Someone Know About Archery?

We also have a set of Bowyers Bibles in our home too. Terry used to work for a sporting goods store here in town. Needless to say lots of money went to toys. He wanted them(well drooled on them) for a long time. I finally got them for him for Christmas. He has put them to good use. I also shoot a bow. It is a 42# osage flat bow that Terry made for me. It is BEAUTIFUL! The poundage is not much for you guys but it is enough for me and I have fun shooting it.

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[This message has been edited by Sandi (edited 01-08-2001).]
 
Make it a habit to kick your hubby off the net for a few minutes every week and you chime in for a change, Sandi.

My grandpa came out of Lindsay/Paul's Valley on the Wash/ita River in Garvin County. ( Out here in Nevada we treasure rivers - all seven or eight of 'em
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) So one of these days, I'll have to search for records in the County Courthouse. And if I make that long a trip, I'm not leaving before I get together again with my bro Yvsa. So we just might all meet sometime. Be nice, now. Rusty


[This message has been edited by Rusty (edited 01-08-2001).]
 
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Ya just gotta love that Osage Orange!!
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And Sandi's bow IS Really Nice!!!

When I lived in Oregon and found out that Yew grew there I tried to find some, but never did, didn't really know for certain what I was lookin for.

When I lived in Idaho a boy a year ahead of me in school made a longbow from Yew that he cut and seasoned.
The shop teacher was still talking about the bow the year I was there. He couldn't get over the cast the Yew bow had.

What made me sick was to learn that the Northwestern Yew was/is considered a "junk" tree by the foresters and that it was/is cut or pushed out of the way when an area was logged.
There's no telling how much good stickbow wood is trashed out every year up in that part of the
country.

Another good bow wood is Ash. I made a 65# flat bow with a slight recurve when I was about 14 or so out of Ash. The small tree had a natural recurve in the bottom limb and I used it to my
advantage.
I took all the bark off and roughed out the bow, rubbed it down good with vege oil, and then with the help of a couple of friends and some Great Big Nails nailed it to the side of my uncles outhouse.
The top limb had to be recurved to match the bottom limb and that's why I had my friends help. I couldn't pull the roughed out bow into shape by myself.
After a few months I finished the bow and over a small fire in the yard I "fire hardened" it.
That's an old Indin Trick where a bow could be trimmed out rough and greased well and left to season a bit. The fire along with more animal grease or vegetable oil rubbed in while fire hardening actually finished seasoning the wood while making the wood harder.
Sometimes the Old Ones were on the move a lot and didn't have time to wait until wood was fully seasoned to make a new bow.

I am also an instinctive shooter and my folks got me a 45# lemonwood bow when I was a young boy.
I don't know how heavy a bow I can pull now. I may find out this next year if I can get around to making a new bow out of the O'O' I traded my Sirupati for.
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And maybe I should get down to the river and check out some cane for real Cherokee Arrows before spring.
I have plenty of wild turkey feathers for fletching.
But being a modern ndn I will opt for steel broadheads.
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>>>>---¥vsa---->®

Each person's work is always a portrait of himself.

---- Samuel Butler.

Khukuri FAQ
Himalayan Imports Website
 
:
Bro y'all always got a place to stay if/when y'all or just yerself make it out this way.
I will take you down to some semi-wild places where the Old Ones actually lived. The Spirits are still there and I am sure you would be welcome there.
I have quite a story about this one particular place and how the Spirits there can make someone very afraid.
smile.gif




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>>>>---¥vsa---->®

Each person's work is always a portrait of himself.

---- Samuel Butler.

Khukuri FAQ
Himalayan Imports Website
 
Yvsa,
I got all the river cane you need and it's already seasoned. I've had it a couple of years. Come on over and help yourself, I'm gettin the itch to make a osage bow again.
Terry
 
I've made maybe a dozen bows out of lemonwood backed with either hickory or rawhide; one of lemonwood backed with silk (which broke...) and one of purpleheart (which broke during tillering...)

