sharpening with sandpaper

Looker,

You could always do away with the edge-forward movement on your knives with sandpaper or at least until you've mastered edge-leading movement. Sometimes, I'll sharpen the edge with a stropping movement and slightly lower the blade so the edge lifts off the paper and do the forward stroke. That way, behind the bevel gets a little thinning while the edge gets sharpened and the sandpaper is spared a laceration.
 
thombrogan said:
Looker,

You could always do away with the edge-forward movement on your knives with sandpaper or at least until you've mastered edge-leading movement. Sometimes, I'll sharpen the edge with a stropping movement and slightly lower the blade so the edge lifts off the paper and do the forward stroke. That way, behind the bevel gets a little thinning while the edge gets sharpened and the sandpaper is spared a laceration.
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Thanks for the suggestion, I'll give it a go.
 
Matchlock said:
Hello everyone;

I've read with great interest all the different methods, ie: stones, ceramic crock-sticks diamond stones etc. with which to sharpen knives and the good things is, they actually all work. The only real difference is the technique you use.

More good knives are ruined by sharpening than by using them incorrectly but a good technique used to sharpen a knife can bring it back from the dead.

Two extremely important factors should be remembered when sharpening a knife. What will the knife edge be used for, and what kind of steel is it made from? The hardness of the edge is very important as well.

A broad, say a 30 degree will give you an edge that while not as sharp as it could be, holds the edge longer, and a narrower say a 25 degree angle gives you the ability to make an edge "razor" sharp, it isn't necessarily as tough as the previous one.

Sharpening a knifes edge is something that takes a little practice but the nice thing is, just about anyone can get a decent edge with a little practice and good technique.

Matchlock.
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Sharpening is simply metal removal, and how you do it is dictated by whats available. Sandpaper works well. My first hair whittling edge came from making little slack belts by cutting 9x11 paper into 1 inch strips, clamping one end to a table and stretching it tight. Went from 220 to 600 grit wet/dry with water. Then went to a 1 x 11 inch strop loaded with white compound. On the paper, I cut in both the edge trailing and edge leading stroke. On the leather, it was just edge trailing. One note of caution. If you want a really thin edge, this method makes for a very wide bevel.

My Delica from Spyderco in VG-10 cuts wire with no noticable damage, with a 17 degree backbevel and 20 degree edge from the Sharpmaker. I have found that thinner edges last longer, until they start getting damaged, so the trick is finding the balance.
 
michdad said:
I am trying to learn on sand paper, am using a wooden cutting board, mouse pad, and glass. Just don't seem to do as well as with other methods.
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When sharpening with a mouse pad, you need to use a really light touch.
Press too hard and the pad pushes up and dulls the edge.

Firm for shaping (convexing the edge bevel) and Light for sharpening.

I hope that helps some.
 
It was off a 220 grit green King waterstone. You're thinking of Tom Krein for the 120, though that does sound like a challenge.
 
It was off a 220 grit green King waterstone. You're thinking of Tom Krein for the 120, though that does sound like a challenge.
 
hi everyone. thanks for watching my video : )

in case anyone cared, i got the microfilm from 'tools for working wood'. i prefer PSA backed film over non-psa film. it stands for 'pressure sensitive adhesive'. i like it because it can get rid of the air bubbles.

i like the granite reference block because it is guaranteed flat within 3 microns. i got it from japan wood worker, but any local woodworking shop will carry it. don't pay more than $40 bucks for it. shipping would be a pain... it's heavy.

nice to see you, thom! how's your takeda? : P
 
c-dawg said:
hi everyone. thanks for watching my video : )

in case anyone cared, i got the microfilm from 'tools for working wood'. i prefer PSA backed film over non-psa film. it stands for 'pressure sensitive adhesive'. i like it because it can get rid of the air bubbles.

i like the granite reference block because it is guaranteed flat within 3 microns. i got it from japan wood worker, but any local woodworking shop will carry it. don't pay more than $40 bucks for it. shipping would be a pain... it's heavy.

nice to see you, thom! how's your takeda? : P
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Hey Curtis, I really would love to see you try the .05 micron 3M PSA backed lapping films that I use to finish my knives (I use glass rather than a granite block like you do). It would be pretty amazing to see what you could do with it. It is like $4 a sheet, but lasts a good while. I order 5 at a time since PSI Dragon crushes me on shipping charges (I get my other lapping films from tools for working wood like you do), but 5 sheets lasts me about 2 years. I notice a definate increase in sharpness with the .05 micron, I wonder if you would notice the same.

