Skinning knife

L

lupin

Joined
Jan 4, 2007
Messages
10
Merry Christmas everyone,

I was out with a friend skinning some beavers over the weekend. I used some of his knives and could not help but notice how fast some of them became dull. I got them sharp using a dmt fine, extra fine followed by a 4000 Norton but after 45-55 minutes of skinning, it's back to the sharpening. The blade angle is 10 degrees (total) on most of the knives while a few are closer to 20 degrees. The blade material varied from knife to knife, one was made out of what he called key knife (your basic cutting steel from the local lumber mill), another was 440c and the others were unidentified.

I am curious... what would be the ideal steel for a skinning knife? The blade doesn't need to flex so a high rockwell could easily be accepted. What would keep it's edge the longest? Any recommendations of skinning knives already available on the market?

Thanks

Éric
 
I like 1095 high carbon steel. It might not stay sharp as long as s30v or ats34, but just a few swipes across the steel will bring back the edge. I have never liked 440c its ok, but harder to touch up in the field. For stainless, I like vg10 or 12c27.
 
Hi Lupin,Welcome to Bladeforums :)

Check out this thread

Rich is a great guy to deal with.Drop him a PM or email.His BF name is richardj

Good Luck :)
 
There are several steels that will hold an edge well and for a longer period of time but are harder to sharpen. Others won't stay sharp as long, but are much easier to touch up.

My personal choice for a hunter/skinner is D2. Most people have a favorite and a good reason for liking it. The steel makes a difference but the heat treat is what seperates one knife from another. The best steel with a poor heat treat will be nearly worthless. A mediocre steel with a really good heat treat will likely serve you very well.

SDS
 
For skinning and caping, I prefer a Buck Diamondback or Guthook. All are 420HC stainless and will resharpen pretty easily while keeping an adequate edge.

Diamondback Outfitter, 4" blade...
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Diamondback Outfitter guthook, 4" blade...
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Diamondback Guide, 3" blade...
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Diamondback Guide guthook, 3" blade...
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Caping knife, 3-1/2" blade...
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Camo version...
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For a non-stainless (carbon) version, I recommend a Mora Clipper. I actually would recommend it before any of the other knives I listed...
840.jpg
 
I found a blade to use this year. At Wal-Mart, they sell two packs of Stanley break off razor blades with yellow handles. I use the small one for caping, and the large one for de-boning. They cost about three bucks for a two pack and I can complete four deer per pack. If you think about it, when you are skinning, boning and caping you generally only use the tip of your knife, about an inch or so for the most part. With these you just break the blade away as it dulls. I'm sold. I hate to admit that such a cheap non-custom blade has replaced all my other skinning blades, but it has... I still carry the cool ones for everything else though ;)
 
The knives are used exclusively for skinning beaver,muskrat,marten,mink,fox, linx etc... they are never used as a hunting knife. Getting metal stock is essential due to the fact that he makes his own pull type scrappers to take the fat of the pelts.

The fella I was with, was telling me of a knife he bumped of the table. The blade broke upon impact of the blade on the ground. He said that knife was his favorite. It held an edge longer then any of the other knives he has. I assume it to be some sort of custom knife made from metal out of the local lumber mill, probably something very brittle so maybe high Rockwell. What would be the best material for making such a knife?

I don't imagine anyone is heat treating the blades here... I doubt the service is available so far up north. Is there such a thing as an easily heat treatable steel?

Thanks again,

Éric

p.s. JTR357, that's a great looking knife! How much did that cost you if you don't mind my asking?
 
S30v or D2 would be my choices followed by 1095. The first two are good at holding an edge the last is easy to sharpen.
 
High hardness and wear resistance, very thin edge geometry... Sounds like you aught to talk with Tom Krein.

If you're talking about just sourcing materials for making/having such a knife made, there are a number of guys who swear by grinding them out of power hacksaw blades made from nearly full-hard M2. (Not bi-metal blades!) Don't have time to find back the source I was thinking of, but you might get some ideas near the very bottom of this page: some discussion on M2 hacksaw blades
 
Dozier is a wizard at heat treating and putting the best edge on his D2 blades. Check out the K-16 & 17 skinners. I have the KS-3 Professional Guides Knife just because I like the longer 4.75" blade. I used to always take with me when I could still hunt.
 
the possum said:
High hardness and wear resistance, very thin edge geometry... Sounds like you aught to talk with Tom Krein.

