So you simply MUST baton?

[stabman]

I am with you. Battoning is really just folks showing off their perceived woodscraft skills.

If you're all by yourself, how is it showing off?
Last I checked, the squirrels and coyotes don't really care much what I do...

Perhaps you are spending too much time caring about what other people are doing.

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

Froe versus spokeshave - they do similar things and are sometimes able to do the same thing, but a spokeshave will crack if you pry too much with it. Froes are tough and not nearly as hard. They don't stay as sharp as a spokeshave but do not need to. So when making something from a piece of limb or trunk you froe first and then use a spokeshave, then later a drawknife. all have their uses.

Wait--what? How do you baton with a spokeshave?

 

[Pondoro2310]

Wait--what? How do you baton with a spokeshave?
I wouldn't baton with a spokeshave or with a draw knife. And I wouldn't pry with them either.

 

[jamestap]

The froe is pretty much a shop tool. Splitting wood for furniture legs gives less grain run-out, making the legs much stronger. In the old days, they were used to split roof shingles from logs.

Lee Valley sells a light & portable batoning chisel:
http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=67735&cat=1,130,43332,43703

I have a couple of fixed blade sheep's-foot knives I bought from them about 10 years ago for $3 apiece that are good for batoning smaller logs/branches. The spines are about 3/16" thick, so they can take a lot of abuse.

 

[300Six]

If you're all by yourself, how is it showing off?
Last I checked, the squirrels and coyotes don't really care much what I do...
Perhaps you are spending too much time caring about what other people are doing.

Normal "He-man" response. In my old age I can chuckle about outdoors testosterone-fueled tinhorns that choose to thrash large pieces of wood with just a lousy knife. At the same time, also admitting to not being possessed with a noisy power saw/generator/motor boat/4-wheeler/boom box etc in order to bring on feigned comforts of home is particularly welcome. Go ahead knock yourself out! You are welcome to borrow my axe and Swede saw once you've entirely run out of steam and realized you've gotten nowhere.

 

[300Six]

Double post; sorry!

 

[stabman]

Normal "He-man" response. In my old age I can chuckle about outdoors testosterone-fueled tinhorns that choose to thrash large pieces of wood with just a lousy knife. At the same time, also admitting to not being possessed with a noisy power saw/generator/motor boat/4-wheeler/boom box etc in order to bring on feigned comforts of home is particularly welcome. Go ahead knock yourself out! You are welcome to borrow my axe and Swede saw once you've entirely run out of steam and realized you've gotten nowhere.

I'm glad you recognize my obvious greatness and huge levels of testosterone.
I don't use a "lousy knife" though; I like ones like these I made:





Or a quality production knife:



It isn't a "survival skill", in the sense that surviving usually entails sitting in one spot till the rescuers find you.

It's just another way of doing stuff with wood.
And if somehow I end up breaking any of them (which is highly unlikely), I'll say "Well, guess I'll grind it into a shorter knife!"
Then life will continue.

 

[stabman]

If I were dealing with actual log-splitting, then I'd want a splitting maul or hydraulic log-splitter.
I won't be building any log cabins--or shingling a house--with a knife.

 

[300Six]

stabman: you do have a sense of humour, and your nicely-made stuff is quite interesting. Now as to what I'd do with a big blade, aside from attack the odd blackberry thicket in Vancouver, is an unknown. To this day I still have a mostly unused machete from Colombia that someone there figured we absolutely had to have on hand while working our way upstream to an Indian village along the Amazon River at Leticia 37 years ago. We also had an axe on board and it got a lot of use.

 

[Karda]

Gentlemen,
Discuss the topic, not each other. Don't take or make things personally.

 

[Pondoro2310]

Well Stabman - that "knife" looks up to the task. I didn't start this thread to cause an argument, but the thought of people beating on a small knife just to show how strong it is still sort of rankles me. What you have there is something I would call a machete, although even a lot of machetes don't look that stout.

Chop and pound away with that thing! And I'll bet you have a smaller knife tucked in your pocket for cleaning fish or skinning animals.

It's the guy with one (smaller) survival knife that should really consider not pounding on it. If he really needs it to survive he should take care of it, and bring an ax, hatchet or machete top chop wood.