Oh yeah, I'm the guy you sent Thom's Larrin Thomas Santoku to when we were passing it around before it got to Thom. I also have a Takeda Gyuto and plan to test it out on my new Shapton 16K Glasstone and and keep on going until it is at .05 microns on a 4 per side bevel. Not the most sturdy bevel, but when you cut straight it sure does amaze you with cutting ability.

Mike
 
hey mike! i remember you from FF.
my takeda gyuto is at 4.45 degrees each side. it holds the edge and has never ever rolled or chipped even without a microbevel.

now, i use a microbevel on all knives steeper than 7 degrees, so anything more acute than that gets like a 20degree micro.

i've used .3 micron paper, but not .05

.05 is insane... INSANE!!! hahaha. let me see if JWW carries it, either way, would you show me a link as to where i can get it?

thanks : ) i'd like to check it out.
 
Here is the link, Curtis: http://www.psidragon.com/products.asp?cat=412

It is the top product, the pale yellow .05 micron lapping film. For me it is great stuff, especially on Super Blue, M4, and ZDP189 (or any other steel that likes polished edges for that matter). It even helps the ultra high carbide S90V get sharper. With your skill it would be amazing to see what you can do. My wife and daughter have mistreated my Takdeda (wife use it as a pumpkin knife and I had to straighten it, daughter cut herself and dropped it on tile, thank god she only got a small cut), maybe you can go from start to finish on it so I can see what real sharpness is about. I live in Petaluma, and my parents live in the East Bay, so we are in close proximity. Maybe I can send you a sheet of the .05 micron stuff to play with, as I just ordered 5 more about a month ago and the first sheet is still going very strong. e mail me at gunmike1@comcast.net if you want me to try to mail you a piece of the .05 micron stuff, or if you are just going to order it. I doubt JWW carries it. It is nice you are close to them, as it took them like 6 days when I ordered a stone Priority shipped. I could have walked down there and got it faster than that.

Mike
 
my eyes lit up when i read your wife's pumpkin episode and my jaw dropped when i read your daughter got cut : P

my very first day of having the takeda, seconds after unwrapping the knife, as i was about to turn on the water to clean it, i put it down to grab the salt (i cleanse new knives with salt). i bumped the handle and barely stopped myself in time from catching the knife as it fell tip first onto my kitchen floor. luckily, it was linoleum, but it still chipped off about 3-4 mm's off the tip : X at least i got to learn how to fix a tip : D

my takeda's 242mm now. i love that knife.

let me look at that website. their prices seem a bit high.

maybe one of these days we could schedule some sort of sharpening day. i think it'd be fun!

-c
 
I polish on a Naniwa 12k and finish on my own 150k diamond sandpaper for a wicked sharp edge. There's no stones that are as fine as the finest sandpaper.

The waterstone actually works out cheaper for me because I do a lot of sharpening, but it's not really needed. I used to do the entire reprofiling -> mirror polish all in sandpaper, it was cheap and easy. I use a mousepad instead of glass for consistant convex edges and better tactile feedback. With glass it ends up a flat edge that is only somewhat convex.

Waterstones do have the advantage of giving better tactile feedback and cutting faster. You can also use some special honing techniques for recurves, techniques that require edge-leading strokes that would cut into the sandpaper.

I'm not a fan of wet/dry sandpaper because it's too slow. Diamond sandpaper cuts much faster, about the same speed as a waterstone.
 
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emory cloth is imho a better option than sandpaper it doesnt shed sand everywhere, certainly not as bad as 'paper, lasts longer too.

i prefer stones though unless i am doing some heavy re-profiling.
 
Cotdt, where are you getting diamond sandpaper?
 
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