Sharpness of katana

J

Joey454

Joined
Apr 25, 2015
Messages
6
Hi all,
I'm a newbie but I have a couple of katanas. My question is this,how sharp should a katana that is billed as a dedicated cutter be? The reason I'm asking is, I just purchased a katana that won't pass the paper test, like at all, the place I purchased from says katanas aren't supposed to be that sharp. I like the sword and it's from a good supplier but I'm thinking this sword wasn't given the once over before it shipped, I can run my finger tip down the edge and it won't cut me and this is with enough pressure to leave a indent on my finger tip. Not lots of pressure but enough that on a $100 katana I own I would have done some real damage to the fingers and a wouldn't be playing guitar for awhile for sure! I don't wanna go try and cut with it in case I have to return it. I feel that if I tried to cut a milk jug filled with water it would be more like a baseball bat than a "razor sharp katana". Well what do you all think??
Thanks and looking forward to hanging around here.
Jo e
 
Welcome aboard

$100 is kind of minimal to expect much but if you feel it is a dud, return it for replacement or a refund. If the seller is saying a sword does not need to be razor sharp, that is usually a hlaf truth. Here is a fairly recent thread worth reading. I may be misunderstanding what sword you are talking about but be a little more specific about the seller and the product.

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/1279838-Sword-Sharpening

It pays off to research a topic before buying but I know how temptation can lead one astray. If you know how to sharpen a blade, your issue is a non-issue and on the other hand, in time, will realize $100 isn't enough to buy a decent sword other than a machete.

Cheers

GC
 
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I'm sorry I look at my post and realize I didn't explain. I just bought a new sword for $300 this is the one I can't cut my finger on. The sword is from a well known importer with really good reviews here on this forum, he's the one that said it shouldn't be that sharp. The $100 katana was much sharper when I bought it. I was using the $100 katana as a reference. I asked here because I am a newbie and I don't want to be wrong and send the sword back if it's supposed to be the way the sword dealer says.
 
Although I wouldn't expect to be able to shave with a katana, it can certainly be sharper than you've described your sword as being. I'm not sure returning a sword due to "out of the box dullness" is really the thing to do either..if you look around, there's bound to be a thread on here as to how to sharpen a katana for cutting duty. Personally, although it may cause a gasp or two, I just use a handheld carbide sharpener - very lightly- and follow up with another set up in the same "vee" style that uses ceramic rods. Both are going to remove some metal, I cannot stress enough to go easy with the carbide one. Also, make sure to watch for the rods running along the side, you don't want the sharpener marring up the finish, make sure there's clearance. If it's sharp, just not sharp enough, just use ceramic. there's a ton of this style of sharpener available, mine is made by Wustoff, it works well. I'm also not suggesting you do this with a quality weapon that costs major bucks, just the cutter stuff and machetes and the like. Give it a pull, or two, check it, etc. Eyeball where you "start and stop", or better yet try to go the whole length with one stroke, but go easy on the pressure-very easy, until you see how it's doing. For tiny chips and the like (which shouldn't happen cutting proper targets) try to use a kitchen steel to "move" that back over before you do anything else, being careful to ONLY straighten that one eeny little spot. Ok, the water-stones crowd can yell at me now. :D
 
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Joey454 said:
I'm sorry I look at my post and realize I didn't explain. I just bought a new sword for $300 this is the one I can't cut my finger on. The sword is from a well known importer with really good reviews here on this forum, he's the one that said it shouldn't be that sharp. The $100 katana was much sharper when I bought it. I was using the $100 katana as a reference. I asked here because I am a newbie and I don't want to be wrong and send the sword back if it's supposed to be the way the sword dealer says.
Click to expand...

Once again,

You are not really enough information to have others respond in a comprehensive manner.

Post the sword model and the dealer.

A little bit of common sense comes to play here.

Cheers

GC
 
The make of sword is a Ronin Katana, Dojo Pro. From the reviews I've read and all, I just felt like I didn't want to sound like I was just trying to beat them up. I really do like the sword I just felt like it should be sharper and wanted some opinions from folks that actually know because the only reference I have is a $100 katana. Thanks I appreciate the help.
Joe
 
Once again.

Who was the dealer/seller? Have you related to them that the sword is not sharp at all?

