Sheaths.... Are they Important?? What is your postion in regards to Custom Knives??

[Bigfattyt]

I don't know if I am really a good example, as I buy and use Busse knives.

I 100% agree that a bad or poorly made sheath won't make me decide not to buy the knife.

I own no high end customs. I also own no safe queens, except for one knife made by my Uncle Glen Hornby (deceased maker out of California). I just stress out too much to even carry it, because it is literally irreplaceable.

Also, all my users are what I would consider "beaters". Not that they are ugly, or that I abuse my knives, but I use them to cut not only food, but wood, and that tends to scratch the finishes up.

Another issue is that I make my own sheaths (nothing professional), but I know that if I but a knife, I can make a functional sheath that I am glad to carry.

The only, and I mean only reason I don't send my knives out for sheaths is money. If I had the money I would get a Paul Long sheath (Chuddy Bear, Mikey Moto, Leatherman etc etc etc). I will spend $800 on a knife and then make a sheath for it because that means I have another $100 to spend on another knife! (give or take).


Making my own sheaths is a Pain in the A$$ but I feel satisfaction when I make one that looks half way decent.
The amount of time and effort it takes me to make one, makes it totally not "worth it" to me if I had the resources to buy them (I have purchased sheaths before, just not in the past few years).

If a $1500 knife does not come with a sheath it is not a problem. If a $100-300 dollar knife does not, it is more of a consideration.

I think a perfect example are Matt Bailey knifes. He does not sell "high end' customs. Just beautifully made user customs. His sheaths do more than just give a place to stick the knife to carry it. They are getting better and better, and often, the sheath is every bit as much of a looker as the knife. It adds immensely to the desirability of the knife.

His sheaths just plain look cool!


There are many makers out there (from utilitarian customs to full on I would have to sell a child to afford high end customs) that make great sheaths. Some knife makers, should never make sheaths. Even if requested, they should politely decline or recommend an outside source, rather than include a sheath that cheapens their knife.

I have seen makers state, on more than one occasion, that they hate making sheaths, can't make a great sheath and won't mess with them any more.

Those kind of sheaths just get thrown in a drawer.

 

[Lims]

For fixed blades - yes.

 

[jdm61]

I don't know about saving alot of money as the price of a knifemaker's good quality sheath is built into his knife price.

I don't know if I agree with that generalization, Kevin. Say if you were buying a knife in the $750 range that you really wanted and it had no sheath. Would you pay the maker an extra $150 to $200 for a sheath that was of the same quality that Paul provides or would you expect the maker to eat at least part if not all of that cost,therby making the knife a $550-600 knife from the makers perspective? for makers that can get $3000+ for a nice bowie with mammoth ivory and a high end sheath, that extra $200+ for the ivory and $100+ for the sheath is not a big deal, but for someone who can make a knife using the same materials and can only get say $750, you just gave away 40% of your money and that is before you start thining about your other materials, consumables and time. The expectations of buyers for all but the highest priced knives has increased incredibly, but the prices that they are willing to pay have, to my mind, not really gone up much since the early to mid 90's because there are so many more makers who are willing to part with their product for less just to get them sold.

 

[Kevin Jones]

I don't know if I agree with that generalization, Kevin. Say if you were buying a knife in the $750 range that you really wanted and it had no sheath. Would you pay the maker an extra $150 to $200 for a sheath that was of the same quality that Paul provides or would you expect the maker to eat at least part if not all of that cost,therby making the knife a $550-600 knife from the makers perspective? for makers that can get $3000+ for a nice bowie with mammoth ivory and a high end sheath, that extra $200+ for the ivory and $100+ for the sheath is not a big deal, but for someone who can make a knife using the same materials and can only get say $750, you just gave away 40% of your money and that is before you start thining about your other materials, consumables and time. The expectations of buyers for all but the highest priced knives has increased incredibly, but the prices that they are willing to pay have, to my mind, not really gone up much since the early to mid 90's because there are so many more makers who are willing to part with their product for less just to get them sold.

Joe, my point is that the knifemaker who either needs to make a living or needs to supplement his income and has all the expenses associated with trying to do such (not a hobbyest knifemaker) is not giving away their good quality sheaths with their knives regardless of the price range they are selling in.
Thus my statement that one is not going to save A LOT of money by the maker suppling the sheath as opposed to the owner buying it from a sheathmaker themselves.

To answer your questions, I'm not going to spend $150-$200 on a sheath for a $750 knife. It would be more like $75-$100. And no, I would not expect a knifemaker to eat $150-$200 on a knife that I felt was worth the $750 he was asking.

 

[jdm61]

The biggest obstacle for me is the $1000+ cost of even a basic sewing machine like a Tippman Boss. With the nerve damage that I have in my non-hammering hand, I would have a lot of trouble hand stitching. Guess I had better start saving up my pennies.

