Sharpening a #15

[Peregrin]

I have Lansky and KME guided rod sharpening systems. Neither one allows me to sharpen small narrow blades to the acute angle I'd prefer. I finally purchased a Worksharp Elite abrasive belt sharpener. I was nervous about using it on some of my more expensive knives, but after practicing on old knives and kitchen knives I can confidently sharpen anything I own with good results.
Following up with a loaded leather hone gives excellent results.

 

[btb01]

This has been an interesting discussion. I’ve been curious about these guided/clamp-type sharpeners, but I’ve also had some reservations, some of which have been confirmed here.

Most of the knives that I carry, use and sharpen are traditional folders, none of which have large blades (at least compared to most modern folders). For several years now, my go-to sharpening setup has been hand-sharpening on two DMT Dia-Sharp continuous surface diamond “stones” in FINE and EXTRA-FINE (I believe those are something like 600 and 1200 grit, respectively). Works pretty well for me, at least for my traditional knives.

(I’ll sharpen a modern folder, or say a modern-traditional with a more modern blade steel, every now and then on the same setup, but I will say that I’m not as confident with those, and have wondered if some sort of guided system might work better for me. But I sharpen those kinds of knives so infrequently that I don’t know if it’s worth the investment.)

I have Lansky and KME guided rod sharpening systems. Neither one allows me to sharpen small narrow blades to the acute angle I'd prefer. I finally purchased a Worksharp Elite abrasive belt sharpener. I was nervous about using it on some of my more expensive knives, but after practicing on old knives and kitchen knives I can confidently sharpen anything I own with good results.
Following up with a loaded leather hone gives excellent results.

I think paulhilborn uses that same system, or one similar to it. I would definitely feel a bit hesitant trying out powered belt sharpening for the first time!

 

[birdsbeaks]

I don't want to answer for yablanowitz , but I'd guess skill.

Want to explain how that works?

IME, skill alone isn't gonna do it. I've used the unpolished edge of car windows, the unglazed bottom of coffee mugs, guided sharpeners, Arkansas stones, ceramic rods, pucks, mouse pads, all sorts of things. They all took some kind of skill to use but I've never sharpened anything with skill alone. My step-grandfather was a tool sharpener in Toledo, Spain when he was exiled for opposing Franco's regime. He had oodles of skill, but still needed a bench stone to sharpen hardened steel tools.

I thought it was pretty clear that I was asking what manner of sharpening system or implement the gentleman employed. Maybe not.

 

[yablanowitz]

I'm pretty sure kamagong was referring to my use of learned skill instead of guided systems. Yes, I've been sharpening freehand for over half a century. These days, 90% of my sharpening is done on DMT Diafold diamond hones. I carry a pair in my back pocket all the time, one X Coarse/Coarse, one Fine/X Fine.

 

[birdsbeaks]

I'm pretty sure kamagong was referring to my use of learned skill instead of guided systems. Yes, I've been sharpening freehand for over half a century. These days, 90% of my sharpening is done on DMT Diafold diamond hones. I carry a pair in my back pocket all the time, one X Coarse/Coarse, one Fine/X Fine.

Thanks, I'll have to look into those. I've also been sharpening freehand for quite some time and am always in the market for a portable option. Skill is great, but IME, you also generally need some form of abrasive.

 

[Will Power]

Interesting & useful thread. I have a simple DMT diamond angled system which I have found very useful over many years especially for Queen's D2 blades. However, small blades do cause problems due to lack of width so that the clamp may touch the stone not the blade. I use some plastic as a shim to give the blade more width thus clearing the problem and it's satisfactory. Tiny Pen blades don't need to be ultra in my book anyway & sometimes a diamond stick is good enough as an alternative.

Of course, some people have the eye and the dexterity for sharpening on a stone but I believe it's a skill you have or don't and most don't have it. That's why guided/angled systems are very useful. You only have to look at some vintage (wrecks..) knives to see the haphazard effect of bad hand sharpening - not all the old timers in the alleged good old days had these skills either then they moved on to using power tools- feel the edge (but look at the steel massacre!)

 

[dantzk8]

Of course, some people have the eye and the dexterity for sharpening on a stone but I believe it's a skill you have or don't and most don't have it.

It only takes between 10 and 20 years depending on your manual sensitivity, to learn how to properly sharpen a knife freehand. This therefore requires patience and the ability to withstand some frustrations. Useful things which are the only skills you really need.

Dan.

 

[yablanowitz]

Those old timers viewed knives as tools to be used up and replaced as needed, not as art or jewelry to be preserved forever.

 

[Obsessed with Edges]

Interesting & useful thread. I have a simple DMT diamond angled system which I have found very useful over many years especially for Queen's D2 blades. However, small blades do cause problems due to lack of width so that the clamp may touch the stone not the blade. I use some plastic as a shim to give the blade more width thus clearing the problem and it's satisfactory. Tiny Pen blades don't need to be ultra in my book anyway & sometimes a diamond stick is good enough as an alternative.

