So I want to try my hand at knife making.....

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lightfootE

Joined
Mar 12, 2013
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well, as I get older (im not old yet, 25), I am finding that I have to start building all of my toys. Not only do I love my hobbies and what they entail, I love making things( I should have been a designer or engineer or sorts.) I especially like making myself toys (complex fishing lures, gun stocks, bows, sheaths, and other knick nacks).

I have always wanted to make knives but never spent the time to research how it was done. I think I can figure out everything I want to do..... except the heat treating. I don't have high temp kiln, as most people don't. And I don't plan to buy one anytime soon. What is the best steel for the do it yourselfer to heat treat at home using just a hot bed of coals and a blower? And what is the best process in that scenario? I'd like to use some of the higher end stainless like cpm 154 but fear those may not be for the at home knife maker. Just looking for a few pointers or information on heat treating at home. I have access to thick aluminum if plate quenching is something that might be worth doing? Do I need stainless foil?

thanks for any info, I might just be in over my head here if a controlled, high, temp kiln is necessary.

Eric Lightfoot
 
I would suggest you send out for heat treat, there are many shops who do a great job and its not real expensive. There is some lost time involved mail there--ht -- mail back but you get a professional job without having to invest in equipment. If you are going to use a forge or other for ht I recommend 1084 carbon steel, CPM 154 is a good stainless but needs to be done in a controlled environment, like all stainless.
 
Agree^^^^^ if you want to make a knife with just air, fire, and coal 1084 is pretty much the easiest most forgiving steel there is. You've came to the right place to find out how to make a knife, there are many many knowledgable folks here that have many years experience making knives. Don't hesitate to ask a question my friend. And welcome to the forum. :0)
 
thanks for the welcome. disappointed to hear that outsourcing for HT is the best option. Kind of takes some of the romance out of making a knife from scratch. How good of a steel is 1084? Is it just a beginner steel or is it commonly used? What is the proper at home ht sequence? Bring to red hot and check with a magnet, quench in oil, temper in the oven?

Makes me wonder how in the hell they made swords and what not back in the middle ages. Samurai's, how in the hell did they figure this stuff out? Amazing
 
With a good heat treat 1084 is actually a pretty darn good steel. It may not be stainless, and it may not have the impact toughness or other high end characteristics of some super steels, but there is nothing wrong with it. It sometimes gets a bad wrap as a "beginner steel" but all around I feel that it is a great steel for the price and just happens to be easier for a beginner to HT. All my knives so far hav been out of 1084 and W2 which are both fairly simple steels compaired to others, and they have all performed very well. Aldo Bruno is the man for 1084.
 
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They had a thousand years to work on it.

1084 is a quality steel that makes excellent blades. It is recommended for people that are new to the craft because of its forgiving nature when it comes to heat treating. You can harden at home as well as temper this steel. Use the family oven; advice, clean the oil off before hand, makes for a smokey house if you don't.

Read the stickies for specific heat treating schedules for your choice of steels.

Have fun, Fred
 
this is gona be fun, guess I'm hunting down some 1084. Already drew up the design I'm going for on the first knife. I'll check the stickies for recipes. How does 1084 compare to a steel like A2? I'm somewhat familiar to the A2 because I have a couple Bark Rivers
 
lightfootE; A eutectoid steel will work. 1084 is the one that most suggest. Heat to above non magnetic, I've heard get it a shade brighter. Quench in oil (at this stage canola @ 120 F is fine). Carefully clean and temper. You can try a differential temper over the coals or your home oven or a convection oven from a second hand store. Temper at 350 F for a harder knife or 400 F for a softer knife.
 
Half Cut Skele said:
Any you know of offhand that you might suggest? I want to make a couple knives but don't want to mess with diy heat treating right now.
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Darrin Sanders has always come across as very personable and I've heard he has reasonable rates for small orders. He is a member on the forum.
 
