Sooner State Knives, what a piece of work.

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So first off let me be clear about this review. This is a situation that is currently unfolding with Kenny of SSK and my best friend. The reason I have so much info regarding this case is because my friend told me about it and I've been give access to his evilbay account and have seen the responses between himself and Sooner State (Kenny, since he gives his name in some of them). The case is still unfolding but SSK escalated it today over what I think is a trivial thing(Shipping cost). I'm here, to let you all know the kind of person this guy is, to help my friend, and to help you all know about this sour experience (since my friend is not a member of this forum), since this issue can potentially affect knife enthusiasts like us. What has happened is the following.

My friend bought a Microtech Socom elite from Sooner state knives ebay store on 8-10-12 which had an estimated delivery date of 8/14-8/15. Once the item was confirmed to have been paid for, SSK did not provide any tracking notification or dc.

As of Sunday 8/20 the package was still not at our residence (I'm the guys roomate), USPS had not left their usual note saying they had failed at delivery and the package was waiting at the post office at any time during the previous week.

These are the actual messages between them.

FRIEND on 8/19/12:
"Dear ssknife,

hi,

I still have not received the knife and you did not provide a tracking number, did you get a tracking number when you shipped it?"

SSk 8/19/12:

"Your knife was shipped on 8/10/12 via priority mail. Priority mail does not
provide a tracking number but the package was insured and will require a
signature. The insured number is VJ 007 400 864 US. We are not able to track
the package by that number but your post office can. The package is probably
waiting for you at your Post Office. Thanks, Kenny"

So on Monday 8/20/12 I personally go with my friend to the post office to check this guys story out, and to get his MT. Of course the postal worker says no, nothings here. So from then on my friend opens a case up on SSK with Ebay.


This is the message my friend sent to SSK on 8/20/12:
"The item I purchased from you never got to me. I was provided with no tracking information regarding this item. Upon contacting you the seller, you suggested I go to the local post office to retrieve the item that was according to you, waiting for me there. Today I went to my local post office and the postal worker who assisted me confirmed that the item is also not there. So it appears no one has my item and that's the problem. I never have any record of it actually being mailed or being at the post office, and I don't have it in my possession. I would like a full refund since I have not been provided with the item I paid for. "

SSK responds as follows also on 8/20/12:
"On August 16, I sent the buyer a message stating that the item had been returned to us by the post office because the address was "insufficient". I am perfectly will to refund the purchase price, but not the shipping. It is not our fault that the address was insufficient. "

AND, this is my big bone of contention. I checked my friends ebay message, his gmail (Indox, Spam, Trash) and Nothing! SSK never sent out such a message. BUT my peeve about this whole situation is this. IF SSK had the knife sent back by USPS on August 16, why is Kenny telling us it's at the post office three days later 8/19. He should know it's back. Furthermore, the address isn't insufficient because Paypal and Ebay, as well as all the rest of his mail with the same address cannot all be getting there if it's insufficient. All Kenny provided was an Insurance number on this package, and the guys at the post office couldn't do a damn thing with that because of course that's for the sellers benefit, and it isn't a way to track it.

So today 8/21/12, SSK escalated this all to Ebay to decide because he says he sent the item, but the address is "insufficient" which I think is a BS excuse. He has the item according to his self admission, has had it since the 16th of August, still telling my friend it's at the post office on 8/19, and now he's starting a dispute over what? $hipping costs?

Come on, everyone can see this story is not going right once you admit you have it on 8/16 and then say that it's at the post office on 8/19. On top of that you send out a $250+ knife with insurance but can't pay 75cents to add a tracking slip/DC to the package. Now this guy is fighting my friend over shipping costs.

I'll draw out the conclusion we can all draw out of this which is, 1) You wrote down the wrong address, 2) your lying and you never shipped it.

Your being dishonest, plain and simple. Your story doesn't add up, and my conclusion after having experienced this personally with my buddy, my roomate, is that your not telling the truth. On top of that your fighting him over shipping?

Do the respectable thing, admit w.e. you have to get off your chest and just refund the man, there is no need to dispute over shipping.. You haven't kept your end of the bargain to a customer and your petty arguments aren't holding up under scrutiny, stop damaging your reputation further and do the honorable thing and refund my friend in full like he has asked you to.
 
I know the folks at SSK and their reputation is nearly impeccable. He is a volume seller on 'bay and between all the selling fees and costs paid there I can see doing insurance only and save a few pennies where he can. Stuff happens and sometimes the address doesn't come out in accordance with USPS standards. He's lucky to have received the package back! I know the timeline looks suspect but when you're dealing with dozens of transactions a day it might get mixed up in the shuffle. Make your case to ebay/paypal and chalk it up to experience. There are bigger issues to expend bandwidth over!
T
 
I've bought 2 knives from Sooner State Knives in the past year. Their prices were reasonable and their service was fast and friendly. I would not hesitate to do business with them again.
 
A legitimate dispute over shipping cost responsibilities, and you are calling SSK "a piece of work"?

In almost all instances of returned goods, the Seller will not reimburse shipping costs.

Why are you even involved? Let eBay work it out.
 