Joe, my point is that the knifemaker who either needs to make a living or needs to supplement his income and has all the expenses associated with trying to do such (not a hobbyest knifemaker) is not giving away their good quality sheaths with their knives regardless of the price range they are selling in.
Thus my statement that one is not going to save A LOT of money by the maker suppling the sheath as opposed to the owner buying it from a sheathmaker themselves.

To answer your questions, I'm not going to spend $150-$200 on a sheath for a $750 knife. It would be more like $75-$100. And no, I would not expect a knifemaker to eat $150-$200 on a knife that I felt was worth the $750 he was asking.

 

[firebolt]

Sheaths. very important.
most sheaths that come with a knife are a not very good, run off the mill and budget closer

as said, knife and sheath they come to getter like a bun and a wiener make a hot dog

come to the point i don't care if there is a sheath with a bought knife, for a user i let some one make a good one, or make one my self

i even have sheaths - knife combo's , where the sheath was more expansive than the knife.

good to ware, very good retention , i hate rattling knives , and protection in there when pushing back in the sheath, not to push it trough the leather when putting the knife

made by Martin Swinkels

first one i made my self

kind regards, martin

 

[Robert Dark]

The biggest obstacle for me is the $1000+ cost of even a basic sewing machine like a Tippman Boss. With the nerve damage that I have in my non-hammering hand, I would have a lot of trouble hand stitching. Guess I had better start saving up my pennies.

Joe,

I made many, many sheaths and sewed them by hand. I can't think of anything that SUX more than trying to get those stitch holes lined up just right, then having the thread cut through your fingers in order to get good tight stitches.

I will admit that a well hand-sewn sheath looks 10 times better than a machine sewn sheath, but it is sooooooo time consuming.

I finally got a Tipman Boss about 4 or 5 years ago and haven't looked back. I will admit that sometimes I use the Boss to punch the holes and then hand sew. You just can't beat that hand sewn look. (We don't really know if those machine lock stitches are centered or not now do we?)

At the price I sell my knives for, the only way I can break even is for the customer to ask me how many hours I have in the knife and sheath, then add $10.00 per hour for all those hours plus the price of the knife. (And we know that ain't gonna happen)

Who is at fault for my losses????????? Only me, but I will admit that I am more than a little anal about my knives and sheaths and if I take a loss, I can still say that I have enjoyed the ride. I have been many places in my life and done many things, but I have never found the satisfaction and peace of mind as I have making knives.

I just figure an included sheath for a fixed blade is a natural part of the total package. I don't necessarily enjoy making them, but I sure am happy when the plan comes together.

Save your pennies and buy some kind of "stitcher". You will be happy in the long run.

Hope to see you again soon,

Robert

 

[Allcaps321]

The sheath is not make or break point for me on a custom or handmade knife. However it is nice to not have to send the knife out for a sheath cause I get to use it sooner.

 

[jdm61]

You can get very nice sheaths for $40-60, BUT they are models that are knocked out quickly with clicker dies and sewing machines for specific sizes of knives and sometimes, like in the case of the Sullivan Randall sheaths that have the shop stamp instead of the Randall one, for specific models of Randall knives. Basically, you either get a 4-5 inch hunter pouch sheath from Treestump or something that is the same size as whatever Randall model the Sullivan is built for. That means that you have to build the knife to fit the sheath. If you want to go off script, so to speak, then you are either going to spend more money or have to wait a LONG time or both. Where I run into cost issues is with the high and low end of my line. The small hunters with wood handles still are going to need a $40-45 Treestump sheath and the big ones with premium materials need something nice, which usually will set you back at least $100. $50 fo a Sullivan or something like it for a $300+ fighter is not so painful. I knowthat there are some like JRE that will make sheaths for you a bit cheaper if you order a few or if you buys ones sized for specific knives, but to me, the rivets and the general look of those sheaths scream cheap Army-Navy store KaBar copy.

 

[jmsodpc]

i bought the $99 snody boss and right away bought a sheath on ebay that happed to fit....of course i would prefer it to come with one but the ebay one for $7 was fine enough for me.

 

[Lorien]

I have a love/hate relationship with stitching leather.

 

[sheathmaker]

I will admit that a well hand-sewn sheath looks 10 times better than a machine sewn sheath, but it is sooooooo time consuming.

Really, Robert? Really? Ten times better?

BTW, I do know if my top and bottom stitches are centered.

Paul

 

[harkamus]

If I buy a fixed blade, unless it's Bussekin, I expect it to come with a sheath. For most applications I'm fine with kydex. If I was getting a more traditional design like a bowie, I'd want a nice leather sheath.

 

[Snody]

i bought the $99 snody boss and right away bought a sheath on ebay that happed to fit....of course i would prefer it to come with one but the ebay one for $7 was fine enough for me.

