Sharpening question regarding old 440C knives

m.and

m.and

Gold Member
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Jul 8, 2009
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Hello all,

I have a few older Bucks from the 70s that have never been used or sharpened that I would like to carry and use on a daily basis. I have read that 440C, especially the semi hollow grind on the Bucks can be tricky to sharpen. So my question, for those of you who use and resharpen these knives: what is your preferred method of maintaining the edge?

I currently have at my disposal a Spyderco Sharpmaker which works well on the Edge2000 blades, but in a short discussion with David Martin, I have come to realize it may not be ideal for the older 440C blades.

Thanks in advance. I'm looking forward to the responses.

Best,
Matthew
 
I recently sharpened up an old "Solingen Bear Hunter" folding knife with a 440 blade that my wife found laying in the sidewalk and immediately claimed as her own. :thumbup:

The edge was pretty messed up. So I started by hitting it with my belt sander on the slack part of the belt (not the part supported by the platen) to get back to a clean edge. Then I put a convex edge on it using the 'sandpaper + mouse pad' method. I started (I think) with 320 paper, then 400, then 600, followed by stropping. It worked great and that sucker shaves now! :cool:
 
I also like a convex edge on those old 440 c blades,on these models I find it just makes such a great edge that lasts and lasts ,I would compare it to any super steel of today with a good convex edge on it 440 c will really make you wonder why they stopped using it.
 
With those older Buck's in dealing with the semi-hollow grind, you can either go for a 15* edge on your device. Which will cause you to use a coarse stone and eat down the shoulder of the unremoved hollow grind. Another approach is to give it a 19-20* edge and avoid grinding off much of that unremoved steel. The resulting edge bevel will look like a convex edge. Which is the direction edges tend to go through sharpening and stropping anyway. It would be a strong, lasting edge. You would sacrifice some cutting performance to keep it original looking. Your call. DM
 
I am sharpening challenged.
So for me, The Lansky clamp system, works.
I cannot hold a consistent edge freehanding on stones.
Love the old 440
 
I convex sharpened mine after being dissatisfied with the first edge, which I put on with waterstones. I backed up the factory bevel with the first sharpening, but it was still far too obtuse.

I began the convex with pretty coarse paper, and started with the edge not quite down on the paper yet, to hog off material and get down to a better angle. Didn't take very long, perhaps 6 minutes to reset the bevel. Then kept that geometry as I went up through the grits. Finished with a strop. The whole process took maybe 30 minutes.

It now looks great, and compares not unfavorably to my Bark River edge. (Which I also improved from factory.)
 
RAZORBLADES said:
I also like a convex edge on those old 440 c blades,on these models I find it just makes such a great edge that lasts and lasts ,I would compare it to any super steel of today with a good convex edge on it 440 c will really make you wonder why they stopped using it.
Click to expand...
This one and Matt's experience has been mine. This stuff really holds with some good steels of today and repeats & very predictable. I usually take it to a very coarse stone and lay it nearly flat. Raising the spine as little as possible, a finger nail or 1-2 layers of black electric tape on the spine. Then grind away until it reaches the edge. Take it to the next stone and round the top of this bevel w/ the blade nearly flat. Third step, raise the spine to the desired angle 15-16* is fine and start setting the edge bevel. Work up a burr & flip it over. 4th knock off the burr and set that sides bevel. 5th take it to a fine diamond or fine India (whatever grit you want to finish) and work the burr off both sides. I avoid stropping
as I want that grit left on the edge. I've done it this way on a breaking blade of the Empress Trio set and it slices a brisket like a Top grade kitchen knife priced at 75-80$. You can do your 119 or 120 in the same manner. You'll be amazed at how it cuts. This will be a little harder to pull off w/ a sharpening device but brain storm how it works w/ the lowest setting and a x coarse diamond & you'll come out close. Happy sharpening, DM
 
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Matt, I agree w/ your time line too. I used the coarse side of my Norton JUM-3 stone to thin down the convex edge. Flipped the stone over and removed the deep scratches. *Don't skimp on getting a good coarse stone as it's the foundation of a sharpening regiment. The other stones merely refine this stones work. It's the workhorse. DM
 
from David Martin.....

"This is the early 9" slicer/ breaking blade from the Empress Trio set.
It shows how I thinned the edge bevel, even nicking the hollow ground
flats from the knife being flat on the stone. Now it works like a top pattern slicer.
Thanks,
DM"

20180312_081039_1600x1200.jpg
 
When you look at the features of the Empress Trio knives, they are really over the top kitchen knives. 440C blades, stainless guard, penned micarta handles & stored in a walnut box. Just give it a thought-out sharpening and shazzam! And you have a 3 knife set not found today in
kitchen cutlery. Kitchen knives are not offered w/ these features Unless you go custom. DM
 
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My convexed hollow grind on my 112:
tH4hlkN.jpg

You can see how far it backs that bevel up. There's a reason they changed their geometry for better cutting.
 
Matt, you took it to a very high grit and the higher shoulder should give you improved cuttting performance. Good. What did you use on it? DM
 
David Martin said:
Matt, you took it to a very high grit and the higher shoulder should give you improved cuttting performance. Good. What did you use on it? DM
Click to expand...
That's precisely why I did it. The 112 is my favorite woods knife, but my first sharpening on the knife, backing the bevel up just a bit with a stone, left a lot to be desired. My splitting hatchet is more acute.

So I took this one through the same process I did my Bark River. I used the sandpaper I had lying around, which was 220, 400, 600, and 1500, on a leather paddle strop. Then I stropped it as I would normally, black compound, then green compound, then canvas. The edge is really agressive in wood. Still not a knife you'd want to have to slice apples with, but great for what I want.
 
Are you whittling with it? What spelled the difference in success with your 2 methods? One with a stone and the other using sandpaper. Was the sandpaper aluminum oxide or SiC or just more coarse? DM
 
David Martin said:
Are you whittling with it?
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No, it would be a bit thick for that. Just my favorite stainless, robust folding knife for camp tasks, ever since high school. The one I used to use was my dad's, and this one is a vintage one, just like his.
David Martin said:
What spelled the difference in success with your 2 methods? One with a stone and the other using sandpaper.
Click to expand...
Just the much more acute angle. I chose sandpaper for the second sharpening because I wanted a convex edge, and convexing with stones leaves an uneven finish I didn't want.
David Martin said:
Was the sandpaper aluminum oxide or SiC or just more coarse? DM
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It's wet/dry sandpaper, not sure what abrasive they use.
 
Well, the wet/dry will certainly work as I've used that glued to a glass plate. Especially if it was the black SiC grit and it lasts decently. I'll use a good bit of pressure on the coarse grit and lighter on the finer grits. Anyway,
you did a nice job on your 112. Thanks, DM
 
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