Of course, some people have the eye and the dexterity for sharpening on a stone but I believe it's a skill you have or don't and most don't have it. That's why guided/angled systems are very useful. You only have to look at some vintage (wrecks..) knives to see the haphazard effect of bad hand sharpening - not all the old timers in the alleged good old days had these skills either then they moved on to using power tools- feel the edge (but look at the steel massacre!)

I've also used a shim in a similar manner with a DMT Aligner clamp. Depending on the blade's width and how much of the clamp's jaws remain in contact, it can work pretty well. Very narrow blades might not have enough room for shimming if the shim pushes the blade beyond the clamp's ability to hold it securely. I used a section of zip-tie to extend the edge of a SAK's main spear blade further beyond the edge of the clamp's jaws, in the example pictured below.

 

[Will Power]

It only takes between 10 and 20 years depending on your manual sensitivity, to learn how to properly sharpen a knife freehand. This therefore requires patience and the ability to withstand some frustrations. Useful things which are the only skills you really need.

Dan.

And in the meantime, many knives get wrecked No, I'm afraid it's like a lot of other skills artistic included, you have it or you don't. Of course those with it can refine & improve but consider how most people are at playing instruments- doesn't stop them unfortunately

Thanks, Will

 

[Will Power]

Those old timers viewed knives as tools to be used up and replaced as needed, not as art or jewelry to be preserved forever.

So by following that 'logic' there would be no vintage knives to hand down to people or to consider as interesting historical artefacts either . Such 'old timers' viewing knives merely as tools would not have been interested in patterns, just what they can afford to cut with- box-cutter attitude and I can tell you that the contemporary equivalent would be for either the cheapest available Modern, disdain for 'dated' things or simply the box-cutter.

Knife connoisseurs have always existed, otherwise there would be no call for the variety or plethora of patterns & scales that have evolved in Traditional knives & in other genres., plus the skills of cutlers & artisans. The OP asked a question about contemporary methods of sharpening which I regard as a significant & genuine query, art and jewellery have little to do with it.

 

[Âchillepattada]

Hello my friends,

Peace & love between good will men
My goal was not to revive the war between those who use natural stones and those who need/like more or less complicated tools to sharpen their knives. It was just to find a solution to use a tool which is not free with small knives and not had lost my money in an unappropriated buying .

That said I've made some researches and found three add-ons which could help those who are in my situation so I share and that's, I think, is the function of our Porch.

First you have the Leading edge kit of our friend 777 Edge :

​

You have also this magnetic add-on sold on etsy (I'm not sur it's always available )


And the The Tormek SVM-00 Small Knife :



Described here : https://www.sharpeningsupplies.com/Sharpening-a-Small-Knife-on-a-Guided-Sharpener-W317.aspx

If I find something else I'll add it here.

Have a great weekend .

Â

 

[birdsbeaks]

So by following that 'logic' there would be no vintage knives to hand down to people or to consider as interesting historical artefacts either . Such 'old timers' viewing knives merely as tools would not have been interested in patterns, just what they can afford to cut with- box-cutter attitude and I can tell you that the contemporary equivalent would be for either the cheapest available Modern, disdain for 'dated' things or simply the box-cutter.

Knife connoisseurs have always existed, otherwise there would be no call for the variety or plethora of patterns & scales that have evolved in Traditional knives & in other genres., plus the skills of cutlers & artisans. The OP asked a question about contemporary methods of sharpening which I regard as a significant & genuine query, art and jewellery have little to do with it.

This got me to wondering how many moose king Tut skinned with his alien space dagger, how often he had to sharpen it, and where he positioned it in the clamp.

https://imgur.com/a/Bh8CkkE

 

[dantzk8]

And in the meantime, many knives get wrecked No, I'm afraid it's like a lot of other skills artistic included, you have it or you don't. Of course those with it can refine & improve but consider how most people are at playing instruments- doesn't stop them unfortunately

Thanks, Will

Strange analogy. Do you think that interposing any system between an untalented musician and his instrument could improve the music produced?

When a solution to a problem also poses a problem, as evidenced by Achille's Âchillepattada question, then the solution may not be the right one and the answer to the question can expose an alternative to this solution without being considered irrelevant.
Dan.

 

[Âchillepattada]

By the way , could somebody say me what is the original angle on the edge of GEC blades ?


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[Old Biker]

By the way , could somebody say me what is the original angle on the edge of GEC blades ?


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I only have one GEC knife. The 2021 blade forum's knife. I also have a gritomatic laser goniometer, for measuring edge angles. Since nobody yet has answered your question, I measured the edge angle of my one GEC knife. I am surprised at what I found. On my knife, on one side of the blade the angle was 30 degrees. On the other side of the blade it was 35 degrees. I don't know if that is common for GEC knives, or if my knife is just an odd one. I wouldn't recommend matching those angles when resharpening your knife.

O.B.