Sharpening Tutorials?

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Apr 19, 2012
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I'm nearing the final stage for some knife I've made as Christmas gifts. Looking forward to showing them off, but still trudging through the final post-heat treat sanding (sand paper quality really matters!).

I've looked around and haven't been able to find anything in any detail about putting the final edge on the blade. I have a belt grinder, I have files, and I have sandpaper (soon to have Rhynowet Redline). Do I need to buy a sharpener kit or stones? Any help is appreciated.
 
What type of equipment do you have ?

The answer will vary depending on the answer. Do you have a belt sander, or are you using files? I started with the lansky system and now use dmt stones. If you do get the lansky, make sure you purchase the diamond set.
 
I have a NWG for 2x72 belts. I started out with files but prefer the grinder when possible. These blades are now heat treated 154cm and I think using files would be tedious at best. BTW, the blades started life as Aldo .103/.113 thickness and are all varying widths.
 
There is a video on the front page of USA Knifemaker Supply/it's called hair poppin sharp.
Eddie
 
There are many good sharpening videos and tutorials.....but they all need one thing...a proper edge to start on.

The rule is - You have to have a thin edge to put a sharp edge on.

After HT, sand/grind the bevels again ,taking them to at least 400 grit. You can go to 8000 if you want a mirror finish, but 400 is the minimum for a satin finish.
The edge after the clean-up and finish sanding should be almost to a sharp edge for most knives. For slicers, I like the edge to be about .005" when ready to sharpen. Heavy choppers can be a tad thicker. If the edge is thicker than this, the edge you put on in sharpening will be too wide, and won't cut well. The angle you sharpen at won't affect this. If you see a big sharpened area being made when sharpening the edge, you probably had way too thick an edge pre-sharpening. A properly beveled blade with a hair popping edge has only a tiny sharpened portion.

When someone posts that they have been sharpening for hours, and the edge still isn't hair shaving sharp, I don't even need to see the photos or feel the edge. I can pretty much guarantee that the blade was way too thick at the edge before he started sharpening. A properly prepareded blade will only take a few minutes to make hair popping sharp.

As part of making a knife a good cutter, remember that all the blade metal merely supports the edge. A thick blade will cut slower and seem less sharp than a thin blade. This is because the wider part wedges as the blade cuts, trying to push the material being cut away from the sharp edge. So, make the bevels full flat grinds when possible, and use the thinnest steel needed to withstand the use the knife will get. Only rarely will a knife need a blade over .120" thick, and for fine slicers like fillet blades and kitchen knives, .060-.090" is a great thickness.
 
Like Stacy said, make sure the edge is thin to begin with and sharpening should take about 5 seconds on a belt grinder. I grind all my blades hard to nearly a zero edge. Maybe as thick as a playing card or two. I then put the secondary bevel on with a 600 grit belt, and then strop with a piece of leather nailed to a board, loaded with Flitz.

I don't go through all the steps shown on the USA knifemaker site. Too many grits and belts IMO. Thin edge, a couple passes at 600 grit. Makes the edge fine enough for most tasks, and doesn't remove too much metal. Doesn't dish things out.

Took me alot of years to realize that the only thing I needed to sharpen a knife the way I wanted to was a cheap Harbor freight 1x30, and a couple good quality belts and a loaded strop. I've tried it all too. DMT diamond plates, water stones, lanskys, gatcos, tri-hone, sharpmakers, crock sticks.... all collecting dust now.
 
Took me alot of years to realize that the only thing I needed to sharpen a knife the way I wanted to was a cheap Harbor freight 1x30, and a couple good quality belts and a loaded strop. I've tried it all too. DMT diamond plates, water stones, lanskys, gatcos, tri-hone, sharpmakers, crock sticks.... all collecting dust now.

You should try a leather belt for the 1x30 to strop that edge. It works great and is quick and painless. I got mine from TruGrit
 
You should try a leather belt for the 1x30 to strop that edge. It works great and is quick and painless. I got mine from TruGrit

Everytime I try to order one of those things they are out of stock. Stop buying all the belts Adam! lol. I will check tru grit out. I am in love with my 1x30 for sharpening. I lay mine down and run it horizontally with the small wheel pointed at my chest. I cannot miss with this thing. Sharpening used to make me such a nervous wreck.
 
