Spine Whacking....

Discussion in 'Round Eye Knife & Tool Forum' started by Ken Cook, Nov 11, 2001.

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  1. Don Rearic

    Don Rearic

    Oct 8, 1998
    You're getting in the "Don Groove," Kenneth...you're finally realizing that engaging this person [and a few others on the same topic, as well as others...] is about as emotionally rewarding as beating up a retarded kid.
  2. TomMarker


    Feb 22, 1999
    I thought about responding with a post that discusses the joy of beating retarded kids, but I decided against it.
  3. Gator97

    Gator97 Gold Member Gold Member

    Apr 10, 2000
    Is that why U never miss a chance to bark and insult someone for one reason or the other?
  4. Safety Guy

    Safety Guy

    Mar 9, 2001
    We at the Ohio State University school of Physical Activities and Educational Services completely deny having taught Tom Marker any combatives dealing with "Developmentally Disabled Children." We do not condone the activity of causing harm to such children, nor have we ever addressed such a subject in our self-defense classes.

    He must have gotten this from somewhere else; perhaps Paladin Press or an obscure, secretive Tang Soo Do kata?

    Karl Spaulding
    Assistant Instructor,
    Basic Self-Defense (PAES 172);
    Instructor (Spring '01),
    Advanced Self-Defense (PAES 631.20)
  5. Don Rearic

    Don Rearic

    Oct 8, 1998
    You see, Gator, even I can be wrong. I was wrong for comparing you to retarded children in a roundabout way...

    Retarded children do something you never do...at least they try not to be stupid. It seems to be a natural gift with you.

    Before you go getting further bent out of shape...Ken Cook was trying to explain something to you that is either so far beyond your level of comprehension on the physical plane that you should not comment on it...if you are that ignorant of things...

    Or perhaps he was correct when he thought you were just arguing for the lack of having nothing better to do.

    When a few people, myself included, came to the conclusion that you might be having problems with the English Language, we were Xenophobic bullies...so...OK...now you're just being stupid or stubborn and once again...

    We're just so mean. You're free to compose what you want around here, but when it makes no sense or you start chasing your tail, when something is so painfully explained to you in detail...and you just keep chewing on it in such a stubborn fashion, I would imagine these responses to you are proper.
  6. Gator97

    Gator97 Gold Member Gold Member

    Apr 10, 2000
    You see, Gator, even I can be wrong
    I do :) UR wrong More often than U think, but that's Ok, as most of the times U apparently have good intentions in your mind, right? Otherwise why would you come to this thread to start yet another flame.

    Or perhaps he was correct when he thought you were just arguing for the lack of having nothing better to do.
    Or alternatively, he had nothing better to say than "UR obtuse" for the lack of any arguments. Later you come in, to steer things up.

    When a few people, myself included, came to the conclusion that you might be having problems with the English Language, we were Xenophobic bullies...
    That's not exactly true, is it? Nobody accused U of that. I didn't object about my english problems, no probs admitting them. I said it was hypocrisy to dump on my english because I said I had problems with my EKI knife. I have never seen neither you nor Ken, nor anyone criticizing EKI fan's language and grammar. Correct?
    If I am not, please show me your msg, where you do that grammar check Ok? Which, using your terminology shows what the "fair" means to you.

    so...OK...now you're just being stupid or stubborn and once again...
    U forgot to mention that your benchmade knives had stripped screws, the "they provide old info" complaint, and your favorite speech would've been completed :)

    Every time someone disagrees with U, you end up with labeling him stupid, jarhead, etc. Now that's really smart. You may find it unbelievable that someone may disagree with the ultimate truth you preach there, sorry to disappoint :(

    We're just so mean.
    I personally consider doing that online, to be plain stupid, you apparently think that makes U better, more power to you.
  7. Don Rearic

    Don Rearic

    Oct 8, 1998
    Blah, blah, blah...more B.S., you need a new pacifier, you've gnawed through the one you currently have.
  8. Keith Montgomery

    Keith Montgomery

    May 9, 2000
    Don, you've been through this type of thing before. It might be best just to walk away. This isn't going anywhere and is it really worth the headache?
  9. Safety Guy

    Safety Guy

    Mar 9, 2001
    Well I don't want to get in any arguments here, but I will relate my experiences with "spinewhacking."

    It wasn't until BF that I had heard of such a thing, so as soon as I did, my old Endura was the first knife to get it. After that, my large Ascent, my CS Gunsite II, and maybe a few others.

