Serrated vs. Plain Edge

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Mar 23, 2000
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In several of the previous posts, comments relative to plain vs. serrated blades arose. I thought I would address it in a thread unto itself.

I understand that the average BladeForumite is a knife nut...as am I. But the average user on the street is not a major knife nut like us and has different requirements. Marketing research by a variety of knife manufacturing companies and knife distributors is very clear that a combination edge noticeably outsells a straight edge. SOG listens to the consumers and have made the combination edge that is being demanded by the majority of the users.

Why not carry both? Cost. In some cases we have, but only where we can make a profit. We have discontinued some straight edge models where we have manufactured both, because the straight edged model just did not sell. It might sound like an easy thing to just make a few straight edged models and add them to the SOG line, but there are many costs associated with such a decision. There is just not enough of us "straight edge only" people in the world to support manufacturing, stocking, marketing, and distributing these models.

We have been discussing a special order option for people who have specific needs (serrations, coatings, handles, etc.). But cost, again, becomes a concern. It is very likely that we would loose money on special orders, or raising the price to make a modest profit would turn away the prospective buyer. But this option might allow certain knife enthusiasts to receive exactly what they want.

These are tough decisions which every manufacturer must make and no manufacturer takes lightly. Please understand that we really do want to meet the needs/desires of every knife buyer. But should it be done at a liability to SOG? I really hope you can understand.

Ron@SOG


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Website: www.sogknives.com
Email: ron@sogknives.com
 
I understand that you have to make what you can sell, but I an left-handed and serrations are worse than usless for me.I came close to buying a tsunami also but I can't deal with serrations, so I know what I am buying.

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The thorn stands to defend the Rose, yet it is peaceful and does not seek conflict
 
There is no doubt that combo edges outsell plain edges but only by about 30% in our experience.

Since a plain edge is the same knife as a combo but without one process, it seems to me the majority of costs involved would be related to inventorying and managing one more SKU. It wouldn't have anything to do with design, development or manufacturing would it?

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Fred
Knife Outlet
http://www.knifeoutlet.com
 
I'll try to justify why I do not like combo edges, especially in configuration when relatively long blade (for ex. like Recondo) has 1-inch long serration in the rear part, near the heel:
1. This is not too sensible from cutting standpoint. When I'm cutting for ex. thick rope (Geez, seems Americans cut ropes in really impressive quantities! I do not remember when I really had to cut something what could be assumed like "thick rope", last years I do it for edge retention tests only
wink.gif
) I'm doing this naturally from heel to tip, right? Well, it is no problem to cut with plain edge until the blade doesn't go noticeable deep into cut material, just then it starts to slide on cut material without (or almost without) cutting. At this point serration could improve cutting but where it is? It is near the heel where the blade cuts reasonably well without any serration.
2. If I need to do something gentle and accurate with my knife (for ex. to sharpen pencil) I do it with blade part near the heel. But here is serration designed for powerful cutting rather then for precise one.
3. One or so inches of serration are really to little to improve cutting power noticeable.
I could mention more reasons but I don't want to bore anyone deadly
smile.gif
Think so far it would be enough.

On the other hand I do not deny serration usefulness at all. If I would be in situation when I don't care on cutting precision but my life depends on cutting speed - I would considerable like fully (but no way partially!) serrated blade. Something like guns: I like my duty Glock-19 accuracy but sometimes I need my Mossberg 500 power.

However cutting ropes (wow, again ropes!) take a decent plain edged flat ground blade (for ex. like NW Ranger but without serration) and you will obtain much better results than using partially serrated hollow ground edge.

So my proposition would be to limit to plain edges and fully serrated ones. And these fully serrated ones I would limit to flat ground blades only, then serration will really work. Combo edge, especially on hollow ground balde is something like saw-shovel, it saws worse than true saw and digs worse than true shovel.

As to costs, I do not know is it an issue in this case: to do not make serration on plain edge could reduce costs but I really do not know how it could increase them
confused.gif


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Sergiusz Mitin
gunwriter
Lodz, Poland
 
That's funny, we sell plain edge 3 to 1 over part serrated. must have a different customer base.