Took me alot of years to realize that the only thing I needed to sharpen a knife the way I wanted to was a cheap Harbor freight 1x30, and a couple good quality belts and a loaded strop. I've tried it all too. DMT diamond plates, water stones, lanskys, gatcos, tri-hone, sharpmakers, crock sticks.... all collecting dust now.

+1

I've got/had a looot of $$ in sharpening equipment. The 1x30 excells at applying a great (convex) edge. If I want a V bevel I'll go back to my guided systems, but the convex is so repeatable that I haven't found a need. Well, baring high end or nicely finished blades. It's likely just *my* experience, but I've had some finish marring when I want a very acute edge, or if the belt frays at all at the edge (hairs whipping the finish). Likely due to cheap belts.
 
I recommend against using a belt grinder with a leather strop. On most all 1X30 grinders they run far too fast and greatly overheat the edge. It will be sharp as He!!, but it likely will also be greatly over tempered, leading to a shorter edge life between sharpening. If the edge is properly sharpened, it should only take about three strokes per side on a hard leather strop to remove the wire and polish the edge. Over stropping can actually round the edge and make it less sharp.

Just think of it this way. A 1X30 runs at about 2500 SFPM. That means if you strop the blade for 10 seconds, you have done the equivalent of stropping it on a 400 foot long strop.....all the time making the very edge jump up hundreds of degrees ( It can reach over 800F in a second or two according to Roman Landes).

Three to five slow and cool strokes on a 12" strop are more than enough.

Just to be honest, I have a couple leather 2X72 strops. I use them at a dead crawl ( maybe a few FPS, max) on the belt grinder if I am sharpening a large group of knives ( 20-50 knives). each side of the blade gets a one second strop. On smaller batches, and single blades, I only use a board mounted strop.
 
I am separating this from the last post to keep different subjects separate.

Here is how I sharpen a very sharp knife:

First, I take the bevels to 400 grit, sometimes higher. The edge is nearly sharp. All I can see if looked straight down the edge under a strong light is a glint on the flat area. It is about .005" at that point. For reference, a business card is about .010". I finish the bevel sanding usually by giving it a satin finish with a medium or fine Scotch-brite belt. I then draw the edge flat across a piece of 400 grit sandpaper to make sure the edge is smooth, flat, and even. An edge that has been ground on a belt grinder has a tiny "lip" that rolls over from each side ( similar to the wire in sharpening). This can make the edge appear to be thinner than it actually is. It also may wave up and down or side to side a bit. Look closely, with a magnifier hood if you have one, and check that the edge looks like a very thin, flat, straight line. If it gets wider and thinner when examined, the bevels are not evenly ground.
Get the pre-edge right before moving on the actual sharpening!

Now, to make that thin flat into as close as a zero edge as possible*.
I put a new 400 grit belt on the grinder, and slow it down to about 100 SFPM. I use a new belt because a worn belt will build much more friction. It is a common mistake to think a worn belt is good for sharpening, and acts like a finer grit. I just burnishes the steel more, but actually is a coarser belt than a new one. If you want a finer grind, use a finer NEW belt. Some folks use a 600 or 800 grit belt. I would hit it once on the 400 grit belt first if you are going that fine. This will keep the fine belt sharper longer.
I keep the blade moving at all times, and only hit each side once or twice.
I then sight down the blade under a strong light to see if there are any flat spots left. They will show up as glistening areas. I usually already know that they are not there, because I watch the wire form as the blade edge gets ground. If there is a flat spot, there won't be a wire there. If needed, I hit the edge another time or two. If the edge needs more than this, I did not get the edge evenly thinned out in the bevel grinding, and usually go back and touch up the bevel.