What I'd really like to make is a composite - sinew in the back, a maple core and horn in the belly, stuck together with rawhide glue. There are good, clear instructions on how to make one in Jim Hamm's book "Bows & Arrows of the Native Americans", and also in thre Trad Bowyers' Bible, but over here you can't get the sinew - no deer hunters, and no chance of getting any from the slaughterhouse because of the Mad Cow Disease regulations - my buddy who works in the local abbatoir reckons it'd be more than his job's worth to smuggle me out any cowhorn or backstrap tendon.

From what I've read, the short Plains composite was a wonderfully efficient short-range bow, with a short draw, and a very different manner of release where basically you drew until the string pulled the arrow out from between your fingers... I think it'd really suit the instinctive style of archery.
 
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Tom Crazycrow.com has real sinew.
I don't know whether it would be worth getting it shipped to you or if you could, but it might be worth a try.
The real sinew comes in shorter lengths and I think it's been cleaned and ready for use. It's a job prepareing it from the raw material to something that can be used.
I know you won't get it confused with the artificial sinew which comes in rolls like other threads.
The artificial stuff is nylon that's been waxed and like real sinew it can be stripped to make smaller thread.

If you're interested pehaps I could order it for you and send it marked as a gift or something?
I would be glad to help anyway I could if you want to try it.



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>>>>---¥vsa---->®

Each person's work is always a portrait of himself.

---- Samuel Butler.

Khukuri FAQ
Himalayan Imports Website
 
And all I wanted was advice on selling my bows!!

I haven't had this much fun since the Robin Hood Shoot in San Diego, 1976. Just a bunch of crazy guys (I was considerably younger) dressed in tights, green pants and shirts, with feathers in our peaked caps. But boy could they shoot (I shot, but really wasn't able to "shoot").

We used to go standard distances range, take a hunting stance at 50 yards, and shoot a dozen or so arrows while the "wheels, cams, and cables" guys were still setting up for the first shot--and we'd frequently shoot better groups!! Or set the people gawking by shooting from our knees, shooting at varying distances, or shooting while walking or running!

Thanks a lot, guys, for bringing back some very great memories. I guess I better take one of my remaining longbows and shoot a flight or two.

Respects to all.

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Watakushi Wa Shinajin Desu
DeathDancer

[This message has been edited by DeathDancer (edited 01-09-2001).]
 
I seem to remember that the higher altitudes of Nepal and Tibet didn't have much in the way of an archery tradition due to the quality of the wood - too twisty and brittle for good bows - but anyone interested in researching traditional archery in Asia (including India, China, Japan and parts of Eastern Europe) should visit <A HREF="http://www.atarn.org">www.atarn.org</a>. There is a LOT of information there, and a discussion forum to ask questions - also the gentleman who runs it is very knowledgeable and helpful.
 
Talk to Dean Torgas at stickbow.com.

I still have the 4' Yew flat bow that I made in boy scouts. It still draws 15# @28". The lower limb is more curved, but doesn`t seem to hurt anything. I think it was always like that; handy for kneeling. That has never been sealed; just oiled.

I used an old Bear 45# recurve for deer this year. It`s pretty beat up, but shoots where you look. 70# would be better for elk. You should get 170 fps. with a 700 gr. shaft.

Sinew shouldn`t be that hard to come by. I have not tried the artificial. You need hide, foot or that kind of glue for it.Buy a cow, if you have to. You can always eat the part that is not sinew.

English Yew is supposed to be much better than our Pacific Yew.

Why am I not surprised to find a bunch of self bowmen here?

Hi to you too Rusty.

[This message has been edited by FNG (edited 01-10-2001).]

[This message has been edited by FNG (edited 01-10-2001).]
 
And with something to say.
Part of my job is to know projectile weapons and supporting arms. I take my job seriously. I fly the support air.

The only way out , for me, is death or court martial.

[This message has been edited by FNG (edited 01-13-2001).]
 