Cheers

GC
 
It was straight from Ronin. I'm not sure why that matters as I thought I made it clear that I could return the sword. I emailed and told them that the sword would not cut paper and was told by them that katanas are really not supposed to be that sharp. I have a very cheap brand katana that cuts paper or flesh very easy,ouch!! Even though the cheap katana is sharp it's still um...cheap any there are many other flaws. The Dojo Pro on the other hand and to my untrained eye seems to be very nice and not cheap, so I thought that me being a newbie, maybe I was just expecting to much from the sword, so I thought that it might be wise to ask folks with far more knowledge than I. Sorry if I'm not explaining myself very well, I'm trying to quit smoking and it's not going very well;-) thanks I appreciate your time.
Joe
 
First - avoid the carbide pull-through sharpener...you don't want to put a V-edge on a katana.
While I have mixed feelings about the Ronin Dojo Pro line; I'll agree that, generally, cutting paper is not an accurate test of a katana's useability on typical targets.

That point made, yours - per your description - does seem more dull than the norm. It will likely still do the job...though you may find that successful cuts are more highly dependent on proper edge alignment (but that's not really a bad thing). If it's going to be a user, try it out - you can always sharpen it if you need to. It's going to get scratched & scuffed with use anyway; so there's no reason to avoid it.

The explanation is typically that a katana uses blade geometry and alignment to make the cut, rather than relying on a sharp edge; and that having the edge too sharp increases the risk of damage when used for cutting anything other than mats.
 
I've seen WW11 katana's with an original edge on them so sharp they would easily cut you if you drew your finger down the blade. I agree the key is blade geometry, not to establish a sharp edge, but to keep a sharp edge from chipping. At least, that's my take on them.

I don't buy what the manufacturer is telling you. it doesn't need to cut paper, but it sure as heck should be sharp enough to cut your finger when you run it down the blade. At $300., that's the least you should expect.
 
Thanks hh and David,
The geometry of the blade does seem pretty good on the Dojo Pro but I really think it should and could be much sharper. I really do get the whole geometry thing. I used the paper test strictly for reference. I mean I realize a fairly dull blade can still be made to seem like it cuts paper, when in reality it is really just making a impressive tear rather than a clean cut. This blade has trouble even getting that tearing effect. I might just try and sharpen it, I did get a good price on it. Maybe another question? Would jumping up in cost, let's say $200 more or should I say a $500 sword be that much better as to justify the cost difference between a $300 sword? I think I most likely know the answer
 
I have a small group of katana - not all were purchased new; but "New" prices ranged from $275 to around $800. There is an increase in quality with increasing price...it isn't always easily identified unless/until one has a good feel for what they are looking at. Value may not be commensurate with cost; and some are definitely overpriced for what you get. Is it worth it to jump up to a $500 katana? It depends on which one you're thinking about buying.
The only katana I've owned with an edge similar to what you've described was my first - a Cheness. I used it quite a bit, and was happy with it as a cutter...until I started using better ones.
The next in line was a Dojo Pro. It was better than my Cheness, (and the edge was better than you described,) so I was pleased...until I tried something else. That next one was slightly less expensive than a Dojo Pro, but consistently outperformed it.
That is the katana I use now, more often than not - in fact I've sold both the RDP and the Cheness. (I still have RDP and Cheness kokats - they're my beaters)
 
It sounds like the sword is way too dull.
 
Joey454 said:
It was straight from Ronin. I'm not sure why that matters as I thought I made it clear that I could return the sword. I emailed and told them that the sword would not cut paper and was told by them that katanas are really not supposed to be that sharp. I have a very cheap brand katana that cuts paper or flesh very easy,ouch!! Even though the cheap katana is sharp it's still um...cheap any there are many other flaws. The Dojo Pro on the other hand and to my untrained eye seems to be very nice and not cheap, so I thought that me being a newbie, maybe I was just expecting to much from the sword, so I thought that it might be wise to ask folks with far more knowledge than I. Sorry if I'm not explaining myself very well, I'm trying to quit smoking and it's not going very well;-) thanks I appreciate your time.
Joe
Click to expand...

I have had good regard for the product line in the past but have never handled one. My impressions were much the same as yours.

If Ronin is being that flippant about sharpness, return it and shop elsewhere. There had been some negative feedback about several issues and not just the katana. As neither the katana and medieval line have been of a market interest for me, no big deal but it seems something has gone awry on a large scale with the owner. After he had the Medieval swords released and there were serious issues shown in photos, I would no longer recommend them for anything.

