Should all knife handle wood be stabilized?

Burl Source

Burl Source

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I was hoping this thread would generate opinions and input from some of the more experienced makers.

Some of you are of the opinion to stabilize everything with the exception of the obvious like ironwood. Others will use the fingernail test. If your fingernail can make a dent, it needs to be stabilized.

My opinion, and it is just that......an opinion is not to stabilize woods that are hard enough on their own.

My take on stabilizing is that it is to protect against cracks, warpage and other movement of wood that could result in a flawed handle. These can all be avoided with proper finishing of the handle wood.

Movement in the wood is caused by changes in moisture levels that cause the wood to expand, contract or move more on one side more than the other. My opinion is that a proper finish that seals the wood will prevent that from happening.

Back to my question, "How do you feel? Should all wood be stabilized? ..Why? or Why not?"
 
Naturally oily hardwoods don't need it. And some won't even take it or could possibly split or fracture violently. Woods that don't require stabilization and may not take it well include (but not limited to):

Ironwood
Cocobolo
African Blackwood
Ebony
Rosewoods
Walnut
Bubinga

There are others I'm sure.

Also, stabilization does two things. It hardens wood and it reduces the movement. Some woods need both things. Others benefit from only one. For example, on many of my own knives in the past, I've used buckeye burl that wasn't stabilized. My knives get wet all the time. I've found buckeye to be very stable as far as movement because it's usually so dry. BUT...it's also VERY soft so stabilizing is the way to go for that wood.
 
No I do not feel that all wooden handle material either should or should not be stabilized. Knives have had wooden handles for thousands of years before verbalizing and worked out just fine. Personally the only handle materials I feel need to be stabilized are the ones just to fragile to use otherwise. Like burls with the tenancy to fall apart. Other wise they do not NEED stabilizing. Stabilizing is a boon when you account for not having to "finish" the handle, you can just shape, sand, buff and out the door she goes. Also after stabilizing they are nearly impervious to the elements. You could even throw most into the dishwasher .
 
Here are a few comments that come from a few years back - about 15 years anyway. Since I next to never use wood now, although this might change at any time. Are we talking to encourage sales or to maintain the quality of the knife over many years of use? I had a great hunting knife business going although it was supposed to a part time thing, it seemed every day I had someone at my shop . I made a lot of double sales. One knife was for the buyer and one was for their Dad. Yes, there were many good paying jobs in the area. I was hot into the moose hunting too for several weeks and was lucky enough to have a few Buds that loved it even more than me. We would stay out for a couple of weeks on our yearly trip. In fact camp would only be a couple of hours from home but that was okay too. In the evening we would go to a place where say5 or 6 or more camps were set up. Others would come too. Folding knives were at that time not concidered to be a choice. There was never much conversation on gun makes or calibers, but lots of conversation on knives. The case should be made out to protect the maker from any chance of harm in the event of a fall or some such incident and then it should contain the knife to prevent loss. Blades were to be a fine quality stainless. Carbon steel just wasn't wanted in a climate that could be very wet and where condensation could be a common problem when going from say a warm camper to a bellow freezing temperature. Knife handles ? Well they should be out of the compressed and laminated woods such as those with names like Paka wood, Diamond wood and so forth. These were of course finished very smooth and often had much colour as well. They were easy to clean, more visible if placed on the ground and very extremely resistant to damage. I had some very fine woods I would offer but knew it was a waste of time to offer. Thong holes were not needed but if they were there, were soon only perhaps used to help keep the knife in the case. To have the knife dangeling on your wrist was a sure way to get cut. I do believe the stabilizing has done away with the a lot of use of the laminated impregnated woods and good for it. The natural woods have their own beauty. I believe the stabilizing does a lot to enhance this and the colour. As well, it requires a lot less skill to achieve fine results. Frank
 
So far I have only worked with stabilized wood (box elder and buckeye burl). I like the fact that you don't have to finish it. On the down side, it's more difficult to work with the very basic tools I use. And it stinks when you power sand it, which annoys my wife, who is sure the smell will give me cancer (even when I wear a respirator).

- Greg
 
I will clarify my definition of stabilization before continuing. Professional stabilizing equipment costs thousands of dollars. Stabilants are acrylic monomers or polymers. They are not available at Home Depot or Lowes. The stabilant is driven through the wood by using vacuum and then pressure exceeding 1,000 psi. Only a few people have the stabilants and tools to professionally stabilize.

