Sharpening advice for a newbie

So Richard, the bevels of a wharncliffe blade are two straight planes. The bevels of a skinner (or other blade with lots of belly) are two… curved planes? Meeting at an… arc segment? Or maybe the edge has no uniform radius.

Been a long time since I studied geometry, but I use it every day. I know what I’m thinking of, but don’t always have the correct terms.

Parker
 
Learning how to freehand with bench stones takes maybe 15 minutes to learn. Know what a burr feels like, then turn it over and do the otherr side. A combo stone from Harbor Freight or a Norton India Coarse/Fine will get you started. Don't worry about the angles or perfection of bevels. I have first hand experience a knife with a 22 degree on one side and 18 on the other will cut just fine. To start out, work on getting it sharp.
Once you get the sharp thing down then let your inner OCD and ADHD loose. Oh there are so many things to obsess over. And perfection is just one more tool, stone, emulsion, strop, etc, etc away.
But if you want to make $ or $$ or even $$$, then all that OCD/ADHD has got to go. You have to learn how to crank out edges fast and consistent. That is machines. Belt sander, TruHone, Tormek, etc. where you can give a customer a serviceable edge in 2 or 3 minutes for $5 to $7 dollars. Or if commerical, able to do 100 blades in two or three hours.
Still interested? It will come down to FIRST learning how to do basic burr formation, remove the burr and refine the edge.
 
000Robert said:
I wouldn't let that guy touch my enemy's knife, let alone mine. I don't even let The House of Blades sharpen a knife that I bought from them even though they offer free lifetime sharpening. Nobody is using a pull-through or a dry belt on one of my knives.
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The vast majority give a whit. You have invested the time and effort to lear how.
The customers don't care. All they want is fast and cheap. I can do that for $7-10 in 2 minutes, hand sharpen for $15 in about 10 minutes and hand sharpen with a mirror edge for $50 in 20 minutes.
You are not going to pay regardless. I do a whole lot more at $7 than I do at $50. I would like to see a sharpener, other than someone picking up pocket change, who can consistently charge an appropriate amount doing high end finishes and stay in business.
Beauty scissors being another animal.
 
cudgee said:
I wasn't that smart to be able to learn it in 15 minutes.
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Learning to raise the burr and cut it off was easy. It's the rest of the basics to refine the edge that took so long.
Our ancestors got by pretty good with rocks and stones. Using steels and files is relatively recent in relation to how long civilization has been using steel for blades and the angle and polishing obsession is since the mid to late 20th century.
I believe inherently knowing how to sharpen edges is in our DNA. I have taught several how to freehand, and I can see when the light comes on. Male and female. When they get it it is a look of, "oh, I remember now". I relate it to riding a bicycle. Once you get everything together and balanced, nothing to it. Same way sharpening.
 
Dbigkahunna said:
Learning to raise the burr and cut it off was easy. It's the rest of the basics to refine the edge that took so long.
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IMO it doesn't take long to learn how to give a knife a working edge. But it does take a good while to learn how to give a knife a screaming sharp edge. It comes down to removing a sub-micron burr without damaging the submicron apex.
 
3D Anvil said:
IMO it doesn't take long to learn how to give a knife a working edge. But it does take a good while to learn how to give a knife a screaming sharp edge. It comes down to removing a sub-micron burr without damaging the submicron apex.
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I agree. What I like is someone who says they have tried to freehand but can't. Show them how to raise the burr, let them feel it, do the other side. Hand them the stone and knife and most do it. When they see it cut paper, you see the light come on.
Is it perfect? No. But it cuts. Then show them how to refine it with a fine side or strop and they are hooked. I love teaching young people because they know how to do something few of their peers and adults can do.
When you run into the OCD afflicted and show them a guided angle sharpener, all the gadgets then show them how they work and what they can do, you really see the lights.
 
cudgee said:
Don't give up, the satisfaction you get from putting a sharp edge on your knives is so satisfying. It takes time to master it, with plenty of practice, but it is worth it.
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I can imagine that getting really good or at least the learning process is frustrating and fun. I’ve realized that I will probably not go for any money on my investments but I really think I’ll enjoy the process and of course the satisfaction of being able to put a great edge on my knives. Thanks for the encouragement!
 
Dbigkahunna said:
I agree. What I like is someone who says they have tried to freehand but can't. Show them how to raise the burr, let them feel it, do the other side. Hand them the stone and knife and most do it. When they see it cut paper, you see the light come on.
Is it perfect? No. But it cuts. Then show them how to refine it with a fine side or strop and they are hooked. I love teaching young people because they know how to do something few of their peers and adults can do.
When you run into the OCD afflicted and show them a guided angle sharpener, all the gadgets then show them how they work and what they can do, you really see the lights.
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Honestly, that’s gonna be my goal. I want my 12 year old son to learn with me. I think it’ll be good bonding time and a lifelong skill that we may very well NEED someday. Thanks!!! I’m sure I’ll be asking for more advice as I advance. Now to convince my wife that I need to spend a little money 🙄
 
I think beginners get intermediated before they even start by reading to much information on forms. Keep it simple. No need for throwing a lot of cash at it either.
It's a skill that will follow you and your son for the rest of your lives.

