So my buddy wants a new knife, help us decide:

[jceckrosh]

It’s superior to certain weapons depending on the range. You wouldn’t be using it in a fist fight because to introduce a deadly weapon to a fist fight will likely only putting you in greater danger.

But if you are jumped by two guys at point blank range and you can create enough space to draw your knife it could save your life. Against two guys who got the drop on you your ass is likely to get tore up anyways.

Up to the courts at that point to decide if it was self defense.

You are correct. Close range renders some of the things I talked about ineffective. I meant prior to closing any distance.

 

[Lapedog]

You are correct. Close range renders some of the things I talked about ineffective. I meant prior to closing any distance.

Thing is prior to closing distance it is probably better to just flee than get into a physical altercation. Most altercations do not happen with a threat you identify from 20 or even 10 yards away. Competent criminals will do everything in their power to make sure they are on top of you before engaging. If you become aware of the fact they have targeted you from a distance than the game is likely over before it begins because you won’t stick around.

Some times you literally will not know you are being attacked until one guy has already jumped on your back and his buddy (who seemed like a normal guy one second ago when he asked you for a lighter) has just finished digging your pockets.

That’s another thing that a lot of people neglect to remember. They think of self defense as defending their person from another who’s objective is to do them harm. While in reality almost any violent encounter you don’t smell coming will be money oriented, violence to you is likely incidental to your ass getting robbed. It won’t be anything personal. It just so happens that you were the guy they were able to get the drop on. If you never presented as a target of opportunity they would never have selected you.

So to all the guys planning on carrying a bunch of weapons for self defense remember that for a criminal objective one will almost certainly be digging your pockets at which point your weapons may end up being taken off you and used against you. (Btw criminals tend to know where you will hide your weapons because they hide their own weapons in the same places.)

Still a gun is the best weapon for self defense and there are many scenarios where it is the most appropriate. Probably the best self defense weapon is to keep some cash separate from your wallet and do what a real gangster would do and give up the money rather than getting into a fight for your life.

 

[sabre cat]

Democratically elected representative republic (at least in theory).



I don't think there is strong agreement on the meaning of the founders on the second amendment. Pretty sure it doesn't matter, since a) we live in a democracy (in theory) and b) the constitution allows for democratic amendment to constitution (and clarification through law and case law).



We never stopped talking about knives. The issue here has been first the wisdom and then the right of the OP to defend himself with a knife, gun or whatever he chooses. In response to your rhetorical question of "who are we to say", my response stands... We're his fellow citizens. We collectively through the democratic process of representative government set the terms for what weapons (including knives) people are allowed access to and what they are allowed to use them for.

Bottom line, it's a republic. A republic that was designed to safeguard personal rights. Something most citizens don't know. What was it that Ben Franklin said?
"We've given you a Republic; if you can keep it." Or something to that effect.

As for the second amendment, it is very simple. The Constitution is the supreme law of the land. Period. Your "democratic amendment to the constitution" has never happened so the 2nd Amendment stands as originally written. Because of this, any federal laws infringing upon the militia's right to bear arms are null and void. Period.

Of course, that does bring up the question of what the militia is and is not. It is not the standing army or military reserves. The National Guard? No, it's not the National Guard. The Guard was formed in the early 1900s so that the government could assemble an army without the use of the militia. This last little tidbit of info was included in the Senate report on gun control in 1968. Anyone that tells you the National Guard is the militia is full of it. Or at best, ill-informed.

Because other parts of the Constitution limit the power of the federal government it is plain to see just who the militia is. The common man.

So if you and I have the right to bear arms to protect our life, property, and freedoms, it stands to reason that we also have the right to defend ourselves with the blade of our choosing. Hopefully, you now understand why I made my original comment.

 

[not2sharp]

I find myself unable to imagine any scenario where a knife can serve as a defensive weapon. I am making the assumption here that we are not talking about a staged duel or other regulated knife-to-knife combat debacle. In a street brawl the knife simply does not have the range to buy you the space you will need to protect yourself. Nor, does it have much ability to effectively block an inbound attack. As a purely offensive weapon, yes any knife can be used to inflict serious harm (as can a rock or most other tools), but that is assault or murder, rather than a defensive use. If you are really concerned about defense, you are going to need something that allows you to control your immediate surroundings, so that your opponent is unable to prosecute their attack. At the very least, that would be something sword size, with a generous amount of training.

n2s

 

[Lapedog]

I find myself unable to imagine any scenario where a knife can serve as a defensive weapon. I am making the assumption here that we are not talking about a staged duel or other regulated knife-to-knife combat debacle. In a street brawl the knife simply does not have the range to buy you the space you will need to protect yourself. Nor, does it have much ability to effectively block an inbound attack. As a purely offensive weapon, yes any knife can be used to inflict serious harm (as can a rock or most other tools), but that is assault or murder, rather than a defensive use. If you are really concerned about defense, you are going to need something that allows you to control your immediate surroundings, so that your opponent is unable to prosecute their attack. At the very least, that would be something sword size, with a generous amount of training.

n2s

Please read my post two posts previous to yours. (post #62)

Violent encounters happen all the time at point blank range. An attacker that targets you will not alert you to the fact you have been targeted from range, unless he is extremely sloppy. A knife is ideal for creating enough range to disengage and run away in tight quarters.

Criminals are not retarded and know that if a victim is aware of their intent from a distance it will give the victim time to run away or prepare themselves.

A gun is still overall the best SD weapon. Especially for scenarios like a convenience store you are in is getting robbed and the robber does not see you in the aisles.

 

[sgt1372]

I find myself unable to imagine any scenario where a knife can serve as a defensive weapon.

It's really not that hard to imagine. A knife is a close quarters fighting weapon. That means that it is weapon that is most effective when you are standing toe-to-toe w/your opponent/assailant and you have to go hands-on with him (or her).

This is the type of encounter MOST people are MOST likely to have in normal circumstances.

The typical scenario is a verbal argument that escalates into a physical attack. It is unlike the targeted "mugging" that Lapedog refers to which actually more uncommon and, in which case, a gun would probably would be a better SD weapon BECAUSE the assailants probably would be at a greater distance (if/when 1st noticed) where a knife would be less effective.

I am ashamed to say that have been involved in a few verbal encounters but fortunately they never escalated into a fight. However, you never know when that might occur and, even if you try to walk away, you can't predict if your opponent may try to attack you nonetheless.

A knife is the best weapon in this kind of situation.

If you are paying attention and are quick enough, just deploying the knife normally can stop a potential (and otherwise unarmed) assailant (which is usually the case) in his tracks (I know this from personal experience) but, if that's not enough to stop the attack, you can end it quickly with just a few (less than lethal) strikes.

Just be cognizant of the legal limits on the use of deadly force (which includes the use of a knife) if/when you need to do so.

This is why I carry a knife and not a gun every day. I only carry a gun when I think that I will be going someplace where the risk justifies it and, since I've moved to the suburbs and retired from law enforcement, I rarely visit such places and therefore seldom carry a gun.

 

[craytab]

Sure. Who are we to dictate how someone defends themselves?

Well, the guy who lost his sd opinel at the restaurant certainly isn't qualified. He dictated himself. No rules in the constitution about being an idiot unfortunately.

 

[sabre cat]

Well, the guy who lost his sd opinel at the restaurant certainly isn't qualified. He dictated himself. No rules in the constitution about being an idiot unfortunately.

Well, he started out with the idea of an Opinel for self-defense. That's a bigger issue to me than the fact someone lost a pocket knife.

However, if someone wants to carry one of the cheapest knives on the market as a SD knife, who am I to say they can't.