sharpening?

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Nov 7, 2013
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262
I'm wondering what some of you are doing to sharpen your finished knives, I had been using my grinder going through the fine grits, but I feel like it's a bit beyond my skill level to get it right still. They do eventually get sharp, but I find the bevel comes up a bit higher than I'd like it to, and a bit uneven. I've also used wetsand paper on a piece of granite, and just sharpening that way by hand, which I think I might like better than using my grinder now. So, how do you guys go about taking a finished knife and making it cut? Is there a sharpening system worth looking into? Thanks
 
Mark, there are lots of options to go with. You mentioned two, your belt sander and the wet/dry paper "scary sharp" system. There is the Wicked Edge system that is guided. Many makers use that. The Lansky system. Edge Pro. Myself I use bench stones, diamond, water, Arkansas. There is also the Spyderco Sharpmaker, really for maintenance more than establishing a bevel. Lot's to choose from. I think most smiths will say they like the Wicked Edge system best. If you're able to sharpen freehand, I say use the bench stones that suite your style!
 
Could be your technique, or could be that the edge itself is too thick or varying in thickness, thus causing the variable edge bevels. Personally, I say stick with the grinder and practice. Sharpen all your kitchen knives, then all your friends' kitchen knives... I bet you can get it down.
 
I use belts on the 2 x 72 for most all of my sharpening. Dip the blades to keep them cool and use belts with a heavier backing if you are con vexing too much for you're liking.

It takes a while to get the knack for it but I can make forearm hair shaving sharp blades that will last a long time using J flex type belts up to 7 micron.
 
I establish the edge with a 220 belt. Cut a block of wood to the angle I want and use it as a guide. Then I go to the Spyderco sharpmaker. Then strop. Works well for me.
 
I knock most of it off (75-80%) on the grinder and then finish on a guided sharpening device with stones. Cut the time to sharpen waaaay down and I end up with a nice non wavy edge.
 
Pandora's box has been opened...stand clear!

First off, pretty much every knifemaker has their own way of getting to sharp. Some are obviously better at it than others.

To my mind, a solid understanding of basic mechanics/feedback of sharpening is more important than the specific process or the exact media involved. It seems almost ironic that we can go to such great lengths to chase this type of understanding for each and every step of making a knife, but then sometimes lay down at the end for fear of scratching up that perfect finish. No way around the idea that a thoughtful edge is a primary goal in the making of working knives and worth every moment we can spend on it.

I can't speak to any of the boxed systems personally, but hand sharpening is an aquired skill. Nothing replaces time spent with your chosen gear IMHO. It really is that simple once you're clear on what you want to do.

Practice in matching your edge geometry and polish to the particular alloy and the intended work can't be replaced by all the tube vids, books, fool-proof turn-key systems, etc out there.

If the bevels you form now are too wide, either you have chosen an inclusive bevel angle that is too acute or possibly your edges were too thick before 1st sharpening. Easy solution either way. If they are uneven, it could be slightly variable edge thickness in your blades or maybe poor use of narrow sharpening media on a uniform edge.

My solution is to grind my edges very thin after HT, sharpen by hand and typically test the hell out of them before final finishing. They all fail, it is just when/how, so I appreciate the opportunity to do some serious cutting without fear of creating more work. It also gives me a chance to selectively thin shoulders some more, or maybe beef up tip strength, etc and retest before finishing. These get purposedly dulled after testing, but require only a few strokes to bring back to serious sharp and pretty after the leather is done.

I've tried a lot of different stones but these days most often reach for the 2.5" x 11" DMT plates. Steel type becomes irrelevant as all bows before diamond. I'll generally stop at extra fine (~CAMI 1200) and go to a strop loaded with 1500 loose SiC or green chrome oxide. I have been doing this awhile and still learn new stuff every time I start to pay serious attention.

One last thing, you see a lot of discussions on sharpening over the years that consistently overlook what is inevitable; how will the customer deal with maintaining that perfect edge once it is dull. That is worth more thought in itself, and maybe another thread sometime.
 
I had a wicked edge but sold it after I learned to do it with my 2x72
 
I have an Edge Pro which I like because it allows me to set a very precise edge angle. Personally, I'm not interested in wasting a lot of time learning to sharpen a knife on stones - the Zen experience doesn't do it for me. Heresy, I know.

Tim
 
There are many ways to go about it, but for speed and accuracy your 2 X 72 belt machine, used in combination with a Bubble Jig is hard to beat. I use ceramic 120 belts for the initial passes, once there's a burr the length of the edge I switch to 220--320--400 in j-flex belts and finish with a cork 600. Working at the slowest belt speed it takes around 10 to 15 minutes to put the edge on a new blade. For me, I need the support of a long work rest to support my hands while working; it makes the finished edge look machined.

We made this video last year, check it out it may give you some ideas. Fred

[video]https://youtu.be/iFzVjH8DXYo[/video]
 
I also sharpen on my 2x72 grinder. I use a simple jig. My technique isn't as refined as others on here so I will spare you my process. However one thing that has helped me is to practice on the backside of old band saw or hack saw blades. When I'm comfortable with my technique (regardless of what that is) and feel its something I can repeat I sharpen my knife. Nothing worse then making a bad mistake sharpening a knife you have already invested many hours into.
 
