single bevel HT requirements?

samuraistuart

samuraistuart

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Dec 21, 2006
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I have a request to make a single bevel kitchen knife, like a yanagiba or shashimi sort of thing. Carbon steel, maybe 52100. My thought is after the quench my blade will turn into to a paperclip, or a Slinky. I've done a little research and wanted to make sure I'm on the right track. As long as the edge thickness has been left thick(er), say .050", and several normalization cycles have been done (1650, 1550, 1450), I should be OK to go, without worrying too terribly much about warping. I know proper quench technique helps avoiding warpage too......think slicing motion, not stirring motion. Is there anything else that I need to be aware of?

What concerns me about leaving more meat on the edge pre-heat treat is my grinding method......namely....the Nicholson and Simmonds machines. It is hard enough bringing down a hardened and tempered blade that has a .020" edge on it, much less .050" with simply hand sanding. (Can't wait to get a proper grinder). I guess the best way to tackle that is just get after it with low grit paper and lot's of elbow grease, like I've been doing. Any thoughts are surely appreciated.

Thanks!
 
samuraistuart said:
I have a request to make a single bevel kitchen knife, like a yanagiba or shashimi sort of thing. Carbon steel, maybe 52100. My thought is after the quench my blade will turn into to a paperclip, or a Slinky. I've done a little research and wanted to make sure I'm on the right track. As long as the edge thickness has been left thick(er), say .050", and several normalization cycles have been done (1650, 1550, 1450), I should be OK to go, without worrying too terribly much about warping. I know proper quench technique helps avoiding warpage too......think slicing motion, not stirring motion. Is there anything else that I need to be aware of?

That sounds like a great approach, just make sure it is straight at each step. I like to use plates after the oil quench to help with straightness.

Be sure to keep stress and heat down while pre heat treat finishing. I would alternate between grinding the bevel and the back of the knife... they will take roughly the same time and I feel this helps with stress and reduces warpage.

What concerns me about leaving more meat on the edge pre-heat treat is my grinding method......namely....the Nicholson and Simmonds machines. It is hard enough bringing down a hardened and tempered blade that has a .020" edge on it, much less .050" with simply hand sanding. (Can't wait to get a proper grinder). I guess the best way to tackle that is just get after it with low grit paper and lot's of elbow grease, like I've been doing. Any thoughts are surely appreciated.

Thanks!
Click to expand...

I do my grinding post heat treat but think you will be OK.. I'll leave this part to the guys who have done a lot of stock removal by hand post heat treat. On a softer knife a file will work well but on a harder one you will need to use rougher paper.

Good luck, I hope this helps!
 
A good coarse stone will take down the bevel nicely. You can use a 3X10" DMT 100-220 grit, or just a 2-3" wide arato ( coarse water stone). do it wet either way.
 
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I have had good luck hand finishing with a combo of EDM stones, sandpaper and waterstones by the way... a DMT or rough waterstone stone sounds like the way to go for serious removal.
 
If you are using 52100 how thick of a spine you planning on having and how tall of a blade? I dont think there is any reason you should have to go with .05 edge. Knock that down to .020 max and use a slower oil or use something like canola that isnt as aggressive you could say. Yeah I know commercial quenchants are where its at and I have 5 gal of parks 50 I use on almost everything else but canola warmed up gets my 52100 as quenched at 66-67HRC and it doesnt hardly warp if you do your normalization cycles and have even grinds.

Now if your using 1095 or w2 or something then you need a faster quench IMHO.
 
Daniel and Stacy, thanks for recommending the DMT stones. I do have the ultra coarse stone....hadn't thought of using it. Will be trying it on the next one out, for sure. Quint, I think you are exactly right. 130F Canola seems to work well with 52100. I do have the Parks....but I'm leaving it for 1084, 1095, W2, CruFV. Do you really think staying with .020" on the edge is OK?
 
Ive done it. It depends on the thickness of the body as well. Ofcourse everyones experience may vary but it should be thick enough to stay straight. Just make sure to do good normalizations before the final quench and a good grind which is key. If your using stones and files you should have a nice even grind.
 
Cool....thanks Quint. I like to hear that I can leave it at around .020". Just for everyone's FYI....the thickness on spine is .110"....so just under 1/8". And yes...using files gives me nice flat bevels. I even hand sand now with my granite counter top as a backing. Clamp paper down on countertop near edge....go to town!!!!!
 
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