Once the edge is ground and there are no visible flat spots, the blade may feel dull if you try to cut with it, or "feel" the edge. Don't let appearances fool you. Under a rolled over microns of steel swarf lies a very sharp edge. A couple stropping strokes down a charged 3" strip of leather glued to a board will remove this "Wire" edge. I charge the strops with a variety of things from red rouge , to Flitz, to 50,000 girt diamond paste ( about 1/2 micron particle size). It somewhat depends on the blade and the steel, but it probably does not really matter...as long as it is a very fine grit compound.
After the stropping, I cut up postcards. I have the luxury of having available a nearly inexhaustible supply of 5X3" heavy stock, glossy flyer cards from the various sales and promotions our store runs. The vendors send them to us in thousands, and we only use 1/2 of what they send. These are just right in hardness and size to do cutting tests on. I make six to eight angular cuts on the card. It should slice cleanly into 1/4" wide strips. If I feel a catch, or a dull spot, I double check the edge with a magnifier hood on. That will tell me if I have a little wire left on or a dull spot I haven't sharpened enough. Dull is a relative term here, as these blade when "dull" will still cut you to the bone. Usually a few more slow strops takes care of the problem. If not, it gets set aside to re-do the edge on the 400 grit belt.

* It is impossible to take a blade edge to a "0" apex. The grain size and carbide size limit this, as well as the nature of the steel grains to pull away in sharpening. How close you get to "0" is a product of the steel type and the HT. The better you sharpen, the closer you come....but you will never get a true zero edge. On most knives, a microscopic serrated edge will cut better and last longer. There are many factors that make a blade cut better under different circumstances. This is an entire subject unto itself, which we will leave for another day. Roman Landes has made his career mainly on this subject alone.
 
Until I work out a better routine this is what I do. After grinding the edge to .010, on a slow moving belt, I do a few passes on each side with a 400 or 600 grit belt to create the micro bevels. Follow that up with a pass or two on each side with an 800 grit belt then create a wire edge with a 9 micron belt. Then I take an old cloth backed belt and turn it inside out and strop lightly with the cloth side. Then turn over a legal pad and take a couple of stropping passes on each side over the cardboard back of the pad. At this point it is pretty darn sharp. I'm going to make a leather strop one of these days though.
 
Thanks for the great info guys. Sounds like I have my work cut out for me, still have a ways to go to get the bevel down to desired thickness. I'm curious for grinding down to my needed edge thickness, is an 80 grit belt on a slower speed too aggressive on a post heat treated blade? I keep a bucket of water next to the grinder and dunk every pass. Or is 120 as low as I should go?
 
I recommend against using a belt grinder with a leather strop. On most all 1X30 grinders they run far too fast and greatly overheat the edge.

If you are "greatly overheat the edge" then that is from bad technique.

Like anything else it works perfectly fine when you do it correctly and field use has born that out.
 
Thanks for the great info guys. Sounds like I have my work cut out for me, still have a ways to go to get the bevel down to desired thickness. I'm curious for grinding down to my needed edge thickness, is an 80 grit belt on a slower speed too aggressive on a post heat treated blade? I keep a bucket of water next to the grinder and dunk every pass. Or is 120 as low as I should go?

I grind everything post HT and I use a 60 grit belt to grind bevels. You can go 36 or 40 grit, but I feel that those scratches are hard for me to clean up, and it's unnecessary on 1/8 steel. 60 grit will get you down real fast with a hard 1/8 piece of steel, and things clean up and get real smooth with one or two passes of a 180 grit belt after you get the bevels in.

36 grit and 60 grit belts are actually better because they cut more aggressively and do not build up as much heat. Using anything finer than these for "hogging" off steel will cause two things to happen. First, the belt isn't aggressive enough to remove the now hardened steel, and secondly, the blade will get very hot very fast.

Keep a 5 gal bucket of cold water handy, and squirt about half a bottle of Dawn into it. It'll keep the steel from flash rusting. This rust is easily removed with a scotchbrite belt, but it's better not to have rust form in the first place.

Keep some sharp new belts and your bucket handy. Use your bare hands to feel the heat in the blade. If the steel gets hot to the touch go ahead and dunk it to keep it cool. Your blade could burn your thumb and boil the water droplets off and still be under the temp it needs to ruin your heat treat. For me, keeping the bucket near just ensures that I have a cool and comfortable piece to work on. If you plan on wearing gloves and using push sticks at the belt grinder you usually run into overheating when grinding hard. You cant gauge whats going on.
 
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