Smelting question?

[Overmountain]

I know this is a little off topic, or a little more directed toward the smelting crowd, but....

A local blacksmith and I have been asked about doing some knives made from local materials. Here we have Iron Mountain, and as the name implies, it is a source of iron ore. From that, we plan to do a bloom for the blade steel. (Other materials are local hardwoods, recovered copper, locally sourced leather etc.) He is intimately familiar with the process, but I have only done ome smelt. But, he has never added anything to the ore, thus the query.

My question is whether or not steel filings from the shop can be thrown in with the bloom. I use a magnet to pick up the metal shavings from drilling, cutting and grinding (mostly 1095). They stay in their own can and is quite full at this point... I know it kinda taints the locally sourced part of it, but what effect would it have on the final product? Will it melt and flow down properly? Will it cause an undesireable finished product? Just trying to find something to do with it besides dump it.

Thanks. Hoping this thread actually gets an answer. My last two have apparently stumped the forum which is strange... :what:
-Eric.

 

[mete]

The sweepings will be contaminated with abrasive particles , dirt ,etc. Is that what you want ?

 

[Overmountain]

The sweepings will be contaminated with abrasive particles , dirt ,etc. Is that what you want ?

I've picked em up with a magnet so abrasive particles are at a minimum. The vast majority are drilling/machining chips and curls. A little oily but not dirty. I figured since the ore is partially dirty as well the few abrasive particles wouldn't matter much. The only smelt I've done, the dirt turned to a glassy material on top of the mix, stuck to the side and even ran out a little with the slag. Kinda figured any abrasive particles or dirt that may be in there would do the same. Assuming their lighter than steel/iron, right? Was going to pick it bit by bit with a magnet again and mix it in...

If it is gonna even potentially be an issue I will skip it... Just trying to find something to do with that stuff. According to my friend, he figures we should have a good 59-60# 'ingot' when done as it is.

 

[Salem Straub]

I wouldn't do that, personally... mainly because I'd want the results to tell me purely about how the ore itself, and the process worked. Throwing in random bits of shop swarf might detract from finding out how that ore works, and make results less repeatable. For instance, you won't know what the carbon content might truly have been without it, and therefore how to adjust your fuel ratio or firing time/temps next time to improve your bloom.

I'd just throw all that schmutz in the scrap metal bin and haul it to the recycler with everything else when you've got enough.

 

[sunshadow]

I would advise against it. The first smelt at Kevin Cashen's he added some forging scale, which as near as we can tell added just enough nickel and other alloying trace elements that it developed one blister that took forever to stay down. I still rib him about how only he could make bloom steel into mystery metal ;D

-Page

 

[Overmountain]

I wouldn't do that, personally... mainly because I'd want the results to tell me purely about how the ore itself, and the process worked. Throwing in random bits of shop swarf might detract from finding out how that ore works, and make results less repeatable. For instance, you won't know what the carbon content might truly have been without it, and therefore how to adjust your fuel ratio or firing time/temps next time to improve your bloom.

I'd just throw all that schmutz in the scrap metal bin and haul it to the recycler with everything else when you've got enough.

That's what I was concerned about, thanks. Didn't consider how much 2-3# of scrap could alter a 65# bloom, but in considering percentages and the amount a little tweak or two can change things I think you are spot on. And yes, we would like to be able to tell how the ore itself is performing... Thanks...

I would advise against it. The first smelt at Kevin Cashen's he added some forging scale, which as near as we can tell added just enough nickel and other alloying trace elements that it developed one blister that took forever to stay down. I still rib him about how only he could make bloom steel into mystery metal ;D

-Page

And that. Thanks Page. It would be my luck that would happen to me. But it would be 15 blisters... In retrospect, it might not all be 10xx steels... I forgot about some stainless, and 15n20 in damascus and that I had worked with a bit too. Hence, I'd probably have some nickel and other alloying metals in with it as well.

Thanks guys. Thats made my decision easy. Cheers.

-Eric

 

[Rick Marchand]

Am I wrong in thinking that most alloying and carbon content is burned out of grinding dust?

 

[12345678910]

Am I wrong in thinking that most alloying and carbon content is burned out of grinding dust?

It's burned into scale,metallic oxides but if you sweep it up and reduce it (in a smelt with all that carbon charcoal)
you may be able to get it back to a metallic element just like you're doing with iron ore ferric oxide.

The temperatures of the alloy oxides may be different from the iron ones buy maybe in the same neighbourhood.

 

[JMJones]

Like others have said and it appears you have decided, I would not do it on a run when you are trying to figure things out. That being said, saving it up and doing a run on its own for the hell of it sounds interesting.