to be private for the most part in my life......i don't share alot of photos for the simple reason i don't get them professionally photographed and the types of knives i collect don't recieve much interest here.....one note about your organization....i did fnd it unusual that you don't allow screen names.....ryan

 

[RogerP]

Not much participation?

Dude, your post had been up for, like, an hour and Fridays are always a bit slower here.

• How big a risk do you consider sharing photos of your knives via web/photo sites?

I have shown just about every knife I have bought. I don't consider it a huge risk - though I understand there is some risk.

• How about the risk of taking your knives to shows to share with fellow enthusiast and/or to be photographed?

Travelling across international borders with knives is something I try to avoid. But I always take a couple to the local CKG show to pass around and have never had the slightest cause for concern.

• How do you feel about displaying your knives in your homes as opposed to being locked away in a safe or even in a bank safety deposit box?

Only one on display at any given time, and that was the result of lengthy spousal negotiation. Don't ask. Murray displays as many knives as he can find space for - much to my enjoyment when I go visit.

• Even though insured, (by the way, the CKCA has a discount program for members with CIS/formally CIA) how concerned are you in shipping your knives in that many are one of a kinds that in most cases can’t easily be replaced?

Freaks me out every time I have a knife in transit, even though I have only ever had two knives utterly fail to get to me.

• I do feel one thing the custom knife community has going for it is the fact that we are a close-nit community so stolen knives are hard to re-sell. Agree?

It helps, but it's no guarantee.

• The CKCA doesn’t allow “screen names” (except for extreme and very limited circumstances), on our forum. How do you feel about that?

I vastly prefer the use of actual names. Anonymity is perhaps the single greatest cause of most forum BS.

 

[Kevin Jones]

I'm with bandaidman on this one.

For me, having to use a full name instead of a screen name is more about privacy than security. Everyone has their own threshold for privacy. But with the internet, you can find out a tremendous amount of information on a person with just their full name (unless you have a common name like Kevin Jones!). I assure you that even I had an obscure name I would most certainly use it.

Here's just one of many examples: Employers are routinely doing internet searches on new employees. If a prospective employer finds 1000 posts by me on knives, will it affect my chance at the job? Maybe. If an employer would not hire be solely because of my 1000 post regarding a hobby I enjoy outside of work, then IMO, I would rather not be employed by them.

Security is a concern, but the risk seems smaller to me. Still, I would not post my full name and then proceed to tell the internet world about my fabulous gold collection or join a discussion about safes for collecting and explain where I keep it in my house. People do that because they think they are anonymous. And if they use a screen name, they are for the most part.

It goes back to your initial statement as to the individual's threshold for privacy and how much you are will to give up to reduce risk. I for one am not going to hide my identify and store my collection in a bank's vault to have to schedule when I can enjoy it. There's no right answer, just individual preference. Though if no one showed, spoke of or shared photos of their knives the custom knife community would not be where it is today. Would this custom's forum be affected if all those who post our knives just stopped?

 

[RogerP]

. Though if no one showed, spoke of or shared photos of their knives the custom knife community would not be where it is today. Would this custom's forum be affected if all those who post our knives just stopped?

Amen.

Roger

 

[Kevin Jones]

Dude, your post had been up for, like, an hour and Fridays are always a bit slower here.

I just sieged an opportunity to be funny; I thought.

kevin....i hav recently been thinking about security for my knives....i might not have the total value that big tier collectors have but many would be near impossible to replace at this point and alot would cost more than double what i paid.....i have most of my knives displayed in my office .......do i want them locked up in a safe?......i won't enjoy them as much......i have not sent some of my knives for photography for fear of them being lost or stolen.....that has affected me the most i would say......i'd love to have professional photos of some ......i don't share too much personal info about myself.....i like to be private for the most part in my life......i don't share alot of photos for the simple reason i don't get them professionally photographed and the types of knives i collect don't recieve much interest here.....one note about your organization....i did fnd it unusual that you don't allow screen names.....ryan

ryan, we want to promote a close nit and freindly forum/association where everyone is known by their real names and as Roger said above, to eliminate the forum BS, rudeness and belligerence which can be associated at times with screen names. I will not be surprised if we never have to have a moderator step in. I even behave myself on there.

 

[ryan9977]

kevin...i guess i can see how that might elimainate some of the "bs" from a forum.....i'd like to hear what some makers thoughts are on security.....ryan

 

[Joss]

• How big a risk do you consider sharing photos of your knives via web/photo sites?

Generally, not very big - the question is, however big the risk is, is it worh taking?

• How about the risk of taking your knives to shows to share with fellow enthusiast and/or to be photographed?

Bigger. Anything involving packing a high value knife in a suitcase scares me quite a bit.

• How do you feel about displaying your knives in your homes as opposed to being locked away in a safe or even in a bank safety deposit box?

I don't get any pleasure from knives I don't display - or not much. I have a couple small folders in the bank, but generally I display almot everything I have.

• Even though insured, (by the way, the CKCA has a discount program for members with CIS/formally CIA) how concerned are you in shipping your knives in that many are one of a kinds that in most cases can’t easily be replaced?

Somewhat, but shipping within the US is very safe - registered is so safe that you can use it for gold bullion (of course, packing for registered is a PITA, but even other methods are reasonably safe). International shipping is a completely different ballgame.

• I do feel one thing the custom knife community has going for it is the fact that we are a close-nit community so stolen knives are hard to re-sell. Agree?

Yes, for what it's worth.

• The CKCA doesn’t allow “screen names” (except for extreme and very limited circumstances), on our forum. How do you feel about that?

Pretty good.

 

[ddd]

Kevin,

Don't you think that I somewhat broke the "Privacy/security" taboo when
I convinced some of the major Western custom knife collectors to display
the highlights of their collections and much about themselves too in my
book "The Great Collections"?

