shipping time question?

tinfoil hat timmy

tinfoil hat timmy

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Hello everyone. This is not meant to call anyone out on anything, but to get a consensus on what is appropriate.

My question is this:

How long, without communication from the seller, would you be willing to wait before trying to receive your funds back and canceling your agreement to buy a blade off of the exchange?

My situation is that I agreed to buy a blade from a forum member, recieved confirmation of payment, and seller dissappears. I have tried to get in touch for tracking numbers, but no response.

Its with two entirely different transactions with two different members who are well established with positive feedback so im not entirely worried yet.

I know 5 days isn't a long time. I work 12 hour days and have a hard time getting to the local p.o. sometimes. But two days is usually tops for that.

So, how long until worrytime?

Thanks
 
Anyone's guess is as good as yours. Some people are busy, others are planning vacations or on vacations, while others are doing other stuff. As long as you use paypal goods and not gift, there is nothing to worry about in terms of financial loss. Remember, regardless of what anyone does or says an item is not "yours" until you've paid for it and it is in your hands.
 
I think good communication is the #1 thing I look for in iTrader ratings. If as a seller I can't get something out right away I owe it to the buyer to let them know right away.

PayPal has rules for this. I think they want you to wait at least a week before opening a ticket or refund request.

I've done this twice with eBay but never here.
 
EyeDog said:
I think good communication is the #1 thing I look for in iTrader ratings. If as a seller I can't get something out right away I owe it to the buyer to let them know right away.

PayPal has rules for this. I think they want you to wait at least a week before opening a ticket or refund request.

I've done this twice with eBay but never here.
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The communication is what I'm most worried about. Seller number 1 coincidentally shot me a message not three seconds after I started this thread. So I'm only half worried now.
 
RevDevil said:
Anyone's guess is as good as yours. Some people are busy, others are planning vacations or on vacations, while others are doing other stuff. As long as you use paypal goods and not gift, there is nothing to worry about in terms of financial loss. Remember, regardless of what anyone does or says an item is not "yours" until you've paid for it and it is in your hands.
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If I have paid for a knife, it's mine. If I receive it and it is defective, I'm entitled to a refund and will transfer ownership back to the seller. That doesn't change the fact that once I've paid, the knife's mine.
 
HappyDaddy said:
If I have paid for a knife, it's mine. If I receive it and it is defective, I'm entitled to a refund and will transfer ownership back to the seller. That doesn't change the fact that once I've paid, the knife's mine.
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I know where you are coming from and going with this as I've been at this a long time. How can something be "yours" when it is not in your physical possession, in this case a knife? Yes it's been paid for, that is half the deal right there (technically, not theoretically).
 
Possession is 9/10 of the law. Once they possess your dough, shouldn't it be 9/10 theirs, and the blade 9/10 yours, at minimum?

Eta: since they have your dough, and the deal is "dough for a blade" the blade should be considered your property once funds are received by the seller.
 
RevDevil said:
I know where you are coming from and going with this as I've been at this a long time. How can something be "yours" when it is not in your physical possession, in this case a knife? Yes it's been paid for, that is half the deal right there (technically, not theoretically).
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I don't think it's being pedantic to say that in every respect (legal, technical, theoretical, and otherwise) once I've paid for something, I own it. In the particular instance involved here, the buyer accepted the terms of the seller - he paid the seller. It is now the obligation of the seller to deliver the buyer's goods to him. I understand that BFC has its own eccentric (in my view) way of looking at this. That's ok with me, but it doesn't change the facts, and law of the matter.
 
In every state that I know of, title to tangible personal property, other that motor vehicles, passes upon payment unless some express agreement of the parties provides otherwise and that agreement is enforceable.
 
HappyDaddy said:
I don't think it's being pedantic to say that in every respect (legal, technical, theoretical, and otherwise) once I've paid for something, I own it. In the particular instance involved here, the buyer accepted the terms of the seller - he paid the seller. It is now the obligation of the seller to deliver the buyer's goods to him. I understand that BFC has its own eccentric (in my view) way of looking at this. That's ok with me, but it doesn't change the facts, and law of the matter.
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I know, I know. You win.
What I was getting at is when you buy something from a person online, once you have it in your possession it's truly yours. That is when the deal is considered done, nothing eccentric about it. This is not a legal forum, it's a hobbyist forum so...yeah. Not worth the argument. :thumbup:
 
I sell knives as a large part of my 'daily wage'; once the seller pays I have an obligation (in my mind at least), to safely, securely, and as quickly as reasonably possible ship it to them (usually the next day) - still, IMO, it's my knife until they receive it and respond that they've received it and are happy with the transaction. If they receive it and they're happy, it's their knife.