Read whats posted. Never got it so can't be considered a return. The address is right so him wanting to put the blame on someone else isn't. Besides details in his story don't check out.
Also he escalated the dispute not my friend. So he wants to argue over shipping and say it's not his problem. Well guess what, it is.
Can he prove he shipped it? No and that's sketchy since all the retailers I've ever bought from, be it $30 knife to knives to over 1k, all provide tracking. Hence I don't care what your opinion is, this is mine, and I'm putting it out there.
Lastly buyers on eBay pay shipping so why's he being petty over shipping if buyers pay it?
 
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I don't dispute the facts of this specific complaint, but I have purchased many knives from Sooner State Knives and have always been very pleased with their service. This is the first time I recall seeing a negative comment about them. I understand your frustration and I would be frustrated if I were in your position. However, even the most reputable dealers have cases where things go wrong. This appears to be one of those times.
 
I've bought 2 knives from Sooner State Knives in the past year. Their prices were reasonable and their service was fast and friendly. I would not hesitate to do business with them again.

+1. It's been a couple years for me, but the transactions with Kenny/Sooner State went perfect. I would recommend SSK without hesitation.
 
I am not taking sides but I have purchased several knives from Sooner State and every sale went perfectly. I am not sure why this has any place on BFC since the buyer is not a member of BFC and the sale did not take place here.
 
I have dealt with SSK on multiple occasions. However, i have only bought items from their website and i have had nothing but good things to say about their service. I'm sorry things aren't working out well for your roommate but Kenny is a great guy and I'm sorry everything didn't work out as you imagined.
 
They told me they "Insure through an outside source" which to me means they pay no insurance and pay any loss out of pocket. I got my knife so NP.
 
The buyer never got the knife but he owes the cost of shipping to the seller who did not get the knife to him?

Oh.
 
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Never had a problem with SSK and my shipping comes to Canada. I know it doesn't necessarily mean anything but.... when I open a package from Kenny there is always a little religious booklet included so I don't have the feeling that he is lying. Cause we all know what happens to sinners :D
 
Did the buyer get the item ordered? The record says, "no" - subject to any contrary evidence.

Did the seller nevertheless launch an effort to force the buyer to pay for the shipping on the item that never reached the buyer? Record says "yes" - subject to any contrary evidence.

ISSUE: Does a buyer who does not receive the merchandise owe - legally or morally - or under the rules of BF - the cost of shipping to the seller who is actively pursuing the buyer for that amount?

The seller's past or future reliability, good odor in this community, lovely smile, or political correctness, if any, is not relevant to this issue.

It is relevant to your willingness to ignore whether the seller is in the right on the issue.
 
Tomas Linton's post #14 sums it up very well. That fact that many people think Kenny is great does not change the fact that he did not complete his side of the bargain based on current available evidence. He is showing very poor form even asking, let alone making a PayPal claim against the buyer for shipping costs.
Kenny may be great.....but remember it only takes one "Oh Sh*t" to erase ten "atta boys" or something like that.

Paul
 
I've never dealt with this company but i'll throw a few things out there that i've learned selling on ebay.

1. All priority postage printed from Paypal, Ebay, and USPS.com includes free delivery confirmation. If this is a company that does big business i cant see them standing in line at the post offfice to pay for postage so they more than likely used one of these online options.

2. All ebay transactions totalling $250 or more are required by Paypal to be signed for upon delivery for the seller to be covered under the seller protection policy. If the seller did not have a signature confirmation on the package its very easy to file a complaint with paypal to get your full refund back.

I guarantee paypal will side with the buyer here. Why should the buyer pay shipping for something he did not receive? If i was the buyer and havent received my refund yet i would file a claim with paypal right away before the seller tries to dispute anything further on his end. Its a very simple case: buyer never received item and seller has no proof it was sent/delivered. Case closed.
 
I've had very good international (to Europe) service from SS in the past, quality knives for sure. Nowadays their shipping charges are very high so I don't use them now. I'm not keen on getting the religious tracts with the parcel though......
 
Did the buyer get the item ordered? The record says, "no" - subject to any contrary evidence.

Did the seller nevertheless launch an effort to force the buyer to pay for the shipping on the item that never reached the buyer? Record says "yes" - subject to any contrary evidence.

ISSUE: Does a buyer who does not receive the merchandise owe - legally or morally - or under the rules of BF - the cost of shipping to the seller who is actively pursuing the buyer for that amount?

The seller's past or future reliability, good odor in this community, lovely smile, or political correctness, if any, is not relevant to this issue.

It is relevant to your willingness to ignore whether the seller is in the right on the issue.

The seller is not claiming he is "owed" shipping; simply that he won't refund it out of pocket. The buyer is the one who wants his shipping refunded. The knife was sent-according to the seller-thus the money was spent. No one is gaining any money from s&h. EBay prices are listed with the shipping price next to or below it, or always has shipping information. If the buyer wanted tracking, perhaps he should have contacted the seller and asked for it.
 
The seller is not claiming he is "owed" shipping; simply that he won't refund it out of pocket. The buyer is the one who wants his shipping refunded. The knife was sent-according to the seller-thus the money was spent. No one is gaining any money from s&h. EBay prices are listed with the shipping price next to or below it, or always has shipping information. If the buyer wanted tracking, perhaps he should have contacted the seller and asked for it.

If you purchased an item and never received it would you be ok with the seller keeping the shipping cost? I sure wouldnt. I pay shipping to receive my item, if i never receive it then what am i paying for? The seller doesnt have proof he ever even sent the package.

Its the sellers responsibility to provide tracking on the package, especially when its a high priced item and a signature is required by Paypal.
 
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