Slipjoint Ramblings - Critical

[300Bucks]

I get over in the Traditional forum and see all the well finished, nice scaled and highest quality steel slipjoints from other companies and I yearn for a top level Buck slipjoint. One that you would give as a special gift or you would buy for yourself because you could.

They were telling some beginner the best quality stockman to get for his first slipjoint and all I had to offer was Dymondwood or black "plastic".

I remembered the 303 Waterbuffalo scale is still being sold so I through my 2 cents in and showed a photo of it.

After doing that I decided life was too short to not frequently carry a high quality pocketknife, so I got me another 303 Buff.

Well, when it arrived the differences in finsih from my first made me have a critical look at both and consider the problems as they related to my want and desire to have a Buck equal to any of the 'fancy' stockmen in the Traditional Forum.

Here are three photos and my critical review of them in my "state-of-wanting".

Looks pretty good but look at the difference in the polished area above the bevel grind and also noticed the nail nics are different sized. On a limited edition knife I would hope for more polish on most surfaces. Yes, it costs more but we are not paying 5 and dime prices for these limited editions.

Here's the reverse, noticed that the partial jigging spots had bolster edges rounded off in the depression. I think I would like mine sharp with scale thick enough it could be polished down to bolster level. The partial jigged areas next to the bolster were "messed up" by the bolster polishing. Notice difference in nail nic size. Front scales look better in both knives ?

Photo of bottom view. Yes there is variance in natural materials, but I would want my scale thick enough that it could be buffed down on ends so that no jigged depression were against bolster edge.

Are these differences being picky when your don't like them? Is the edge too toothy?

Well, I throw this around because several times in various threads the want by not only me but others for a really nice stockman that looks like granddads knife has been voiced.

I promoted the 303 to the new person on the Traditionals Forum and now I wish I could have been just a little morre assured that if he got one he would have been happy.

I will set the thick scale buff back and EDC the thin scale. Will polish up the toothy edges on the blades and put some Flitz on a piece of leather and polish up the grind marks on the bevels.

We Buck Nuts believe in the company, I just want a slipjoint that as good as any one elses and can sit beside the fanciest 110 and hold it's head up high.

Am I damned for being critical I hope not, it was just my personal experience and my continued yearning for knife I could feel rich carrying........300bucks

 

[110 Dave]

no i dont hold you are condemned for expecting better..
poop happens in small towns and big city's alike!
jest keep in mind that they do the best they can and will make it right !
they may have a person new to that dept who does not know yet what should be

and i think Joe will take notice of these and also
that Bill Keys will take notice!
they need to know what gets by the QC..
i noted the gap by the spring and the sides on both knives
send the one with the grind not even with the back of the main blade back..
that hits me in the eye more then the other issues.. JMHO
Joe will most likely pick out a keeper for you!

 

[jb4570]

Craig,

Let me be the first to say this. Send the thin one back to Joe. Send him a print out of this post. If you are not happy with it send it back for them (Buck) to meet your expectations. You are a collector and your eye is sharper than the average Joe knife user. If you are unhappy with it, you will always be unhappy with it and it will leave a bad taste in your mouth for ever more. You are not being critical, you are just asking to get what you paid for. You know Buck's customer service is second to none and they will take care of this for you.
jb4570

 

[STDK]

300, yes both knives do show flaws that would have me sending them back to Buck considering the money I spent on them. Also it would make me consider whether to recommend or not. I hate having to send back a new knife. It just adds more money into a knife I expected to first quality in the first place. Also, I have noticed this in Bucks full line up and not just in the 300 series, which are my favorite Bucks. I am sure Buck will fix this. But first they need to know there is a problem. Send it back to Joe.

 

[chickentrax]

Excellent point about the jigging being done into the bolsters...I noticed this on other bigger Bucks as well......

 

[Buck_110]

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[Tin Sue]

these excuses have quite literally been well exhausted; and for a long time now. This seems to be the answer for everything; and for several years now. A brand new knife should not have to be returned to the factory for problems/issues. Period!

amen!!

 

[jb4570]

jb4570,
My response below is NOT aimed at you personally. It's merely a response to the zillionth time those statements have been uttered.

These excuses have quite literally been well exhausted; and for a long time now. This seems to be the answer for everything; and for several YEARS now. A brand new knife should not have to be returned to the factory for problems/issues. PERIOD! Upon purchasing a brand new Buck knife, the very next thing should not be packing it up, going to the post office, and paying more money to fix problems that should NOT exist. Keep in mind these are brand spanking new! Brand new! Buck should send pre-paid postage labels to customers to rectify problems with brand new knives. After all, problems with brand new knives can only be the fault of Buck. It's only fair. If this were the case, I would bet my last dollar quality would return to what it was in El Cajon. The money that would be spent on return postage could be used to employ a quality control department.