    Then I read that spinewhacking was "bad," and would damage the knife.
    Made sense. But my old Endura, my GS II and my Ascent are all just about as tight as can be (especially my old Endura, which is TIGHTER both vertically and horizontally than some of my newer knives).

    Spine whacked my cheap M16-13Z and was impressed with the solidity of it's liner lock.

    I believe the spine whack test is probably more injurious to some knives than others. From my readings here, coupled with my personal experience, I have now become a "spine whacking moderate."

    How applicable to combat is it? To everyday use? I don't know. I do figure that a knife that can't pass a stiff whack into one's open palm should not be relied upon for S-D or heavy use of any kind.

    But I am definitely going easy on my Sifu. I don't think I ever whacked it onto a hard surface, but only a mouse pad on my desk (or my palm). I got lucky with my Sifu, as it has never given me any reason for doubt about it's lockup. It began with the lock button about centered in the slot at lockup, but has worn in nicely to a noticeable forward-of-center position. The shiny lockup area on the tang is now even-looking and about 1/32" wide. Not a lot, in my opinion, but it seems to do.

    IMO, heavy, prolonged spine whacking of the Sifu would probably ruin it. Steel can only get so hard, and even the best hardened steel doesn't have much area to handle pressure at a 1/32" x tang width dimension.

    My Griptilian (Axis lock) has only been whacked into my palm or moderately onto a padded area. I have full confidence in it as well, although we have been warned by no less than CJ Carracci that the Axis lock may not be suitable for stabs when the thumb is near the button.

    FWIW, I have never had any knife close on me during a spine whack "test."

    My advice would be to go lightly and sparingly on spinewhacks, especially for locks like the rolling lock, and sizeable knives like the Sifu. Lockbacks of good quality are probably less likely to be damaged. I've done plenty of it with my XL Voyager, and it is still quite tight.

    And what of the usefulness of this questionable test? Just to check lockup at a different "frequency" than a "gentle pressure-applied by hand test" and to put some folks' minds to rest. If it gives you greater confidence in your safety equipment, and does no damage, then why not?

    Another "test" to consider is the "slash and stab into thick cardboard and comma cut test," which did loosen the lateral tightness of my FRN Native and my Goddard LW. Haven't tried enough of my other knives to see what adjustable pivots will do after being subjected to this one. Again, my old Endura, which has thicker FRN on at least one side of the pivot area, fared better. I believe this test to be more combat applicable than most, since it also tells you what your handgrip will do with the lock mechanism under more realistic stress. I found my left hand grip on my Native went to full hammer grip and pressed the lock bar in, slightly loosening the bladelock. The Native has a rather large opening for the lock bar, which I think is detrimental to it's use as a "S-D device." Other lockblades I own have smaller thumb openings at the lock bar. I need to test more, and I have not yet tested my Sifu this way. (BAD KARL!)

    In conclusion (and IMO), if you attach too much importance to the "spinewhack test" and do it too much and too hard, then you really need a fixed blade to set your mind at rest.

    BTW, much the same goes for "inertia openings." Too much with the wrong knife, and you'll eventually loosen it before it's time. Much more fun, and potentially useful, than a spine whack, though!

    Obsubjective-ively yours,

  10. Ken Cook

    Ken Cook

    Feb 19, 1999
    Okay dammit that's it.

    Listen carefully.
    Yes, I have plenty of further argument as to why Fencing is a sport that has more in common with Tennis than it has with fighting. If you want to hear part of it, post your questions in the Sword forum where they will be on topic rather than hijacking a thread about Spine Whack Testing.

    If you want to know ALL the arguments, come to Arkansas, pay me for the lessons and I promise I'll school you in all the finer points. I get great satisfaction from showing Fencers why the sport they learned doesn't work in a fight.

    Why do I say you're being intentionally obtuse?
    Why do I say I do not wish to argue for the sake of argument?

    Because you apparently have some strange compulsion to take any discussion possible (with certain BFC members), turn it into an argument and then win it.

    Of course, the manner in which you try to "win" is to take a tangental statement, focus on that to the exclusion of the topic at hand, and ask the same damned question over and over and over.

    Does my sword work translate to knife fighting?
    Jim Bowie thought so, I understand that James Keating does too.
    Are you going to dig up Jim Bowie and tell him he was wrong?

    Are you going to tell James Keating he doesn't know what he's talking about?

    Yes, you probably would.

    At any rate, since you have managed to completely hijack this thread away from the very worth while original topic and take it walking down the out house trail...
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