I pound on my froe with a cell phone in my pocket and a convenience store about a mile away. So survival isn't the issue.

 

[leghog]

I am with you. Battoning is really just folks showing off their perceived woodscraft skills. If all I had in the wild with me is a knife sure maybe, but I am better prepared when I am in the woods. But hey maybe you can start training for an episode of Naked and Afraid.

If you're all by yourself, how is it showing off?
Last I checked, the squirrels and coyotes don't really care much what I do...

Perhaps you are spending too much time caring about what other people are doing.

Then why take pictures?

 

[leghog]

Basket weaving? Wow, that's some serious man stuff...

It truly is when properly done. Some of the truly good baskets can bring good money too.

 

[stabman]

Then why take pictures?

Because otherwise no one ever believes you use a knife.
It's a dilemma.

I have pictures from a few outings, and a few when having made something.
Most times I wouldn't be able to since my okay digital camera broke some years back, and I never got around to buying another one; have to wait till others are around as well.

On the topic of axes and things, a couple of decent hatchets are on the list of things to buy (whenever money is found, that is...).
My wife wants a hatchet to match her axe, and it just wouldn't be right if we didn't match...so I'll get one too.

 

[MrFrido]

Nice manaresso! Looks like a "Reggio" pattern?

Indeed they are! I'm actually from the Reggio Emilia region. theyare probably more than 70 years old. I still don't know the purpose of that blade's back shape. maybe to pick up fallen tree branches.

Anyway, to stay on topic, I can't see why batoning must be a problem. I understand the hate on the late "survival" trend, but if someone wants to take in the woods just a knife and not an hatchet, batoning can be an useful skill.
If I had to go for a 2-3 days trip in the temperate woods, I'll take a big knife or billhook over an hatchet, they can do anything the hatchet does, and more. And they take less space in the backpack.

 

[Pirate63]

If you're all by yourself, how is it showing off?
Last I checked, the squirrels and coyotes don't really care much what I do...

Perhaps you are spending too much time caring about what other people are doing.

Personally I'd have to care at all to care less. Battoning is woodscraft 101.

 

[stabman]

Personally I care less than less.....but its you guys posting photos and videos of your pretty sticks and battoning wood skills that gets old.

Where's the pretty stick? Didn't see one.
As for pictures, for crying out loud there is no winning on that issue.

I had no pictures at all...NONE....for years.
People would always say "You don't use knives; people like you talk and talk but only collect."

So then, after entering the ESEE Knives Mega Contest (which I totally lost, by the way :thumbup, I finally had some pictures.
So I shared them.
And then on a few outings where others were present, I added a few more.

This meant I had some pictures to share.
So then people changed their tune from "You don't use knives!" To "Why do people like you always go around posting pictures of using knives? Must just be playing around to show off!"

See what I mean? There's no winning on the internet.

Thanks for playing though!

 

[HuntBomb]

Honk if you baton with your Busse!
I see no problem with it as long as your knife is built to handle the impact force.
There may be better tools for some jobs, but they aren't always so convenient, portable, available or necessary and there's also a sense of satisfaction in completing various tasks with one exceptional knife that others couldn't handle.
Also...I don't condone battoning with a hammer, or battoning folders and cheap knives...unless u must

 

[FortyTwoBlades]

As MrFrido already mentioned, knives and knife like tools (billhooks, manaressi, etc) that are suitably constructed to handle the task have been batoned for centuries. It's not a question of if batoning is stupid or not. It's a question of if you're stupid with a baton. Sensibility with the method is the real thing people should be arguing about. Batoning folding knives with shock-sensitive locks through 6" diameter elm with all the technique of an enraged nuclear gorilla is obviously senseless. But the more robust the build, the more suitable the tool is to the task. The more skilled the user, the lighter a build may be used for the task. The fewer alternatives you have for processing the wood, the more appropriate the task. And so on and so forth.

 

[Steve Tall]

A time-lapse video of a froe being put to good use, making 24" cedar shakes:

[video=youtube_share;c0FxhfCBV2M]http://youtu.be/c0FxhfCBV2M[/video]

I presume that the block is turned over, after each split, to be able to put a taper on each shake.