It's sad. It truly is, as nobody loves Buck knives more than myself. I grew up with a gun, fishing rod, and 110 in my hand. I personally hate the fact that quality has dried up at Buck. I would LOVE to order a brand new custom 110 or 110 variant. But I don't. The only non-user Buck knives I buy are the ones that are already made. I wish their knives exhibited the quality they once did. As long as non-knife people are making knives, the quality of yesterday will never return...never. Look at all the "lunchbox knives" that came out of El Cajon. Those people were knife folks. How many people at the Post Falls factory even know what a "lunchbox knife" is?

Buck 110,

I can't help but take your edit of my post as anything other than personal. I think your comments don't belong here (Buck forum) and should have been made in the "G, B, & U forum.

I did not state that this knife should have been shipped in this condition, nor did I state the 300 should keep this knife in this condition. I'm happy to see the very nice comparison photo's as it may draw some attention where it is needed. However, this is not the correct place for bashing BKI.
jb4570

 

[Buck_110]

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[rifon2]

I personally hate the fact that quality has dried up at Buck. I would LOVE to order a brand new custom 110 or 110 variant. But I don't. The only non-user Buck knives I buy are the ones that are already made. I wish their knives exhibited the quality they once did.

The OP's points regarding his new slipjoint knife are clearly well taken.

But I was very pleased with the quality of the Kalinga S30V folder, Kalinga S30V fixed blade, and 420HC variants of both which I picked up about a year ago. Plus several other Buck's I've bought since the move from El Cajon. (No slipjoints, though.) Not to mention the many, many posts I've read here on BF and elsewhere praising the work coming out of present day BKI.

So I don't think that a general bashing of Post Falls Buck quality is in order.

 

[jb4570]

As I stated, it's not personal. I never said you thought it should be shipped the way it is. It's a response to the same excuse always given for brand new knives that should have never shipped in the first place: "Just send it back".

You are not worth the time it will take to reply to your comments again. You don't get it and never will.

jb4570

 

[Buck_110]

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[110 Dave]

now now ,, we can agree to disagree..
and express the same thing in less or stronger words
ole time quality.. my first buck 110 was in 1967
the knife today is a Vastly Improved knife over what i bought in 67
the knife of today for the price is a bargain to what was paid jest 15 years ago.
and the company is different then it was at one time.
and most the buying public does not know what to expect in a knife..
it is a tool only not a possible work of art..
we expect higher quality then the ave joe on a higher then normal priced knife
= we pay more and we expect more then production quality on a expensive knife

i do happen to know that 110 was/is a hard core 110 collector..
he has a LOT of knowledge and hard core DATA & RECORDS and
Joe has used it to make his dating charts more arcurate !
and even tho he is a little a-nel for things his knowledge is highly respected by me

and he does express his thoughts strongly, as i have also been known to do..
he gets it i belive
but he strongly feels that they should not leave the factory unless 100%
dont think he meant to up set you JB .. and i hope you wont take offense with his strong wording..
(* yes he could tone it down as i also needed to do at times)
i used to be ready to have a verbal fight over others strong words and defending buck..
but folks felt as strongly as i did, and they had the right to express how they felt..

you pointed out that 300 has an eye for what a slippie should be!
he is agreeing with you as i also do..
we all here would educate a newbie as to what to look for

110 also has high standards and become disillusioned with the drop in quality on
some knives he ordered jest after the relocation become known ...as many of us noticed..

he is used to dealing with standards that browning and weatherbe set for fine firearms
he sold off a lot of his treasured knives and i did buy some as did many here..
i was glad to get what he considered a cast off!

and 110 you are welcome to express you thoughts ..
abet as i learned mayhapps a bit less strong words
it jest dont need to get to a slinging contest were Trax gets out the popcorn!
edit: btw any one seen the chicken and does he have out the popcorn?

 

[300Bucks]

I had hoped to stimulate comments on my questions and musings. Which occurred to some degree. I hope no one gives up communications, opinion voiced with common sense and without agression or vulgarity should always be welcomed. That said here is another communication from me.

I had been moved to show my knives because they were limited additions costing over double the cost of standard models and their differnces and my 'critical' eye for flaws was stirred because I had two of them and both had issues in my mind. I was discussing the knives which in turn needed the discussion of the flaws. I also expressed my desire for BUCK knife of the highest quality, one equal to other limited run knives from makers like Schatt & Morgan, GEC, Moore Man or Canal Street. Or even near to a custom slipjoint. My desire to put my Buck slipjoints up beside those was shaken by the supposed flaws I preceived. Ok, thats where we were and now we are going on.