Bo T said:
Darrin Sanders has always come across as very personable and I've heard he has reasonable rates for small orders. He is a member on the forum.
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$10 a blade for smaller stuff, $15 for stuff over 12 inches long (up to 22), and he works pretty quickly. I've had it take him a week from arrival at his place to get 4 knives done and back on my doorstep, and it was a different heat treat process for each one.
 
Like LightfootE, I am looking to start making knives. Reading through various threads, I get the notion that when you HT a blade, carbon "bakes out" and you end up with crud to remove.

This leads to the question, How much thicker than what you want to end up with should your blade be to start with before the HT process? E.G., if the finished product should be .10", what should I start with? Is there a formula use? Or has someone already done all the hard work and there is a handy-dandy table out there somewhere in the INET ether?

I assume that any blades sent out for HT come back with the crud still attached. 8-)

ZZZ
 
Re-polishing a blade after heat treat won't change the size by any amount you could see with the naked eye. You polish them up to 400 grit sandpaper, heat treat, then lightly sand with 220 and 400 again to remove a bit of discoloration. It won't change the thickness of a blade though.
 
zzyzzogeton said:
Like LightfootE, I am looking to start making knives. Reading through various threads, I get the notion that when you HT a blade, carbon "bakes out" and you end up with crud to remove.

This leads to the question, How much thicker than what you want to end up with should your blade be to start with before the HT process? E.G., if the finished product should be .10", what should I start with? Is there a formula use? Or has someone already done all the hard work and there is a handy-dandy table out there somewhere in the INET ether?

AI assume that any blades sent out for HT come back with the crud still attached. 8-)

ZZZ
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A lot depends on the temperature and time at soak. Highly alloyed blades require a much higher temperature and a much longer soak at that temperature. Decarburization is a problem if these blades are not protected in some way. However, 1084 is austenized at a much lower temperature for a much shorter period of time so the very thin layer of decarburized steel that might form is not an issue. My guess is that the expansion of the blade from the formation of martensite will have a greater effect than the thin layer of any decarb that might form.
 
The sticky on "How to Instructions for Making a Knife", and the ones on "Working With Three Metals" as well as the other metallurgy stickys will have all the steps and info for making a knife.
Use this search engine to look up old threads on HT for 1084 and any other question:
http://www.google.com/cse/home?cx=011197018607028182644:qfobr3dlcra
 
1084 is a great steel for beginners and with experience it performs very well as long as the owner performs maintenance to prevent rust. It's easy to heat treat and temper. You can use canola oil for quenching then move on to "real" heat treat oils to get the most performance.

I get all my steel from Also Bruno, do a search for "nj steel baron" on the web and he'll pop up. Great guy to deal with.
 
lightfootE said:
this is gona be fun, guess I'm hunting down some 1084. Already drew up the design I'm going for on the first knife. I'll check the stickies for recipes. How does 1084 compare to a steel like A2? I'm somewhat familiar to the A2 because I have a couple Bark Rivers
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When you get it done let us see it. I always like seeing other folks work. If you want to get going quick and not wait till you 1084 is delivered, might I suggest finding some old leaf springs or coil springs. It's good steel and at a cheep price. Usually it's 5160 steel, not a bad steel to work with. I've made a few knives from it and they work great. Plus you could use some of it to see how the steel moves under the hammer when hit.
 
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hi folks, sorry to get a bit off topic here but, I've got some old leaf springs that I don't know where they came from or what they are made out of... where can I send it to get it tested/typed ?
 
h20oni said:
hi folks, sorry to get a bit off topic here but, I've got some old leaf springs that I don't know where they came from or what they are made out of... where can I send it to get it tested/typed ?
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If they're off a chevy, they're almost guaranteed to be 5160 spring steel. Other than that, I'm not sure how you could identify the steel without some sort of testing...
 
grease,
I have no idea what they came off of, that's the problem...

I know that there are tests that can be done (not by me, but in a lab) that can tell me what kind of steel it is...

just curious if anyone out there knows where I can get the tests done!
 
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