To tell the whole truth, many of them did need a little push to have them
display their knives under their own names (with a nice portrait too)...

All the best,
David Darom (ddd)

 

[Joss]

If an employer would not hire be solely because of my 1000 post regarding a hobby I enjoy outside of work, then IMO, I would rather not be employed by them.

That's not very realistic or maybe thought through. A great company can have one lousy HR person - most great companies have several... Most great companies have a few jerks. That doesn't mean they're not worth working for (not to mention the things company have to do for liability reasons, whether or not they believe in it. Can you imagine the headlines? "Company X hires known knife fanatic; kills 12 co-workers with a rusted victorinox." )

 

[Kevin Jones]

Kevin,

Don't you think that I somewhat broke the "Privacy/security" taboo when
I convinced some of the major Western custom knife collectors to display
the highlights of their collections and much about themselves too in my
book "The Great Collections"?

To tell the whole truth, many of them did need a little push to have them
display their knives under their own names (with a nice portrait too)...

All the best,
David Darom (ddd)

No doubt David. And the custom knife industry has benefited immensely by your efforts and the collectors that agreed to share with the knife world.

And their choice is not insignificant, as not only are collections at risk but possibly collector and family by these valuable collections becoming common knowledge.

 

[Kohai999]

• How big a risk do you consider sharing photos of your knives via web/photo sites?.

I don't like doing it, for a variety of reasons, the biggest being that it is nobody's business EXACTLY what I have....so there is the somewhat antisocial aspect, and then there is the unknown aspect, which simply makes me uncomfortable.

• How about the risk of taking your knives to shows to share with fellow enthusiast and/or to be photographed?

I don't FLY with stuff to shows that I would be seriously troubled by losing....which is not to say that the $$ amounts are insignificant...but usually the knives are replaceable. If it needs photographing...I'll ship it, or drive it.

• How do you feel about displaying your knives in your homes as opposed to being locked away in a safe or even in a bank safety deposit box?

It is all pretty much locked away, except the swords, which are easy access....for a variety of reasons.

• Even though insured, (by the way, the CKCA has a discount program for members with CIS/formally CIA) how concerned are you in shipping your knives in that many are one of a kinds that in most cases can’t easily be replaced?

I don't ship one-of-a-kinds, or valued pieces by deceased makers.

• I do feel one thing the custom knife community has going for it is the fact that we are a close-nit community so stolen knives are hard to re-sell. Agree?

Maybe...not sure yet.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson

 

[jdm61]

In my case, it doesn't matter whether I use a screen name like on here, KN or BB, my real name like on CKCA or my little bidness name like on Jerzee Devil. If you want to know who I am, you juct have to click on my link. I don't worry so much about posting pics, particularly of my own stuff, because the benefits as far as reaching potential customers FAR outweigh any security concerns. Now if I have $500,000 worth of Loveless and Moran knives stuffed into a duffel bag that I left sitting in my den while I was out of town, that might be a different story

 

[2knife]

Interesting thoughts. I don't have much to add.. i wonder how much of a problem theft is...

What about security at shows, particularly Blade:

What would prevent anyone (thieves) from scouring the tables at the opportune times, taking strategic chances to steal high profile "target" knives?

As has been announced, this sort of thing happened this past Blade, one of Ed Fowler's fighters, on Sunday.

I still have not heard of any deterrents, or measures taken to prevent this kind of thing- except just eyeballing your table.

Can you imagine the Las Vegas casinos, or any "convenient store" with the same security?

One story i recall, and now i have forgotten his name.. About 6 or 10 yrs ago i was visiting the Tarheel Cutlery Club show in Winston Salem, Nc and did not find a dealer i had met the previous year's show, he was an older gentleman who dealt mostly in Randalls - at least it appeared that way from his table. He had told me some great stories abut his WW2 experiences, driving around on Okanawa on a motorbike he had picked up..

When i asked another dealer, not finding him the following year , he said No, that this man was murdered, and there was a homicide investigation ongoing, possibly in connection w/ his knives.

Kind of a scary thought. I never found out if anyone was convicted/caught in this case... but just remembered seeing some high dollar tenite Vietnam era Randalls on his table.. and thinking, how could anyone murder this guy? ..he was a blast.

anyway, sorry to go on .. ..Just made me remember.
David

 

[Ben B]

Though if no one showed, spoke of or shared photos of their knives the custom knife community would not be where it is today. Would this custom's forum be affected if all those who post our knives just stopped?

Amen.

Roger

Of course if most of the people stopped posting due to the fact that they were forced to step out of their privacy comfort zone, there would be no online collecting community either.

I think you have to ask yourself if forums like these work because of the ability to have screen names.

Dealers or makers is a different story, of course. They are in business.

As far as the BS goes, you get some from people who use their real names as well as people who hide behind a screen name. Moderation is the key in more ways than one. The site/moderators set the tone for the discussion.

 

[Marcel54]

• How big a risk do you consider sharing photos of your knives via web/photo sites?

No risk at all ..... it's my choice what I share with the rest of the world

• How about the risk of taking your knives to shows to share with fellow enthusiast and/or to be photographed?

Until now I never did that

• How do you feel about displaying your knives in your homes as opposed to being locked away in a safe or even in a bank safety deposit box?

If I couldn't display them in my home the fun in collecting would be zero

• Even though insured, (by the way, the CKCA has a discount program for members with CIS/formally CIA) how concerned are you in shipping your knives in that many are one of a kinds that in most cases can’t easily be replaced?

Don't get me started on this one :grumpy::barf:

• The CKCA doesn’t allow “screen names” (except for extreme and very limited circumstances), on our forum. How do you feel about that?

I agree on that one. I prefer to know whom I'm talking to

Marcel