Spyderco edges

[sodak]

Will do Thom, thanks!

I forgot to add - what you are describing is a recurrent theme with me... But that's ok, it's all in the pursuit of knowledge!

 

[A druid]

I was just reading an article on steel and it mentioned the fact that in order to get the highest performance out of a given steel and must be matched with the proper microbevel obviously get a steel tough enough to handle a 30° inclusive edge and you only sharpen it to 40° and not using the steel to its potential. I think in a perfect world each deal would have its own slightly different microbevel angle. As for spyderco I have never noticed any inconsistencies in their grind lines that it's not something I have focused on. Does anybody know what angle Microtec or William Henry sharpen their knives to both seem to have all not quite a sharp good initial sharpness and sharpen ability. While the one bench made I have has taken me God knows how many hours of sharpening despite the fact I had it belt sharpened at the store because it was a display model and possibly not because of that not very sharp. By the way as any what he know what angle if you can use such a term spyderco's serrated edges are sharpened at

 

[db]

Oh good grief. I never said a edge that looks good has to be perfect. And I’ve have tried to make the point that a edge that looks good at the same sharpness is a more impressive sharpening than one that is ugly. Cliff has argued against that point and then tried to bring up many many side issues for what ever reason. Now he’s comparing hand ground to jigs, where did that come from? Hand ground edges can be just as good looking as they are sharp.
“
Cliff in this post said ..
What I said was that that while Spyderco's are highly praised for their sharpness, they do not have the crisp and even bevels that you get from jig sharpening.
But what he really says is this..
“
I email makers on a regular basis about lots of things which are of no importance to me such as initial sharpness, blade finish and so forth. I do this
to confirm behavior when I note details in the review. Though it is amazing that you can cite this to argue your point and ignore the actual details which
confirm the bevels are uneven. My Delica ZDP-189 has similar problems as there is no way to belt sand edges on a speed production line and get even visual
bevels especially without a choil notch and on highly radical bevels like the Dodo. But yet inspite of this there are no wide spread complaints and almost
uniform praise.
Not really the same thing. I’d be willing to bet that if the edges were ugly and way uneven, wavy or just bad looking that they would be complained about, and not uniformly praised. Just like many many people did about Benchmade before they changed their sharpening. And yes they complained about the looks of the edge grinds even though Cliff tries to say they looked fine witch they didn’t. You all can pretend Looks don’t make a difference and if your honest you will admit they do. I’ve tried to clearly make my point “ a good looking edge is more impressive than an ugly one at the same sharpness” in the other thread. Enough from me responding to side issues. I’m still trying to figure out what most of them have to do with ugly edges being more impressive than a good looking one, or is that the other way around?

I was hopeing to hear in this thread, about how good or ugly Spyderco is putting edges on there new knives. Every Spyderco knife I’ve seen has a very good looking edge on it, but I haven’t really seen any new ones this year. So the question remains.

 

[db]

Btw I've reprofiled my Caly JR also. It's now a very thin convex smooth even very good looking edge that blends in very nicely to the blade grind. The new convexed edge grind goes up over half way up the blade. it's beautiful

 

[spoonrobot]

Four new spydercos for me this month alone. Atlantic Salt, Delica 4, Native, and Rescue 93MM. All four knives have even bevels and typically good edges. About on par with the other four spyderco knives I have bought previous to this year.

I think it is a good thing for knives to come with even factory edges that are clean and neat but it is incidental for me since after cutting tests I obliterate the factory edge anyway and sharpen it to the angle/profile I use.

Spyderco in general seems to be tops among the brands I have purchased over the years. My personal opinion but I have seen at least 3 knives from Benchmade, Buck, CRKT, and SOG since starting this hobby about two years ago and Spyderco has been the best, oddly enough CRKT was almost even with them though in edge fit/finish.

 

[Cliff Stamp]

While the one bench made I have has taken me God knows how many hours of sharpening despite the fact I had it belt sharpened at the store because it was a display model and possibly not because of that not very sharp.