If they don't receive it, I refund their money as I didn't meet my obligation. If they don't like it (and it didn't match the description), then once they return it in the same condition shipped, I'll refund their money. That said, and again, if they receive it and they're happy, it's their knife - until then, IMO, it's my responsibility, my obligation, and my knife...

That should be pretty clear to everyone involved, eccentric or not. ;)
 
Most sellers want their money right away, and I know work and life happens, but in the smartphone age if a seller can't at least shoot you an email saying it'll be so long before they can ship or something to ease your mind, I just find it lazy and inconsiderate.

On a similar note, I sharpen a fair amount of knives for people locally, and although I don't accept payment until their knives are back in their hands and they inspect them and are satisfied, I always send pics of their finished knives or something to keep them updated if it's several knives just to ease their mind. I prefer for the buyer/customer to feel comfortable and trust who they're dealing with.
 
Timmy, on those 5 days did you send the sellers emails or PMs and they not get responded to? Or were you patiently waiting for them to send you a message?

I will usually wait a few days until I started getting worried. After 3 days without a message I'd send them an email or pm. If that doesn't get responded to after a few more days then I would probably go about getting my money back. If payment is sent promptly ( I usually send it within an hour at most of an "I'll take it" mostly within ten minutes), shipping should he just as prompt. If not shipping at the very least some for of communication
 
tinfoil hat timmy said:
Is it YOUR money, or THEIR money? For curiosity's sake....
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The money paid is still the buyer's until they receive the knife safely, and should not be spent until that point. Basically, don't count your chickens before they've hatched.

I purchased a knife a couple years ago and the seller disappeared after receiving payment. I believe I waited one week to seek a moderators advice, then another week to file a PayPal claim. I had my money back very quickly after that.

If the remaining seller is an upstanding member I'd give him the benefit of the doubt and give it another week or so. Otherwise I'd file a PayPal claim after the initial full week.

Good luck.
 
I get where each poster is coming from with their opinions. And Ive not been on the forums here as long as most but have dealt on Gunbroker and others for many years.

And agree communication is key for me. But not everyone thinks the same. I think the inital communications are where you ask and answer all the things about time frames future communication etc...

But I have to agree in this day of internet buying where you dont see the product or seller and shake their hand when the deals done ...its only half completed until you hold your purchase in your hands.

And the money ... if I sell an item ... I consider it the buyers until they receive said item and are happy ... then I consider it a "done deal".

And Im like others there are times I get impatient thinking it should be here but things happen and it goes back to communication. If you send emails, messages and get no contact for days Id then worry and after a week probably start trying to recoop my money.
 
Unless stated otherwise by the seller, I think the knife should ship in 24 hours. 48 is ok (not great) as long as the seller communicates this. 5 days with no communication is 100% unacceptable. Barring extenuating circumstances (death in family, major injury / illness), there is no excuse for this. If you cannot act in a professional manner, then you should not be selling here.

This is just my opinion. Others very well might have a different standard regarding what is acceptable.
 
Whose money it is (basically, whoever has it)(as contrasted to whoever can get a court judgment to that amount) and whose property it is (explained above) is a separate question from when the risk of loss in shipment passes. In all fifty states, the risk of loss in transit passes to the buyer only on delivery to the agreed destination unless the parties expressly agree otherwise. Shipment must be made is a "reasonable" period of time unless the parties to the transaction agree otherwise.

We may have other ideas and BF may have contrary unwritten rules. You would probably not be surprised at how little the courts care about what we think the law should be.
 
In today's day and age of instant gratification everyone gets impatient, even me, but I sometimes have to sit back and relax for a minute and realize that it is easy to instantly send funds but it takes a minute to get out and mail off a package, but communication can and should happen as fast as sending money. If someone buys something from me and pays right then, then shouldn't I take a minute to contact them and also keep them updated until their item arrives.
 
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