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Visit john@cumberlandknives.com

<A HREF="http://www.cumberland-knives.com" TARGET=_blank>www.cumberland-knives.com
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for all your knife needs.
 
Hi Everyone,

Thanks for your input. I talked around SOG today to get a better understanding of this issue. It is not necessarily the cost of manufacturing, but rather the associated costs; like inventory (and other) issues.

But most importantly is: how many dealers will stock all the models? If the majority of buyers want a partially serrated blade, and the dealer can only carry one of the models, then they will stock what they feel they will sell. Take for example one of our top sellers: The AutoClip. We currently have eight versions of that knife blade (not counting handle colors…soon to be sixteen with the addition of the X-42 AutoClips). That would be two sizes, each with plain and serrated blades, and with all of them with the option of black TiNi coatings. I have been in many, many SOG dealer's stores, and I can say that if they carried the AutoClip, they certainly did not carry all eight versions. More realistically, they carried only two. The AutoClip is popular enough for SOG that we can carry such a variety. But thinking back to last year, we discontinued the straight-bladed version of the MagnaDot because dealers were not stocking them both.

In extreme function, many of you are right in your opinions. I'm not trying to say you are wrong. But to the average user on the street (which makes up the majority of SOG buyers), they are requesting one knife to have both cutting applications available. Its a hard business decision to know that some people will not be pleased, but fiscally, it makes sense.

Hope you understand. By the way, I had more conversations today about the possibility of offering knives with custom requests (such as a certain knife without serrations). So for the diehards, they might be able to get something closer to what they want.

Ron@SOG


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Website: www.sogknives.com
Email: ron@sogknives.com
 
I guess that internet knife buyers are more sophisticated (favoring straight edges) than the average OTC customer. There are still a lot of small cutlery shops in the malls that service a lot of customers.
 
No, we're 100% internet and we sell more combo edges. It isn't overwhelming. It's about 30% more than plain edges.

The reason, I assume, is fashion. Certainly combo edges are harder to sharpen and hold no advantage over a sharp plain edge. I guess they are just "cool" or viewed incorrectly by many as having some performance advantage over a plain edge. Interestingly, last year the mix was 20% in favor of plain edges so there has been a shift in the past year.

Ron, I still don't buy the argument. There isn't a very compelling reason to fail to offer each combo model in straight edge. You'd do better to expand the options for the best selling models and drop some slower selling models if inventory holding costs and dealer shelf space are problems. I think the Vision, as an example, would be a good seller in plain edge. Take care.


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Fred
Knife Outlet
http://www.knifeoutlet.com
 
I totally agree about the Vision. I could sell a crap load of plain edge versions.

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Visit john@cumberlandknives.com

<A HREF="http://www.cumberland-knives.com" TARGET=_blank>www.cumberland-knives.com
</A>
for all your knife needs.
 
Hi Everyone,

Thanks for all your comments. We certainly are not closing the door on straight edged versions of our knives. With our past record of less than great sales of straight-edged version knives, we will cautiously venture there when we feel it beneficial.

Ron@SOG

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Website: www.sogknives.com
Email: ron@sogknives.com
 
Ron, Thanks for referring me to this tread. This just shows me more that there are lots of people who agree with me. Like I said before I would have bourght more SOG products if they came plainedged. I really like the design of the NW Ranger, the JetEdge, Tsunami, Vision. These I feel are more higher end and people who can afford these knives don't always want a parr serrated edge. And I think if SOG offered it on a regular basis they will see that people who want plain edge will seek it out. No matter what. I just refuse to but the damm thing. I hope you understand. Thank you and take care.

Liong

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Follow The Path of Fantasies.
 
The things that make SOG Night Vision attractive to me are the knife profile and the advertised strong ArcLock. With the plane edge version of Night Vision, the more that I like to buy this knife.

2d_edge
AKTI Member # A001059
My Knives Photos

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