SK-5 Trailmaster vs. old Carbon V

[Tony_A]

What made the Carbon V Trailmaster great was its special heat treat developed by Dan Maragni. This was a very unusual heat treat for a factory knife--especially at the time.
If you ever get a hold of an old, original "Proof" videotape, it shows a bunch of Trailmasters going though it with the multiple salt bath quenches then moving on to what amounts to putting a finished Trailmaster through the ABS Journeyman Smith test--and passing.

They've never shown the newer Trailmasters being heat treated and tested to that level for....some reason

 

[jlauffer]

Would take Carbon V over SK-5 any day of the week. Seems like most of the reports of knives breaking are the SK-5 versions.

 

[jdk1]

Necrothread warning

 

[knarfeng]

The CV in 1095CV is for Chromium/Vanadium. Same as CroVan. Not Carbon V.

Just sayin...

Edit, it's also my understanding that the Carbon V moniker was applied to whatever steel they could get for a good price at any given time.

Not according to Paul Tsujimoto,

1) Cold Steel Carbon V was first produced in the Alcas Factory (Cutco and KA-BAR) Mid 1980s, Carbon V was originally 1095CV/0170-06/50100B.
2) Cold Steel moved to Ontario early 1990s. Carbon V started out as 1095CV/0170-06/50100B but while at Ontario, Dan Maragni removed the small amount of nickel from the formula.
3) Cold Steel moved to Camillus approx. 1995. Carbon V stayed 0170-06 minus the nickel.
How do I know all of this?...I worked at all 3 factories.

Paul Tsujimoto
Sr Eng
Prod Dev and Qual
KA-BAR Knives

 

[tlcrawford]

Carbon V > SK-5

The old US made Carbon V is superior to the current SK-5 offering from Cold Steel.

A bold statement said like a. Expert. I’m curious “why” as opposed to opinion. Thank you in advance for sharing further to help educate those of us considering either option.

 

[tlcrawford]

Not according to Paul Tsujimoto,

Would you mind sharing what benefits / drawbacks. There are specifically to knife steel by removing that small amount of nickel you mentioned?

 

[Alberta Ed]

It would be pretty hard to tell the difference in real life use, IMHO. Lynn Thomson spent a lot of time and effort developing a special heat treat for his Carbon V, using molten salts, I understand. It's a very tough high carbon steel, one of my favorites, judging by my several CS knives in that steel: Master Hunter, SRK, Twistmasters, Red River Elk Skinner. Given equivalent heat treats they both should perform well.

 

[KenHash]

Cold Steel hasn't offered a knife in Carbon V since 2006. And no Trail Master in SK5 since 2014 or thereabouts when they switched to 01. Which in turn has already gone extinct. While it's all very interesting as a discussuon I tend to think the subject title has lost it's relevance in 2023.
Today CS offers the Trail Master only in San Mai III and CPM 3V.

 

[SwissHeritageCo]

I'm happy to see this thread resurrected because I was just watching videos on Cold Steel's SK-5 the other night in reference to the SRK.

I watched a video of the old "Carbon V" steel version being abused to hell and taking it like a champ, followed by countless videos of the SK-5 version breaking It would seem it's not all just hype, which is weird considering the amounts of abuse my Hultafors in SK-5 steel has taken? I'll probably still pick up an SRK in SK-5 for the kit I was making anyway but it makes me appreciate the old ungetable Carbon V.

Edit to add - does anyone know what the HRC is on Cold Steel's SK-5?

 

[KenHash]

I have "heard" that Cold Steel runs HRC 58/60 on their SK5 products, although the steel itself is capable of HRC 65.
But this is just heresay. Haven't seen it specifically written anywhere.

 

[knarfeng]

Would you mind sharing what benefits / drawbacks. There are specifically to knife steel by removing that small amount of nickel you mentioned?

Sorry. Outside my knowledge base.
There are several texts which say that a small amount of nickel will increase toughness, but I was told it also affects the heat treating protocols (dwell times and temperatures.) What else it does was not discussed.

Dan Maragni was the big gun metallurgist who had a lifetime of experience controlling the heat treating operations of major cutlery companies back in the day when alloy steels were commonly used for blades instead of straight carbon steel as is common today for non-stainless blades.