Burl Source said:
"Should all wood be stabilized?"
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Absolutely Not.

I think wood should be stabilized if:
• The wood is improved by stabilization
• The knife will be subjected to high temperature changes
• The knife will be used in a high moisture environment
• To prevent color shift

We recently made the decision to NEVER stabilize figured blackwood. The figure of blackwood is reduced or disappears when stabilized. When polished the finish is dull.

I think some of the woods already listed in this thread should be stabilized i.e., ebony, walnut (depending on type) and bubinga.

Ebony is a horrible wood for knives and we stopped selling it a few years ago. It is a crack or split waiting to happen. It can be stabilized if the cross section is less than .375". When stabilized the cracking was significantly reduced but not eliminated. African blackwood is a much better choice.

The grain in bubinga and walnut are open. Bubinga stabilizes very well.

Some woods like osage orange do not need stabilization, Stabilization does keep the color from changing.

Look at stabilizing from the customer point of view. Will the customer be happy if the handle material changes in fit, shape or color? If not, use materials and/or processes that make your customers happy. If you don't care about your customers, do what ever you want.
 
Ebony has been used for hundreds of years (without stabilization.) When properly mounted, it does not split, check, or crack. Properly dried ebony is very stable and hard. You just have to be careful working it.
Other woods can benefit from stabilization-especially woods that are otherwise too soft or weak.
 
How do you guys feel about stabilizing woods like maple or walnut? Woods that are hard enough and not normally prone to cracking. Would it be overkill or prudent in your opinion.

Some figured woods when stabilized seem to dull down a bit. I don't think it is my imagination but when I stabilize maple burl, the figure seems to become a little higher contrast, but seems to lose a lot of the metallic shimmer or chatoyancy it had while natural. Same thing with walnut.
 
I can think of another wood that probably won't need stabilizing, it should be arriveing soon Mark.I think you are on the money, if it's soft it would probably benefit from the stabilizing, otherwise, hard,oily, well dried and sealed woods should be OK,like Gidgee.
 
Burl Source said:
.

Some figured woods when stabilized seem to dull down a bit. I don't think it is my imagination but when I stabilize maple burl, the figure seems to become a little higher contrast, but seems to lose a lot of the metallic shimmer or chatoyancy it had while natural. Same thing with walnut.
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In wood the correct term is "luster"

Loss of any luster or washed out appearance is a result of that paticular process and chemical...not an over view of properly processed material from others. We pros did not become experts over night.
 
Larry D. Davis said:
In wood the correct term is "luster"

Loss of any luster or washed out appearance is a result of that paticular process and chemical...not an over view of properly processed material from others. We pros did not become experts over night.
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Larry,
I have seen your stabilized maple and it does appear to keep it's luster while others from the big companies do not. ....care to share your secrets?
 
Burl Source said:
Larry,
I have seen your stabilized maple and it does appear to keep it's luster while others from the big companies do not. ....care to share your secrets?
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It's a misconception to think "big companies" do this except maybe Gammapar. The history of wood polymer composites goes back to the mid 1950's and it was originally developed by the USFS wood lab in 1946. Solid lumber impregnation came in about the mid 1960's. The Iowa guy is a mom and pop in his barn and the other start-ups are garage level. K&G Knife Supplies is fairly large, but they are full service supply and Ken buys burl in bulk. He has a sawmill in addition to his cutting shop, warehouse and dedicated processing areas. I have a black topped half acre with three buildings, one of which is 4000sf where I do my cutting and a portion of this building dedicated to acrylic infusing (stabilizing). I do a lot more than knife woods and here's a link to a bass guitar with one of my acrylized curly redwood fingerboards. http://www.mimf.com/cgi-bin/WebX?50@55.eowga2AsFw2.0@.2cb6c82a/0 I supplied ALL the wood for this bass which was built in Scotland. I ship world guitar wood world wide..well...I did until retiring now I'm customer selective. I have a sawmill INSIDE one building for cutting burls and high end logs out of the weather. I've cut koa, Ceylon satinwood, wenge, redwood logs to name a few. One building has burls stored in it, primarily amboyna and thuya. There are no "secrets" other than dedicated research, proper equipment, a good working relationship with chemical companies. I've yet to find a good over night wonder.