Yvsa, many thanks for the kind offer; but I'm not sure sinew would make it past customs. The laws about bits of dead animal are crazy in this country (just like the laws about everything else, come to think of it...) especially since the Mad Cow Disease scare. I'm surprised the horn in the khuk handles hasn't caught the attention of the gnomes in the customs shed; I can only guess they think it's plastic...

English yew is pretty much useless for bowmaking, since our trees don't grow straight; the best you can do with native yew is a really extreme snakebow. Even during the medieval period all the yew for the legendary English longbow was imported from Spain and Italy, and ships trading in those countries were required by law to bring bak a certian number of yew billets per trip. According to professional bowyers I've corresponded with in the States, American yew is probably the best there is for making bows, with the Italian stuff second.

I've never tried to make a yew bow; can't get the right wood, haven't got enough skill, and the sawdust is poisonous...
 
In my readings about making bows, I always was under the impression that a lot of Yew bows, at least built in this country by St. Charles, Massey, and Welch, we done with two billets attached by a bowyers joint or a fish joint. It takes time to match limbs, makes for longer tillering, but it also allows the bowyer to utilize much smaller pieces of wood, and helps conserve the trees that are harvested.

I know that our American Yew is somewhat larger and straighter, but weren't a lot of composit bows built with smaller pieces joined together?

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Watakushi Wa Shinajin Desu
DeathDancer
 
:
You're welcome Tom.
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I am fortunate that I usually get enough material to make my own sinew if I want.
Of course the longer backstrap pieces most desired aren't available as few people know how to skin it out properly.

Interesting about the Yew being poisonous and something I didn't know. The Bois'D Arc is also said to be poisonous, but it has never troubled me and since I have learned that I do take precautions now.

Tom what about the Elm that grows in your country?
Isn't that the wood that the old bows found in the bogs are made from? Seems as if there's another wood they were made from as well, but I can't recall what it was.It may have been Ash come to think of it though. It was from reading about these old bows that I learned that the heartwood was the part used for bows. I was told as a youngster that the heartwood was too brittle for bows, but was good for wheel spokes and other weight bearing loads.

Both Elm and Ash of the right variety that grows in the lower 48 is excellent bow wood as is the Black Locust the Cherokee used.
The Elm and Ash are the most likely ones to be found straight enough and free from knots. Red or "Slippery" Elm is the preferred variety of Elm.
I believe that all species of Ash except for the "Green Ash" is suitable for bows.

Hopefully the Bois'D Arc or Osage Orange I have will be nicely cured by spring to start carving a bow.
The last time I looked the oil that was put on it had kept it from severe cracking. I will at least get a couple of nice short bows from it I hope.
A nice long bow would be really nice.


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&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;---¥vsa----&gt;®

"Remember that the best relationship is one in which your love for each other exceeds your need for each other."

~~~~~~~~~~~~ The Dalai Lama ~~~~~~~
 
Yvsa; you're absolutely right about elm, which was used in the construction of the Meare Heath bow, a 74" semi-pyramid flatbow drawing approx. 60lb@28". Both elm and ash are recommended as good bowmaking woods in the Trad. Bowyers' Bible; not the first choice for performance, but perfectly good (and ash is relatively easy to work because the rings are easy to follow) Elm was certainly used by the makers of the medieval English D-section longbow when yew wasn't available, as there are entries in government accounts from the period recording the purchase of elm billets.

(Elm is practically unavailable as a bow-making wood in Britain these days; about 30 years ago, all our native elm trees were killed off by Dutch Elm Disease, and although a disease resistant strain has successfully been introduced, it'll be many years before mature trees are available. This is a tragedy, since elm was a primary ingredient in classic English cabinet-making)

As regards sapwood & heartwood; as I understand it, the thing about yew that makes it so special is the way sapwood and heartwood work together in a yew billet. The sapwood forms the back and has enormous tensile capacity, while the heartwood forms the belly and is capable of withstanding intense compression - the yew bow is, in effect, a 'self composite'...
 
Yvsa; forgot to mention this in my earlier post. For combing out the sinew into strands after pounding it, have you tried using a file card (small wood-backed wire brush used for unclogging the teeth of files)?
 
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