some high quality stainless steel

[andrew7978]

Well my EDC Spyderco Navigator is made of VG-10 Stainless Steel. I know its not supposed to rust, but I don't like exposing it to too much water. So anyway it accidentally went through the wash and it turned out good as new. It even washed out some of the dirt that was in it. I just put a little oil on it afterwards just in case.

 

[pitdog]

I'm pleased it turned out ok but I would never have guessed any different.
People worry far to much about rust on here, even good old carbon steel blades are fine exposed to water with even the minimum of care. If a blade picks up a few little rust spots on a camping weekend, is it the end of the world, of course not and they will either come off with a scotchbrite pad or with a little more use whichever comes first !!!

If I could get just one message across to the good folk of this forum it would be " embrace the rust, it's a sign that you are getting out and about and using your knives as they should be used !!!!"

 

[Macchina]

I used my Benchmade Nitrous Stryker quite a bit over the weekend. It is the first weekend I've had it. The blade is made of D2 like some of my other Benchmade folders, yet the Stryker has a sandblasted finish :barf:. I got about 10 small rust spots starting on it. It doesn't bother me much at all, I just wish that Benchmade would have put a little extra time in and not sandblasted a D2 blade.

As far as VG-10 goes (or any other stainless), I put no oil on them ever and have yet to see rust on any of my stainless blades.

 

[baldtaco-II]

If I could get just one message across to the good folk of this forum it would be " embrace the rust, it's a sign that you are getting out and about and using your knives as they should be used !!!!"

Hola amigo

That has really made me wonder. Does that only apply to knives or would you apply it to a weapon, a vehicle .etc?

I totally understand how people could tolerate corrosion when other factors are not equal, I do. One can suffer it in the belief of greater rewards in other areas. But the way you described that appears to me that even if other factors were equal, or those perceived rewards were irrelevant because of the design, the disposition to corrosion would still not bother you. How does that work? Why would one “embrace the rust” if there was no performance pay off because of the design, or the intended role? If two knives performed indistinguishably for the tasks you put them to, save for one rusted readily, would you pick the one liable to rust just because its scars would stop it looking all NIB.

 

[Fiddleback]

If I could get just one message across to the good folk of this forum it would be " embrace the rust, it's a sign that you are getting out and about and using your knives as they should be used !!!!"

Agreed.

Obviously on car parts/non edged tools, the rationale is different, but hey, we're not on the Carguy forum, this is Bladeforums...

 

[pitdog]

Hola amigo

That has really made me wonder. Does that only apply to knives or would you apply it to a weapon, a vehicle .etc?

I totally understand how people could tolerate corrosion when other factors are not equal, I do. One can suffer it in the belief of greater rewards in other areas. But the way you described that appears to me that even if other factors were equal, or those perceived rewards were irrelevant because of the design, the disposition to corrosion would still not bother you. How does that work? Why would one “embrace the rust” if there was no performance pay off because of the design, or the intended role? If two knives performed indistinguishably for the tasks you put them to, save for one rusted readily, would you pick the one liable to rust just because its scars would stop it looking all NIB.

I hope this answers your question if not I'll try and better explain tomorrow when I have more time !
For many years I worked at a coal mine and worked for so long as a blacksmith. During that time I used many old carbon steel tools some made long before I was born. Some that had not seen use for a while had deep patina's and surface rust but they were still 100% functional and once they were used again they soon took on a renewed shine. I would hazard a guess that those same tools will still be around long after I am gone and still be up to the tasks they were origionally designed for !!!:thumbup:

 

[riddleofsteel]

I love VG-10. My old solid VG-10 bladed Fallkniven A1 has served me well.

 

[baldtaco-II]

I hope this answers your question if not I'll try and better explain tomorrow when I have more time !
For many years I worked at a coal mine and worked for so long as a blacksmith. During that time I used many old carbon steel tools some made long before I was born. Some that had not seen use for a while had deep patina's and surface rust but they were still 100% functional and once they were used again they soon took on a renewed shine. I would hazard a guess that those same tools will still be around long after I am gone and still be up to the tasks they were origionally designed for !!!:thumbup:

I suppose the thing I'm not understanding boils down to: A disposition corrosion is a desirable quality – true or false? I suggest the answer is false. It is a performance characteristic that one suffers in the belief of gains elsewhere, surely?