If you're talking about just sourcing materials for making/having such a knife made, there are a number of guys who swear by grinding them out of power hacksaw blades made from nearly full-hard M2. (Not bi-metal blades!) Don't have time to find back the source I was thinking of, but you might get some ideas near the very bottom of this page: some discussion on M2 hacksaw blades
Click to expand...


Power hacksaw blades.... I think that is what my buddy said the knife he broke was made out of... I'll see if I can get my hands on some of those. I don't imagine they are recycled when they no longer cut... The mills must throw those out by the dozen. Thanks.
 
Earlier in the spring I bought a Spyderco Street Beat because I thought it'd make a great skinner. This years elk hunt proved that it really is.

The VG10 steel stayed sharp through out the whole gutting, skinning and boning out of a cow elk. Works for me.
 
johnny reb said:
I like 1095 high carbon steel. It might not stay sharp as long as s30v or ats34, but just a few swipes across the steel will bring back the edge. I have never liked 440c its ok, but harder to touch up in the field. For stainless, I like vg10 or 12c27.
Click to expand...

JTR357 said:
Check out this thread

Rich is a great guy to deal with.Drop him a PM or email.His BF name is richard j
Click to expand...

Good advice. 1095 or other carbon steels will give you a great fine edge that can be touched up very quickly in the field when necessary, AND toughness in case of mishandling.

richard j makes an excellent skinner. The edge is assymetrical convex which he can (or you) resharpen but it lasts a long time and stropping alone will restore the edge in the field. I have one that I've stropped on a pants leg but that's not a fair test since it was still very sharp anyway.

Since you'd be using it on smaller animals, you can talk to him about the size and shape of the blade, and the handle materials. He's not pulling a stock model off the shelf, he makes each knife to a customer's specs.
 
Contact richard j I have one of his knives. I have been using it a lot for testing. I have been cutting a bunch of Sisal rope and cardboard. It holds a great edge. I have not sharpened it since he sent it to me to me in June. He uses paper wheels to maintain his edge without having to remove any metal. Check out this link for more info on them.
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=578787

I plan to try a set for myself here soon. He has been sharpening for 17 years with the wheels and knows his stuff. :thumbup:
 
If I remember correctly, Richard hardens his blades into the 63 HRc hardness range. The steel he uses, 1075 or something similar, is well suited to a high hardness with a low edge angle. If I read the post right, you are using knives with 10-20 degree inclusive edge angles. This is quite thin compared to what most people use, which is typically 30-40 degrees inclusive. D2 and 440C can have issues with edges that thin due to the carbides breaking out of the edge. If you can tolerate a larger angle, 15 degrees per side/30 degrees inclusive or more, these would likely hold a longer edge for you. If not, consider D2, as it can have a self sharpening property when sharpened to edges of 8-10 degrees inclusive. The carbides break out, and leave something of a serrated edge that is still good for slicing cuts on meat or cardboard and such. 440C and the others may do this as well, but I dont know of anyone who's tried it. D2 tends to run a little harder than the other steels, so edge holding with it will most likely be better. I have a knife from M2 steel ground from a hacksaw blade like described above. I have dropped it, thrown it, and hit test pieces with a hammer. Its not as brittle as the high Rockwell hardness of 64-65 HRc would indicate. I dropped mine onto the concrete driveway and dulled the tip, then threw it (accidentally) into a large piece of steel, and the tip finally gave up, but I still only lost about 1/16" or less. If you can find some, have a go at it. Its possible to do, but they are difficult to overheat by grinding your own, since the tempering temperature is around 900 degrees F. Mine is 1/16" thick, but you can find them thinner if you dig around. They would seem to be tailor made to your requirements. High hardness and wear resistance, thin, and can handle very low edge angles for the type of work you are doing. The lowest I've seen was around 8-9 degrees inclusive on a cow skinning knife.
 
Thanks everyone,

The 440C knife was the worst one in the bunch.... It didn't hold an edge very long.I can get it shaving sharp.... it just will not hold it very long.The beavers just seem harder on that particular knife. The mystery knives seem better then the 440C knife. One is a Zepf (carbon steel I think) and the other is a custom knife made out of mystery steel from the plywood mill. The two last knives weren't bad but they just did not get to the performance level his broken knife had.
 
Are you checking for a wire edge on the 440C? That would account for sharpness dropping off rapidly, as the wire edge flops over.
 
Esav Benyamin said:
Are you checking for a wire edge on the 440C? That would account for sharpness dropping off rapidly, as the wire edge flops over.
Click to expand...

The sharpness drops off faster then the other knife he uses primarily, it still holds an edge for a considerable amount of time, just not as much as the other knife he uses and the one he broke off.
 
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