Thats Balling on a Budget..
Huge Respect from Texas..
Thanks for spending your money on my knives.
Have a Great Weekend..
[youtube]wrTaQjYAqBY[/youtube]

 

[Snody]

Mike, I have noticed on your Boss Menace you offered optional sheaths, what percentage of people wanted one?

Keep up the great work!



Oh yeah... Sheaths are important in my opinion. I make one for every knife including my personal knives.

As an exception I offered my last knife for sale with the sheath optional in case the buyer wanted leather. Currently I only use Kydex or Concealex.

Thanks Bro
I really appreciate it man..
I am impressed with what your doing out the Rocky Mountain Way.. Keeping it real..
What Percentage are buying the sheath?? I sold over 100 knives on the first day we launched the project and about thirty of them were without sheaths..
That seems to be the ratio... 70% want a sheath at the time of purchase..
Have a great weekend and holler if we can ever help you with anything..
Much Respect..
[youtube]5n_Lhnh8ZQk[/youtube]

 

[Snody]

Joe,

I made many, many sheaths and sewed them by hand. I can't think of anything that SUX more than trying to get those stitch holes lined up just right, then having the thread cut through your fingers in order to get good tight stitches.

I will admit that a well hand-sewn sheath looks 10 times better than a machine sewn sheath, but it is sooooooo time consuming.

I finally got a Tipman Boss about 4 or 5 years ago and haven't looked back. I will admit that sometimes I use the Boss to punch the holes and then hand sew. You just can't beat that hand sewn look. (We don't really know if those machine lock stitches are centered or not now do we?)

At the price I sell my knives for, the only way I can break even is for the customer to ask me how many hours I have in the knife and sheath, then add $10.00 per hour for all those hours plus the price of the knife. (And we know that ain't gonna happen)

Who is at fault for my losses????????? Only me, but I will admit that I am more than a little anal about my knives and sheaths and if I take a loss, I can still say that I have enjoyed the ride. I have been many places in my life and done many things, but I have never found the satisfaction and peace of mind as I have making knives.

I just figure an included sheath for a fixed blade is a natural part of the total package. I don't necessarily enjoy making them, but I sure am happy when the plan comes together.

Save your pennies and buy some kind of "stitcher". You will be happy in the long run.

Hope to see you again soon,

Robert

Oustanding Post.
Great Philosophy in my opinion..
I spent 7 stacks for my Campbell Bosworth Lockstitch Machine and then drove several hours to get it..
When people purchase my $50.00 leather sheaths I often wonder how many of them realize that I invested well over $10,000.00 just to build my own leather.
You got to get it how you live.. I have to feed a family of four... I need the best equipment money can buy.. Life is short and I would rather spend my time eating fried shrimp and stone crab than sewing..
It is all relative, I ran over 100 sheaths this week, sold everyone of them to a dealer who already has them in the bay and my machine never even got warmed up.
Pimping aint easy and neither is knifemaking.. I salute those who sew by hand...
Knifemakers are tough...thats for sure..
Have a great weekend..
[youtube]5n_Lhnh8ZQk[/youtube]

 

[Jon Brand]

Like some others have said its nice when your knife comes with a sheath but if I like the knife enough its not necessary. But I will usually think about getting a sheath for it in the future by the maker or Paul Long. That kind of depends on my money situation. The knife is my primary interest. I think that when I have more room to display my knives, I will eventually find sheaths more important.

Of course if the knife is to be used it NEEDS one, no exception.

 

[Snody]

I have a love/hate relationship with stitching leather.

It is very satisfying work and very demanding...
[youtube]ijYVaZzR-jM[/youtube]

 

[pilgrimuk]

My knives are users and the sheaths are an essential part of the system. I've paid extra a few times for a custom knife maker to make me a custom sheath for the knife as well. Although the next buy I'm looking at is a non-custom Fallkniven TK2, I think the sheath looks pretty bad and if I go ahead with the purchase I'm going to contact Martin Swinkels (Post 46 above) to see if he will make me a custom for it.

So, my answer: YES!

 

[Daniel Fairly Knives]

Thanks Bro
I really appreciate it man..
I am impressed with what your doing out the Rocky Mountain Way.. Keeping it real..
What Percentage are buying the sheath?? I sold over 100 knives on the first day we launched the project and about thirty of them were without sheaths..
That seems to be the ratio... 70% want a sheath at the time of purchase..
Have a great weekend and holler if we can ever help you with anything..
Much Respect..

Thanks Mang... I have big respect for what you do. I'll never forget the day I first saw a Snody knife... I saw it from a distance and knew it was over the top quality, I had never seen anything like it at the time. That knife was probably what got me into knifemaking, seeing how much better you can do it by hand.

70% - that is nice to know.

Thanks a whole heap for the kind words, next time I'm in Rockport I'll have to holler at you.