 

[hlee]

I think that me message is that rust is not nearly as pervasive as we like to think, and even carbon steel blades (corrosion prone) can be kept shiny and new looking with a minimum of care. Clean it and lightly oil it. Carbon steel blades are typically thought to take a better edge than stainless steel, and be easier to sharpen once dull. If a patina does form on a carbon steel blade, it is merely surface corrosion that will protect the remainder of the bladed from deep pitting. This patina forming characteristic is a trade off for better edge performance.

We don't like surface rust on our cars because it makes them less pretty. However, look at the leaf springs on any pickup older than about a year and you'll see they are completely rusted on the surface (I know they are on mine). I'm sure the same is true of the mercedes (or is it BMW?) springs that the kamis use to make those shiny khukuris that Himilayan Imports sells.

We don't like rust on our firearms because it can marr the smooth surface and cause performance issues with actions. Rust and pitting of rifling can cause loss of accuracy. Rust can also cause loss of structural integrity, which is something that you do not want in an instrument designed to contain 50,000 or more psi.

As the business end of a knife is the barest strip of steel where the bevels meet, most of the steel that you see does little more than support the edge and make the knife pretty. The edge is "de-rusted" everytime that it is sharpened, and rust formation can be arrested by a minimum of cleaning and maintainance of even carbon steel. As a patina is only a few molecules deep, it does not affect the performance of the knife, but only the looks. So, as opposed to firearms where rust can be a real performance issue, rust on knives is mostly a cosmetic issue.

If you like your knives shiny, then keep them shiny, but a bit of rust on the blade will not affect performance. Don't sweat the small stuff.

 

[baldtaco-II]

That's not the way I interpreted; “If I could get just one message across to the good folk of this forum it would be " embrace the rust, it's a sign that you are getting out and about and using your knives as they should be used !!!!", at all.

I'm not usually that interested in the ubiquitous carbon vs stainless rap. Most people seem pretty well dug in on whichever side of the fence they sit, and justifications abound. Nah, the aspect I'm considering, “embrace the rust...”, very much reminds me of the salesmanship that takes what should be a negative aspect and somehow contorts it to a positive. Once again I shall cite the Cadbury advert; “a finger of fudge is just enough to give your kids a treat”. One corrodes readily the other admits to being barely large enough, neither of these things are good.

On that, we need not confine ourselves to the hackneyed carbon vs stainless with a list of ingredients we could trawl through. We could have examples such as; If a steel was developed in 300 yrs time that that in every way was indistinguishable from 1095 or blah blah, save for that it did not rust as readily, would that be more or less desirable than the original version from a performance point of view?

 

[nick-nack]

If I could get just one message across to the good folk of this forum it would be " embrace the rust, it's a sign that you are getting out and about and using your knives as they should be used !!!!"

or... "You sweat like a leaky tap".

 

[buckabee]

I thought the porous structure of rust makes it possible for bacteria like tetanus and others to breed. And also is difficult to clean properly. So hygiene is the main reason I don't like rust on knives.
I'm not sure if my bacteria assumption with rust is completely true, but that's what I was told once anyway. But it sounds reasonable IMO. Nobody likes his likes his cooking equipment to be rusty I think?

 

[hlee]

I interpret "Embrace the Rust" the same way that I interpret "Embrace the Suck," which is "... accept the things that you cannot change..." I think that the bigger message is that it is really not that hard to keep your knives in good rust free condition with a minimum of maintenance (even carbon steel knives). But, if a speck of rust does appear, it is really not that big of a deal. Again, don't sweat the small stuff.

I mention carbon steel only because it is more rust prone than stainless. I use both, and have had rust problems with neither, whether in central texas, coastal New England, or here in the SF bay area CA.