Here is a close-up photo of the Buffalo 303 and another 303 which is well finished, highly polished my only desire would be for better scale and the assurance the steel is of high quality. Remember I am wanting a rich mans knife, a knife I can give as a special gift, a knife like grandpas to be carefully used and passed down.

Could you tell the higher finished 303 was the first China Buck issued......

Here a a group photo of a pearl 303, the mentioned China Buck and the Buffalo 303 for comparison. If the blades on the pearl were polished and maybe of special steel it is fitted well enough to be a rich man's knife.

Now here is a photo of three 303s that are not availabe except aftermarket that have good rich man's possibilities. I would have to say the LE with jigged bone and the medallion is the best finshed 303 Stockman that Buck has ever made or issued.

Nothing is wrong with the Stag scale either, except that it would be harder to maintain quality control with the variations inherent in stag scales. The time to match scale sides and hand finish the knife would drive it out of most of our price range. I am guessing multi-hundred(s).

The last photo is of the highest quality slipjoint knife Buck ever produced. It is of the highest finish and quality, polished to my satisfaction, but it is an odd single blade design.

Along side it is an old Schrade contract 303 from 1967 the standard by which all Buck 303 slipjoints are judged. You say then why aren't you satisified with that one. I am but there is no guarantee that everyone could find one. That and the fact ' I want something different in blade an scale than standard issues of the past.

So, I might be too critical of the knives I have, being a collector an all (this is a joke on self), I have sent back knives to Joe and he has done me right, one or two only so far.
I would like to agree a little with 110 here, I am not really any more of an expert than the person putting them in the boxes. They see enough each day they ought to be able to make the call so you and me don't have too.

I am still 300Bucks, I still am a Buck Nut, I still believe in the people and the company. I would just like to have a polished, high steel stockman in nice yellow scale or pearl or bone, chipped if possible. I may send the Buffalo back, I am weighting the issues as of right now it will be a EDC of a lower level than ' A Rich Man's Knife"
300bucks

 

[jb4570]

I get it just fine! I'm not allowed to disagree with you, and I should by no means make a comment unless it is what you want to hear.

Buck 110,

I apologize to you for my comments. It seems that I am the only one who was offended by your comments. This is a free country and you can say whatever you want.
jb4570

 

[Voltron]

Buck 110,

I apologize to you for my comments. It seems that I am the only one who was offended by your comments. This is a free country and you can say whatever you want.
jb4570

I don't know if this will smooth things over in the forum here, but I kind've see what Buck 110 is saying. I am a slippie kind've guy too, and recently have not been impressed with their slipjoint knives. Their IMPORTED stuff is great, believe it or not, but their domestic slippies? Not so much. Granted, there are a few that are good, but that should be the rule, not the exception, you know? I can see where he gets upset about the whole "send it back, they'll take care of you". Oh, they absolutely will, but damn, why have to send a knife back? You know? I've bought new knives, I know what it feels like to want to get it home, to use it, to play with it!! We all have. It's like being a kid again on Christmas morning!! However, now we have to send our new toy back. Man, that sucks!! LOL. Not sure if he was bashing, though, I just think he was trying to let them know, as a consumer, that "Hey, we need more QC!!". I see nothing wrong with that. I also see how jb4570 would get defensive about Buck's comments. If someone talked down about something I felt strongly about, I'd fire back as well. I just think we are all really passionate about our knives, and it comes out in our writing. In the end, though, i think we are all on the same team. We want our Bucks to be top shelf, and continue to have their great reputation.
That's a good thing, no?

 

[Buck_110]

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[silenthunterstudios]

I really like the 301 and 303 designs. However, with the great folders coming from GEC and Queen, I haven't really ever hold on to one of those designs.

Two of my favorite folders are my Mayo TNT collaboration and 501 buffalo horn model. Buck still isn't using premium steel on the 501, but the fit and finish are great! Also, these are the only Bucks I own. Their 30* line is great, I just want to see some different, higher quality offerings.

 

[chickentrax]

it jest dont need to get to a slinging contest were Trax gets out the popcorn!
edit: btw any one seen the chicken and does he have out the popcorn?

No, no popcorn here...Long posts make me lethargic...

I am surprised; it's usually me criticizing Buck's lack of quality control...(and you waving the pom-poms)...I guess those were the first people/first department laid off/closed down...

Only thing I have to say here is that my slip-joints are all Case or Schrade...I have my eye on a nice two-blade Case at Ace Hardware...not sure the model...Haven't seen a Buck slip-joint as nice...but now that Wal-Mart will no longer be carrying the Buck line, maybe they'll get some nice Case models in...

 

[Buck_110]

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