Post your thoughts over at the Sword Buyers Guide

Or, sharpen the sword :)

Good luck with the smoking. I have gone to mostly vaping with an occasional cigar. I did survive a stroke.

Cheers

GC
 
Sharpening a sword isn't as easy as one might imagine. It's a long piece of steel. here's how I do it, if it's of any interest to folks. I guess I should start out by saying I do have a 2x72" grinder and I have a lot of experience with it, but for the sake of this discussion I'll just talk about hand sharpening. Now, this is my way, there's probably a different way for each and every guy who owns swords.

I don't do anything fancy. I have a tree stump stand about waist high. The top is smooth and even. I put a rubber bottle opener (the kind you use to open tight bottles) on the stand, then my 400 grit whetstone. The rubber keeps the stone from slipping around. I don't push down hard, I just focus on keeping the same angle on each stroke, I flip the blade at the end of the stroke, and repeat. Keep the stone wet. Unless the blade is really dull, it doesn't take long. If I want a more polished edge (which I rarely do as I personally like a bit of a toothy edge) I go to a 600 grit stone.

I have tried diamond stones, but do not like them as I find them too aggressive. The key is even, smooth strokes at the same angle each time.

I am interested in how others do it. I am always willing to learn new things and adapt as needed.
 
Thanks for the input HC. I have tried the e cigs and they do work for me but I always seems to give up and smoke again :mad: I need more will power. About the sword, I did get the sword of the month deal so I'm really thinking hard about just attempting to sharpen it. I don't want to sharpen it till I'm sure I can pull it off without needing to fix a bunch of mistakes. I'm using my $100 sword as a practice tool. My first attempt would have worked out great had I just stopped after a few light stokes on each side, notice I said "would have turned out great" well I just had to take a few more strokes, just a little bit sharper and oops don't you know, I messed it up! Now I'm in the middle of learning how to re polish a whole sword:rolleyes: All that said, even with the great deal on the sword I feel like maybe I shouldn't have to sharpen it or that it shouldn't be my responsibility to bring it up to snuff.
David, yeah it's not as easy as one might think. I do have much experience sharpening block planes and scrapers with wet stones, I could get theses edges truly "scary sharp" although I used jigs to set the angle and they only have one edge. Absolutely nothing like sharpening a sword! For the sword I've been trying out the sand paper method, I intend to finish off with a 3000 grit wet stone. I'm having some trouble keeping my angle to keep the geometry true but all in all I think I'm on the right track.
Thanks again
Joe
 
Ronin (particularly the dojo pro) katanas have a big fan base, mainly, in my opinion, from the SBG forum and store. In my experience, they do NOT justify the hype and the owner is an arrogant a$$. The answer you received is BULL! I have at least 40 katanas ranging from $75 to $1700; every one will easily cut paper There are different degrees of sharpness depending on what your cutting medium will be (e.g. water bottles vs tamaghane (BIG oops :o tameshigiri-tatami omote) but a katana is meant to be SHARP (and, yes, I know, edge alignment is critical for katanas). As has been said, sharpening is difficult at best for the inexperienced (NOTHING like sharpening a knife). Send it back and perhaps check the extensive Hanwei line. Just my .02
 
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Perhaps I should have been more specific (assuming you are serious). Sharp enough to cut through rolled tatami mats (though cutting through steel would be special to say the least. :D). Better? ;)
 
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Huh. I never really realized I was doing it "wrong", with the accusharp-thingy. It's always just worked, worked pretty fast and fairly well, well enough to do some cutting with the edge it gives. All of my stuff is sharp enough now that I generally just use the ceramic rods. I know a katana should have a convex grind, but I'm scared to death of messing with mine as they seem to be working okay and I'm cutting some pretty soft targets. (mostly melons, etc) I haven't had any chipping or edge rolling so far. I don't own a belt sander, as yet. There isn't exactly a plethora of sword-sharpeners around here in Cornfield,Illinois, either. I guess I could ask the guy who does lawnmower blades.. but in all seriousness, I'm sure there are places available for somebody to send a sword off for sharpening. If in any doubt, just send it off, after getting some good reviews or recommendations. I don't cut tatami mats, have you priced those things? Melons are free around here, I'd rather buy more steel with my money.
 
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