Smallest shoulders?

T

Tin.Man

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Sep 5, 2010
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im working on my first hidden tang knife. Stoked for every step, would it be feasible if say the blade was 1/8" thick, to use 1/16" of a step to stop the guard? Would that size shelf be stron enough?

Appreciate the help and hopefully that makes sense hard to describe in words.
 
It sounds like you are talking about the sides of the blade when the only step is the edges where it has the shoulder from the spine and ricasso down to the tang. The thickness is not varied at all T Tin.Man
 
If you have the skill to mill the guard out with small tolerances like that, I say go for it. It will be plenty strong. I do guards by hand, and it took me a few times to get the hang of it, and to get tight tolerances
 
I disagree with Shane. If you mill 1/16" off each side of a 1/8" tang you have removed the tang. 1/8" is a good tang thickness, so I would not even consider any shelf on the side.

Remember to taper the tang a bit from the ricasso to the tang end. You want the guard to just snug up as it reaches the ricasso shoulders.

Learning to fit a snug guard is an important part of making a quality knife. Take your time, file in small amounts, and don't be afraid of making a new guard if the first one doesn't fit well. The biggest reason a guard fits poorly ids if you fit it =before HT and final sanding. The blade will be smaller in thickness after the final sanding and polishing work, do the fitting only once the blade is completed all but sharpening the edge.
 
i am confused if tinman is speaking of guard shoulders, the curved part from the tang to the base of the ricasso, or if he means a ledge on the ricasso which will cover the guard/ ricasso joint.
 
Stacy E. Apelt - Bladesmith said:
I disagree with Shane. If you mill 1/16" off each side of a 1/8" tang you have removed the tang. 1/8" is a good tang thickness, so I would not even consider any shelf on the side.

Remember to taper the tang a bit from the ricasso to the tang end. You want the guard to just snug up as it reaches the ricasso shoulders.

Learning to fit a snug guard is an important part of making a quality knife. Take your time, file in small amounts, and don't be afraid of making a new guard if the first one doesn't fit well. The biggest reason a guard fits poorly ids if you fit it =before HT and final sanding. The blade will be smaller in thickness after the final sanding and polishing work, do the fitting only once the blade is completed all but sharpening the edge.
Click to expand...

I believe he is referring to the shoulders at the guard. I could be wrong.

OP is this what you're talking about?
 

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OK, I see that he could be talking about that.

His 1/8" thickness measurement threw me. It is superfluous if referring to the shoulder. The blade/tang width would be what determined the shoulder depth.
 
Guard shoulders yes sorry for the confusion. I have no issues grinding bevels. I have access to a machine shop and water jet. I'm trying to get the smallest shoulders feasibly possible so I can fit up the guard then wrap the handle so when it's wrapped the top edge of the handle is in line with the spine of the blade. Cause I'm OCD like that...
 
Also yes 1/8" stock thickness. I.e. A smaller slot then using 1/4" stock. So a shoulder 1/16" and using g10 or brass as my guard material thing that is a strong enough shoulder?
 
With your description of what you're trying to accomplish I think the concern is less about the strength of the shoulder and more about the strength of the guard.

Unless I misunderstand and you don't intend for the guard to also be in line with the spine of the knife, a 1/16" wall thickness from your tang slot to guard edge would be pushing the limits of those materials imo.
 
OK, I understand him.

He wants to make a knife with a wrapped handle - say a tanto. The shoulders should be the depth of the thickness of the wrap. That way, when the tang is wrapped, the visual line from handle to blade will be continuous.

Tin man - measure your wrap material and use that as the depth of the shoulders. The other concern is that the 1/8" sides of the tang may be a bit thin and flat when wrapped. Gluing a piece of leather, wood, or other filler on each side will thicken the handle profile. You can file/sand the top and bottom rounded before you wrap to keep the transition right. A simple soft wood like bass or alder wood works fine for this.

I wrap tanto and hunter handles with paracord the way you are planning. I often put a piece of leather or stingray skin under the cord for background.. The cord is about 1/8" thick, so the finished handle is a nice slim 3/8" or so.

A look at Adam's nice handle on his knife in this thread will make it clear:
http://www.bladeforums.com/threads/...e-tang-non-traditional.1497182/#post-17203131
 
AVigil said:
qqbdMB3.jpg
Click to expand...

Here is the handle . ( I just figured out that the new system allows you to quote a post from a different thread)
 
Yeah Stacy you got it. Already planning on thickening the handle with g10. The thread (hemp cord) it is 2mm so you think a 1/16" shoulder would be strong enough to hold the guard on?
 
2mm is .075", so a 1/16" (.065") shoulder should be just right, as it allows for some flattening as you pull it tight.

A trick is to shape the handle thickener slabs before you install the guard. Tack them on with a small drop of CA glue at each end. Shape with the grinder or files, and when done, place in the freezer for a couple hours, then take out and give a hard rap with a mallet, or just wedge a knife blade under one end. They should pop right off. Clean off the glue residue, then you install your guard and scales. I would put them both on at the same time, as the scales should bolster the guard snugly and make for perfect alignment. Since you are doing a wrap, there is no need for pins.
 
Stacy feel like your always on here helping, just wanted to say I really appreciate it! Thank you

Genius about shaping then adding them to snug up the guard
 
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