SOG Fixed blades

Mark,

I have the Spyderco sharpener also, but I don't tote that thing in the woods or offshore so I need a knife to stay sharp awhile. I don't know anything about BG-42 except that all the custom makers rave about it. I DO know I love 440C. I've never had a knife fail made of this steel. It makes my heart happy to see the Trident made in this. I thought it was made from 440A. I'm an outdoorsman so I need my knife to cut anything I come across, hold an edge relatively well, be able to be use as a light pry bar if needed and to be able to take abuse. BTW, I'd rather my blade break than bend. I can still use a broke blade.

------------------
--------------------------------------
MISSISSIPPI STATE UNIVERSITY
--------------------------------------
Fear the man that owns only one rifle,
he likely knows how to use it.
- Anonymous
--------------------------------------
Ben Lee
Computer Science, Student, Senior
AOL IM: MSURifleman
www2.netdoor.com/~rifleman
www2.msstate.edu/~brl2
--------------------------------------
 
440C is good, I have a variety of knives in BG-42. It is my choice, when I have one. I have several folders up to 4" blade length in ATS-34. I have had no failures, no chips, nor any other problems with them.

------------------
The thorn stands to defend the Rose, yet it is peaceful and does not seek conflict
 
I'm not a knife manufacturer, so I'm only reporting conversation with people who are, but one thing I've heard about AUS6 and 440A is that they can be "fine-blanked" (stamped out of big rolls of the stuff), while AUS8 and 440C and the premium stuff are cut from flat sheets (recently with big lasers machines). So it's not just a matter of switching raw materials, but a matter of moving production to a facility with completely different equipment.

Some companies that do fine-blanking have been getting good results with Sandvik 12C27. Besides being the steel of choice for Swedish and Norwegian fixed blades that are priced from premium to disposable, it's now getting some good reviews in an Outdoor Edge product, and Benchmade chooses it for their Balisongs that ain't cheap.

I'm in the process of writing up an SOG page (not up yet) for my site, and I'll be comparing prices to Cold Steel and Fällkniven. Fällkniven's fixed blades that are comparable in function to the NW Ranger or Government come in premium VG10 steel, for working class prices - higher than SOG street price, I think, but not prohibitively higher. Fällkniven's handle construction, however, is simpler, with no metal guard for example. Trade-offs. Has SOG looked into VG10?
smile.gif



------------------
- JKM
www.chaicutlery.com
AKTI Member # SA00001
 
My Tigershark, which is 440A, is very similar in chemistry to the AUS6A used by CS for the Trailmaster, except it has slightly more Chromium. We all kow what a great knife that the Trailmaster is, and never hear too many problems associated with it's use. The main complaint I hear about is the crappy handle.
Also, with good heat treating, the 440A should be very impact and chip resistant.
5160, a steel used for leaf springs, is a fine steel that many custom makers use for large bowies and heavy duty choppers. This is kind of a non-stainless version of 440A and AUS6A.
440C is also a great steel, and is the main user for George Tichbourne.
I think sometimes we get caught up in all the latest BG, VG, CPM, hi-tech stuff and forget the tried and true steels like O1, D2, 5160, 1095 and the 440 stainless series.
My point is that their is nothing wrong with 440A & 440C for larger fixed blades.

[This message has been edited by Greg Clem (edited 06-17-2000).]
 
I can live with 440C, assuming a good heat treat.

------------------
The thorn stands to defend the Rose, yet it is peaceful and does not seek conflict
 
Ron, I have 2 questions. First, my understanding is that the Rc range on the BG-42 in the Recondo is 62-64. Why the 2 point range in hardness?
Second, With that level of hardness,how do you plan to keep it from being brittle?

------------------
The thorn stands to defend the Rose, yet it is peaceful and does not seek conflict
 
Just to avoid some confusion. AUS-8 and 440C are not the same steel. AUS-8 is 440B with some other stuff in it and AUS-10 is 440C.

I have two knives in 440A. One is my Gerber Bowie and the other is my SOG Tech II. There is no doubt that the steel in the SOG is much harder, in fact the Gerber steel literally feels like a milder steel and I'm sure it has to do with the heat treat.

Ron, from your comment, do I understand you to mean that you are replacing all 440C blades with AUS-8? Does this include the Trident?

I have had worse experiences with AUS steels than I have with 440's even though they are basically the same. Hopefully your heat treat will make the difference with these.

By the way, how much carbon is in sk-5 steel?


 
Hi Guys,

Let me remind you that I am not a metallurgist. I'll give you general responses to the best of my ability.

From my limited understanding, at SOG we consider 440A/AUS6 and 440C/AUS8 similar steels...similar enough where we have changed from one to the other at various times. If you look at the charts which show what elements make up each of these steels, you will find them similar. Yes, they are different. Yes, they have different elements in them, but similar enough that we are "splitting hairs," you might say. Which is the Trident made of? I'm not sure. Our catalog has said 440C.

Almost all manufacturers will give a range with the hardness of their steel. This is industry standard. Regarding getting a steel harder and its brittleness, I've been told that each steel has its ideal range in that it should be heat treated. Taking a specific steel above that range would make it brittle. For BG-42, its ideal range seems to be 62-64. There are apparently other elements in this steel which gives it flexibility.

When it comes to steel, excellent heat treating seems to be the key determining factor. An good quality steel, in the hands of an excellent heat treater, can turn it into something worth having/using.

SK-5 Carbon steel? I really don't know the carbon content. All I've been told is that it is a very high quality, high carbon tooling steel. This steel has been praised by knife magazine authors as a first rate steel.

I hope this helps. Some of this overly techie stuff just goes over my head.

Ron@SOG


------------------
Website: www.sogknives.com
Email: ron@sogknives.com

[This message has been edited by Ron@SOG (edited 06-19-2000).]
 
Hello Ron, I've just punched in and see that you have fallen into the Great Steel Wars. I admit exotic steels float my boat, but I also understand there is a fine line for a manufacturer to walk. The price of raw materials has been discussed some, but only James has brought up the cost of machining different steels and resultant tooling costs.

My understanding is that the less exotic steels such as 440 are excellent for large knives requiring toughness.
 
Hi Ron.
I really am not trying to be a pain in the butt here but I notice that both buck and Gerber are now producing good quality folders in ATS-34 and BG-42 in or around $100. If they can do it, SOG should be able to or come reasonably close. Again, I'm not trying to give you a hard time. I just want to see one of my favorite companies stay competitive. BenLee made a similar comment in this thread on 6-10-00

------------------
The thorn stands to defend the Rose, yet it is peaceful and does not seek conflict
 
Hi Fudo,

As I have already stated, I am not in on the specifics of our manufacturing costs, so I don't have those specific answers for you.

There are a lot of knife manufacturers out there to choose from. Each consumer is free to choose which company and product they are happy with. I feel that SOG produces a high quality product for a reasonable price. Feel free to come to your own conclusion.

Ron@SOG

------------------
Website: www.sogknives.com
Email: ron@sogknives.com
 
Hi, I was wondering what specific bad experiences you have had with 440A steel. Can you tell me the exact knives and instinces?

I have many knives with 440A steel and have never had a problem with them. Of cource, I only purchese from highly respected knife makers like SOG, Ka-Bar, ColdSteel and Western. Then again, my work horse is a USMC issue Ka-Bar with 1095 steel.

Originally posted by BenLeeMS:
Ron,

Will the Tomcat or Stingray ever move up to 440C or BG-42? I've had bad experiences with 440A.
Click to expand...

 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top