Usually this is a relief grind issues, with a coarse stone grind the edge at about 10-15 degrees per side (depending on what you want to do) and now sharpen as you normally would at your desired angle. This method was popularized by John Juranitch.

By the way as any what he know what angle if you can use such a term spyderco's serrated edges are sharpened at

It changes from one model to the next, from about 15 to 25 degrees included. Thus about half of the included angle of the v-ground bevels.

... hand ground to jigs, where did that come from?

Hand grinding without jigs won't produce the same exact curvature you get from jigs obviously and introduces differences in angle along the edge and from knife to knife. It is usually very easy to tell which knives are hand ground and which are jigs from just looking at them.

I have drastically reprofiled a Calypso Junior to make its cutting ability acceptible ....

It doesn't count if you start from a Trainer. I'd like to see a deep hollow ground Calpyso Jr. similar to the Sebenza but with a much thinner and more acute edge so you don't end up sharpening the really wide bevel I have on mine. I will get that reground one of these days, Krein would do an amazing job on it. If I lived next to him or Wilson I would have almost everyone of my blades primary reground. I spent 20 minutes yesterday lowering the sabre grind on a 154CM knife and only got to about half of where I wanted to go.

All not too surprising since Spyderco sharpens their knifes by hand.

Essentially, nothing different than any of the other production companies I have seen. Some of their knives have larger differences, the ones with the radical curves but I would praise anyone who sharpened them anyway. I'd like to watch the guy who zips around the Dodo edge.


-Cliff

 

[db]

“
Cliff said..
Hand grinding without jigs won't produce the same exact curvature you get from jigs obviously and introduces differences in angle along the edge and from
knife to knife.

Correct! And for that reason a hand ground edge can look better than one put on from a jig. Your not limited to the jig and can make adjustments to match the knife.

“
It is usually very easy to tell which knives are hand ground and which are jigs from just looking at them.
Yup sometimes it is. And back when I was using jigs I’d get some ugly looking edges just because the way a jig doesn’t give much ajustment without a lot of fuss. Or at least not as easily as free hand.

Does anyone else have comments on how ugly or good looking their newer Spyderco edges are, or have been?

 

[Sal Glesser]

c'mon guys, "ugly is as ugly does", but cut they do! cuz we really focus on that.

Can't we just say they're "more natural" looking?

sal

 

[db]

Sal I'm trying to say Spyderco has very impressive edges because they are not only very sharp but they look good as well. Probably the best in the industery. I have never seen an ugly edge on a Spyderco knife. I'm sure you are not trying to say in your post that Spyderco doesn't care how the edges look on the knives and Spyderco is only concerned that they are sharp. Or are you saying that?

 

[JD Spydo]

This is an outright total outrage. This is grounds for a slander suit . This is a bucket of BS and a drove of falacy and pure poppycock. All I can say for the schmuck that started this baseless rumor is the next time you go to your local Walgreen drug store>> The laxatives are on isle # 3 . Or you can go the Castor Oil route :thumbdn:

Spyderco's quality has NEVER BEEN in question. Edges, handles, blade steels or whatever. But we will accept an apology >> in writing

 

[Hair]

Of the production companies in its class, I think Spyderco has some of the most evenly ground final bevels.

 

[bigbcustom]

I have seen some wavey edges that were caused by improper grinding on several knives I have purchased from some very reputable makers, but never on any of the fifteen or so spydercos I own...some variance in bevel width certainly, but very little. The worst I have ever seen on a quality knife was on my SRKW Howling Rat where the edge viewed straight down from above was actually wavey like a snake....a little judicious application of my belt grinder and some hand honing fixed that right up. I am not bashing them as the Howler is an excellent knife...just illustrating the point that even the most "revered" (as srkw and busse seem to be) knife makers can have a few "oops" knives slip through. Never anything that couldn't be fixed with a little work.