 

[baldtaco-II]

Aha, recurses back to what I've been saying. Rust is something that is tolerated because of belief X about the importance of some other characteristic [and I said I do that too], but corrosion is not a desirable property of a blade steel when considering performance. I believe it would take a mighty fine wriggler to find a way to hold the bold claim that it is.

 

[pitdog]

Aha, recurses back to what I've been saying. Rust is something that is tolerated because of belief X about the importance of some other characteristic [and I said I do that too], but corrosion is not a desirable property of a blade steel when considering performance. I believe it would take a mighty fine wriggler to find a way to hold the bold claim that it is.

You use some great wording on your posts bro !!!:thumbup:

Yeah rust ain't desirable, we all know that , but what I'm trying to say is that it is not something to be feared either.
I would rather get 20 happy years hard use from a knife and have it rust away than have it sat in a bedroom drawer in mint condition due to lack of use for the rest of my life !!!

 

[Hector_Victorious]

My Al Mar SERE 2k rusts like a bitch around here. Being a kayak guide around salt and fresh water 5-6 days a week doesn't help any. Finally resigned it to off days and got a cheap Gerber Gator that does everything I want it to do

 

[baldtaco-II]

You use some great wording on your posts bro !!!:thumbup:

Yeah rust ain't desirable, we all know that , but what I'm trying to say is that it is not something to be feared either.
I would rather get 20 happy years hard use from a knife and have it rust away than have it sat in a bedroom drawer in mint condition due to lack of use for the rest of my life !!!

Thanks amigo.

I wasn't trying to be difficult, and as far as I'm concerned we've now arrived at a conclusion. Cool.

I guess I'm motivated by a morbid curiosity in the way people conceive of knives as well as the knives themselves. Kinda like your observation the other day regarding saying anything negative about a Mora or a Busse – fanboys from these camps will flame you like a comment on no other knife will attract. Justification becomes the keyword, and more often than not reasoning takes a nosedive. I love poking around in the inconsistencies that often occur just because X is a knife. It reminds me of the days of yore, pre-enlightenment, when knives were often imbued with soul, spirit, or some other autonomous mystical religious mumbo that one wouldn't apply to other hand tools. I had a friend from South Africa that typifies that. Bright guy, designs prosthetic limbs, and is a hobby knife maker. From the way he speaks one would be forced to conclude that if a blade steel wasn't disposed to rust it is somehow inferior. Run him through the thought experiment that Predator has been beamed here with a knife of superb characteristics, that also will not rust readily, and you'd likely as not find him holding it to be inferior because it was stainless. Knee-jerk closure of the critical faculties like that always makes me smile. And when someone appears to be taking what is clearly an impediment and wrangling it to be a positive I full on laugh. Yup, I'm kinda hard to sell things to ;-)

I've got others too that I've been holding out on because I anticipate upset. A glimpse goes something like this – I tend to treat SAKs as tools for organic matter and Leatherman type tools more for urban use. Because of that I take a SAK into the woods, and if I need them I take a good old pair of tool steel pliers with a comfy handle. I believe those pliers are better suited to metal on metal work. What I find strange is accounts from people that would play up the toughness of the steel they choose for their knife even though they almost certainly don't need it, yet sing the praises of their multi-tool, in a stainless with bitchy handles, for metal on metal action. Given such tools are usually carried in a pouch skin contact isn't really sufficient a reason. Mmm, loads of wondering on this, but I'll likely never start a thread on it.

Blah de blah. Anyway, I've prattled on far too long with my thoughts on consistency, reasoning, and justification. I'm all cooked now.

 

[hlee]

Quoted from Baldtaco-II...

"I believe it would take a mighty fine wriggler to find a way to hold the bold claim that it is."

Ping Golf used to make a chipping wedge they called the "Trust Rusty." It was a golf club whose head was supposed to rust. The idea being that the rust marred the surface and gave the club face more purchase on the golf ball at the moment of impact. The result being more spin and better control around the green. I never bought one so I don't know if it worked like the claim, but there is your Wriggler's Perfomance Rust.