All that aside, if a seller can find customers willing to use and pay an asking price for non-stabilized wood it's all good. If a knife maker is comfortable buying and using regular wood at his level that's all good, too. Neither one should be suggesting there way is the best. Also, no seller of stabilized wood should presume that his wood is like all the others. There is not one chemical nor one process that fits all. If so called stabilizing washes out or darkens wood it could be due to dirty or re-used resin that is dark due to pigment extraction from dark woods and not because it's merely "stabilized"

If a seller of stabilized wood suggests it be "finished" instead of mere sanding and buffing to a high gloss be aware it's probably an inferior product.
 
Larry

Could you give a description of you stabilizing process? I am trying to find info on this process but seems to be very secretive.

Thanks
Jim
 
What about Afzelia? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Afzelia
I Read it is very hard and will destroy most cutting blades. Anyone ever used it? I have been researching all kinds of burls and hardwoods and this one is incredibly nice to look at.
afzeliaburl15x15x12.jpg
 
point of view from me
is stabilizing some woods that are maybe not needing it with a good sealing and finish needed
well i pin and epoxy my handles even tho i might be able to get away with jsut epoxy

jsut chalk me up to the over kill type but least i know :)
 
montana guy said:
What about Afzelia? I Read it is very hard and will destroy most cutting blades. Anyone ever used it? I have been researching all kinds of burls and hardwoods and this one is incredibly nice to look at.
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I've used afzelia quite a bit. It's not very hard really. It shapes and cuts quite well.

I got some that wasn't stabilized and it twisted and distorted quite badly. It's nice stuff to work and finished out but all of it I use now is stabilized. Just my personal experiences with it. I'm no wood expert.
 
countryboycansurvive said:
I got some that wasn't stabilized and it twisted and distorted quite badly. It's nice stuff to work and finished out but all of it I use now is stabilized. Just my personal experiences with it. I'm no wood expert.
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First, let me be clear..I do not do custom processing. I only acrylic infuse my own woods, but a lot of it!! Second, if using regular wood works for yourself that's all good. If you prefer using high quality, properly impregnated wood that's all good too. Third, there is NO wood that cannot be resin impregnated. There are systems that do not work well on some wood however.

It's also a bad misconception that "stabilizing" wood will some how remove tension in wood and make it all better...NOT!! It's not a magic process and anyone who claims it stops wood from moving is not being honest or perhaps just misinformed. :barf:


This is the sheet I send with my acrylized wood clearly stating so. It's not an opinion, but facts determined from research at the US Forest Service Wood Lab done on impregnated wood polymer composites.

ACRYLIZED WOOD produced by Gallery Hardwoods

The acrylized wood produced by Gallery Hardwoods is accomplished with a proprietary process which infuses an acrylic monomer formula thru and thru the wood (not a surface treatment) using high pressure and vacuum as part of the process. The infused wood is further processed using an initiator to polymerize the liquid resins into a solid form.

Weight, density and mass of the natural wood are greatly increased by the process as is surface wearability. The process (ours or others) is not a magic bullet which prevents total wood movement, but there is a measure of increased “stability” of the wood fiber as related to normal wood movement caused by ambient climate changes. The wood movement curve is leveled more evenly and the acrylized wood will move (if it moves) much slower and not to the extremes un-processed wood will. This is true of all “stabilized” wood regardless of the processors methods and chemicals used. Resistance to moisture and chemicals are increased and grain will not rise. Water marks can occur if the acrylized wood is soaked, but buffing will remove them.

The resulting wood polymer composite requires no finish, just sand and buff to gloss desired. Super glue works great to fill any tiny voids encountered. Use regular wood tools and wood working protocols on the acrylized wood. Acrylized wood fibers do not compress as much as regular wood so it holds carving detail better.
 
I think if you intend on never having to take care of your knives that stabilized wood (or synthetic" is the best option. I, personally think that if regular tool maintenance is a part of your regime that a non-stabilized handle would last the lifetime of the knife. Many makers use stabilized for the "look" and I agree with that, too.

So my answer to the OP's question is "No, handle wood does not NEED to be stabilized."

Do all couches need to be Scotchguarded? That's what I want to know.


Rick
 
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