 

[T.K.C.]

I happen to be a huge Spyderco fan. I presonally do not care about Cliff Stamp's opinion either way. Spyderco makes excellent knives, they listen to their ELU's (customers), and are innovative. You get a lot of knife for a little money.My edges are very even. I have NEVER had an uneven edged Spyderco, EVER.

 

[Cliff Stamp]

And for that reason a hand ground edge can look better than one put on from a jig.

If if pleases you to have differences in angle, width and curvature along the edge then yes it can. I think this is a very nice looking edge :

But when I see such blades I am not looking at the lack of machine precision tooling but rather I see a piece which by defination of a knife as a cutting tool was taken to its extreme limits devoid of any other influence and thus set a benchmark for performance in regards to cutting ability, edge retention and ease of sharpening. Now the guy who made that would be worth talking to about knives, steels, sharpening and edge retention.

When someone hands me a knife which is free from any scratchs/wear and looks like a show piece just taken off a table, then that doesn't impress me as a knife at all. It was never seriously used, nor is intended to be used, and the user has obviously no ability to be discriminating of the tool so their opinion has little weight. It is carried as a showpiece and that is fine, but it isn't impressive at all as a knife.

However when someone shows me a knife which is scratched, which does have an uneven bevel, which even shows a bit of curvature near the choil or a worn tip due mainly to field sharpening on less than ideal materials, and then that guy says "this is a good knife". Well then I am impressed because he carried that knife as a working tool for a long time and obviously it worked very well.

You can see the same general considerations in Glessers products. I have seen other edges which aesthetically look better, any machine ground knife with a jig sharpened edge will have pretty much perfect and symmetrical visuals but as a cutting tool they leave much to be desired. I have handled lots of Spyderco's which don't impress me at all aesthetically, I don't recall any however which failed to do so as a knife.

-Cliff

 

[db]

Wow way to take a quote and completely change the meaning. For the record I have 2 of Alvins blades however, that has nothing to do with this thread. Nor does most of your last post.

 

[Cliff Stamp]

As I noted in the origional thread, and in the last post, impressive sharpness is distinct from aesthetic visuals and you can readily have one without the other, even in extremes. As stated, I would see reflections on use as much more impressive than crisp lines if someone showed me a knife, which was the topic of the origional thread, how to impress someone with a sharp knife. Most people who use knives would do similar as tools in general which show no use and are in mint condition are collector pieces and show no worth as a cutting tools.

-Cliff

 

[Phil Brown]

I don't think anybody quite understood what db was asking in the first place, and I think I know why. As far as I can tell, db wants to know if anyone has noticed aesthetic flaws in Spyderco knives of late. He also wants to know if anyone thinks that Spyderco is ignoring the visual appeal of their blades on the basis that their sharpness makes up for it. Apologies if I too have misunderstood, db.

The thread quickly turned into a debate of aesthetics vs. performance, and it was a fairly good read except for the fact that the original question was sidestepped in most of the posts. But Sal basically cut beyond the speculation and said that the focus was on function rather than form. So, the only question left is: Has anyone actually bought a Spyderco knife with an ugly (but functional) edge?

 

[db]

Martini I think you understand it perfectly.

 

[Cliff Stamp]

Has anyone actually bought a Spyderco knife with an ugly (but functional) edge?

All of the Spyderco's I have seen have had as Hob noted, variances in edge angle/width due to hand sharpening. The most significant is seen on knives like the Dodo which have radical curves and the most even edges are on straight knives like the Pelican. The ones with choil notches are also more even than the ones without because of the effect of running the belt into the unsharpened choil usually makes a swerve/thicking.

-Cliff

 

[db]

WOW Cliff it sounds like you are getting all the rejects, or ones that slip by qc. Maybe you need to get them from a different dealler. I take it from most of the posts in this thread that most are getting factory edges that look good, yes on the newer Spydercos also. I have yet to see an ugly edge on one in person.