An old butcher knife is a great to learn on. The larger size will help you with holding a more consistent angle and give you a better visual.

 
dvldog5811 said:
Honestly, that’s gonna be my goal. I want my 12 year old son to learn with me. I think it’ll be good bonding time and a lifelong skill that we may very well NEED someday. Thanks!!! I’m sure I’ll be asking for more advice as I advance. Now to convince my wife that I need to spend a little money 🙄
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All you need is a Harbor Freight combo stone to get started. Less than 4 bucks. If you know someone who can show you how to do it, it will cut down on your learning curve. But trust yourself. It is already in you how to do this. You keep at it there will be a "click" and you have it. Your son may get it before you do, bit that's OK. I relate it to learning to ride a bicycle. No one can tell you how to do it, just give you tips. And then, boom, you take off.
Mess up a few blades and you and your son have fun fixing them.
When your wife cuts herself with your newly sharpened knives, try to look real sympathetic instead of proud. And when your son's friends look on him with awe because he can sharpen a knife with a rock, just feel proud.
 
GatorFlash1 said:
There was a guy who back in the 80's invented a safe, easy to use sharpener. He and his wife travelled around the countryside selling it, and his knives, at fairs, gun shows, etc. Here are four educational videos that he made that speak to how to sharpen and what his sharpener looks like and how it works. It does everything a knife owner needs in my humble opinion.
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Great, easy to use sharpener. The only thing that it doesn't do easily is reprofile.
 
It is not to hard too reprofile with the Sharp Maker. Fortunately, most who own one also own decent knives with decent steels that rarely have to be reprofiled.
 
Dbigkahunna said:
All you need is a Harbor Freight combo stone to get started. Less than 4 bucks. If you know someone who can show you how to do it, it will cut down on your learning curve. But trust yourself. It is already in you how to do this. You keep at it there will be a "click" and you have it. Your son may get it before you do, bit that's OK. I relate it to learning to ride a bicycle. No one can tell you how to do it, just give you tips. And then, boom, you take off.
Mess up a few blades and you and your son have fun fixing them.
When your wife cuts herself with your newly sharpened knives, try to look real sympathetic instead of proud. And when your son's friends look on him with awe because he can sharpen a knife with a rock, just feel proud.
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I would go with a Norton Combination stone; I don't like the Harbor Freight stones. They are rather crudely made/bonded IMHO and tend to eat steel (I bought one years ago and immediately stopped after a few strokes on a old folder - That stone is now only used on my machete and axe).

Learning hand sharpening takes a bit of practice (been doing it for 60+ years), but when you get it (short learning curve) you will never need one of those expensive gadgets again.
 
Rich S said:
but when you get it (short learning curve) you will never need one of those expensive gadgets again.
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I'm sure I've paid more in stones than I would have in gadgets or a service.
But I'm also sure my results are better. And in fairness it's because I've tried out many stones.
 
Dbigkahunna said:
I believe inherently knowing how to sharpen edges is in our DNA.
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Maybe- very early on, I mean like the bronze age ... "Genesis 4:22 (NLT) Lamech’s other wife, Zillah, gave birth to a son named Tubal-cain. He became an expert in forging tools of bronze and iron. Tubal-cain had a sister named Naamah."
But you need to practice whatever you want to be good at, in the 80's exercise physiologist thought 3000 repetitions would move what ever specific skill you wanted to automatic and habitual. In the 70's took a job as finish meat cutter, boss spent 5 minutes on the first day, and checked in a few times the first shift orienting me. I had never used anything but a pocket stone, which was all i had, so tri-stone and Case butcher knives were amazing to me.
 
garry3 said:
I think beginners get intermediated before they even start by reading to much information on forms. Keep it simple. No need for throwing a lot of cash at it either.
It's a skill that will follow you and your son for the rest of your lives.

An old butcher knife is a great to learn on. The larger size will help you with holding a more consistent angle and give you a better visual.

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One of my tasks that keeps the Dragon Lady happy when I'm working with my knives is to get her kitchen knives and sharpen them for her. Then I'm a hero for a good couple of months before I have to repeat the process. My Spyderco Sharp Maker makes it very easy to do.
 
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GatorFlash1 said:
One of my tasks that keep the Dragon Lady happy when I'm working with my knives is to get her kitchen knives and sharpen them for her. Then I'm a hero a good for a couple more months before I have to repeat the process. My Spyderco Sharp Maker makes it very easy to do.
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I have my own kitchen knifes because she hates mine. Interestingly there are also her dish towels that I am not allowed to use. Seems there is some kind of an issue with her dish towels and my need to wipe off carbon steel knifes after each use. She likes stainless steel knifes.

BTW it's not me in that video. I'm much older.
 
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