I could never do a good job sharpening on my grinder. I used a lansky system for a while, now I use bench stones. I have DMT diamond stones and spyderco ceramic stones. I would like to get some water stones in the future.

Chris
 
It puzzles me how knifemakers can't sharpen knives without jigs.
 
Pandora's box has been opened...stand clear!

First off, pretty much every knifemaker has their own way of getting to sharp. Some are obviously better at it than others.

To my mind, a solid understanding of basic mechanics/feedback of sharpening is more important than the specific process or the exact media involved. It seems almost ironic that we can go to such great lengths to chase this type of understanding for each and every step of making a knife, but then sometimes lay down at the end for fear of scratching up that perfect finish. No way around the idea that a thoughtful edge is a primary goal in the making of working knives and worth every moment we can spend on it.

I can't speak to any of the boxed systems personally, but hand sharpening is an aquired skill. Nothing replaces time spent with your chosen gear IMHO. It really is that simple once you're clear on what you want to do.

Practice in matching your edge geometry and polish to the particular alloy and the intended work can't be replaced by all the tube vids, books, fool-proof turn-key systems, etc out there.

If the bevels you form now are too wide, either you have chosen an inclusive bevel angle that is too acute or possibly your edges were too thick before 1st sharpening. Easy solution either way. If they are uneven, it could be slightly variable edge thickness in your blades or maybe poor use of narrow sharpening media on a uniform edge.

My solution is to grind my edges very thin after HT, sharpen by hand and typically test the hell out of them before final finishing. They all fail, it is just when/how, so I appreciate the opportunity to do some serious cutting without fear of creating more work. It also gives me a chance to selectively thin shoulders some more, or maybe beef up tip strength, etc and retest before finishing. These get purposedly dulled after testing, but require only a few strokes to bring back to serious sharp and pretty after the leather is done.

I've tried a lot of different stones but these days most often reach for the 2.5" x 11" DMT plates. Steel type becomes irrelevant as all bows before diamond. I'll generally stop at extra fine (~CAMI 1200) and go to a strop loaded with 1500 loose SiC or green chrome oxide. I have been doing this awhile and still learn new stuff every time I start to pay serious attention.

One last thing, you see a lot of discussions on sharpening over the years that consistently overlook what is inevitable; how will the customer deal with maintaining that perfect edge once it is dull. That is worth more thought in itself, and maybe another thread sometime.

Print-worthy reply.

Personally I like dmt stones. Once go from the blue to the fine I'll do extra fine or mess with the messy water stones. Depends on the intended use.

Very frustrating and takes LOTS of trial and error. I really prefer a hand honed bevel to a machine one though.
 
If you use a grinder, either make sure the belt is moving quite slow, or stay the heck off the platen-sharpen just above it- your edge stays a lot cooler that way.
 
Pandora's box has been opened...stand clear!
One last thing, you see a lot of discussions on sharpening over the years that consistently overlook what is inevitable; how will the customer deal with maintaining that perfect edge once it is dull. That is worth more thought in itself, and maybe another thread sometime.

Andy, All good points and I will address the last one for any newer makers that may benefit.

I give free, Life time sharpening on all of my custom knives. All the need to do is get it to me and pay any return postage if needed.

I don't want them handing my knives to any hack or relative with a grinder or stones that tells then they can sharpen it right up!

I had one knife come back to me from a customer that's uncle said he'd do it! Well he did it alright with grind marks all over the sides of the blade woke a die grinder was used on it and chucks of the edge taken out. :eek:

I've also found that doing the sharpening for free is a great way to talk with my customers again and it has led to many more sales.:thumb up:

By the way, I tell my customers that's its MY LIFE time free sharpening! As the knives will last many more years than I.;)
 
There are many ways to go about it, but for speed and accuracy your 2 X 72 belt machine, used in combination with a Bubble Jig is hard to beat. I use ceramic 120 belts for the initial passes, once there's a burr the length of the edge I switch to 220--320--400 in j-flex belts and finish with a cork 600. Working at the slowest belt speed it takes around 10 to 15 minutes to put the edge on a new blade. For me, I need the support of a long work rest to support my hands while working; it makes the finished edge look machined.

We made this video last year, check it out it may give you some ideas. Fred

[video]https://youtu.be/iFzVjH8DXYo[/video]

I'll echo what Fred said. I bought one of his jigs a couple weeks back and starting using it to sharpen on my KMG a few days ago... I'm about a dozen knives in so far and will never go back to a stone again! I've been sharpening most of mine to a 40 degree angle (20 per side) with up to an 800 A/O belt and then running them a dozen so passes on my strop... they come out wicked sharp without a whole lot of effort!
 
Flat edged blades I'm fine with. As a chef you learn this skill on bench stones.
What I struggle with is sharpening aggressive re-curves. Currently I use my 1/30 grinder with a variety of belts finishing with a leather honing belt and get pretty good results, not great. I don't have a rod-based system which I believe would work, but I'll bet very few of my customers have one either, or a grinder and belts. If I'm going to do re-curved blades I'd like to be able to sharpen then in a manner that can be done by its future owner.

So, how would/do you sharpen a re-curve without rods or grinder?




-Peter
 
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