Spyderco Southard vs. Hinderer gen. 6 XM-18 sheepsfoot.

The main difference between them is the Hinderer is taller from edge to spine. Length - they have the same blade length (3.5") and the Hinderer handle is maybe 3/16" longer. The Southard had about 1/4" more edge for the same blade, and the large choil on the Hinderer to me is just too large. Advantage Spyderco.

In a hard grip, the belly of the Hinderer has two areas where the thin edge of the scales bites into my fingers. One is at my pinky finger, and the other is at the index finger in the finger pocket. The finger pocket on the Hinderer is also a touch cramped because of the way the flipper tab curls back so much. It's more neutral on the Spydie. I always thought the Southard handle would not be tall enough, but it is. I also like that the show scale on the Southard is cut back at the lockbar access. I am almost convinced I am going to cut some relief (just a very small amount) on my Hinderer, which will give better lockbar access, and maybe relieve some of the bite on my index finger in a hard grip. Advantage Spyderco.

The Southard is CTS 204P steel. I believe this is a premium steel, but I have zero experience with it. Hinderer is CPM 20CV and I really like this steel. Advantage Hinderer only because of experience with one and none with the other.

The Southard is a thinner blade, hollow grind. I am sure both can be made to be very sharp. Both of mine are wearing factory edges at the moment, but I have a hunch the Southard blade geometry is a performer, whereas the Hinderer is a bit of a brute here (a known feature). Advantage Spyderco, I think.

Flipping action, lockup and centering on both are perfect. I made an "armorers tool" and a flat screw driver out of 1964 Nickles (coin silver, softer metal), so I can adjust the pivot on the Hinderer. I got both blades flipping nicely and both are dead center. The flipper tab on the Hinderer is sharp at the point. The Spydie is slightly rounded. They have the same flipping action but I like the tab on the Southard. Advantage Spyderco.

Pocket clip on these both are nice, but my Southard came with the deep clip installed. I am not going to put the stock clip on it. I like them both and don't have any preference here. Neutral.

Cost - I bought these both on the secondary market at about a 3 to 1 price difference. Advantage Southard, by a large margin!

Oh, one more thing. The scale cutout on the Spydie puts your thumb right where it needs to be to disengage the lock. On the Hinderer my thumb slipped once when I was closing the knife and the blade clacked down on top of my knuckle and bit me pretty good. I need to be careful. Not a fault of the Hinderer design, I just need to pay attention. But the Southard cutout just seems smarter to me.
 
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Both knives are outstanding. But for the money, I'd have to say the more budget friendly Southard is the winner. On the secondary market they can be a fantastic bargain.
 
TRfromMT said:
The main difference between them is the Hinderer is taller from edge to spine. Length - they have the same blade length (3.5") and the Hinderer handle is maybe 3/16" longer. The Southard had about 1/4" more edge for the same blade, and the large choil on the Hinderer to me is just too large. Advantage Spyderco.

In a hard grip, the belly of the Hinderer has two areas where the thin edge of the scales bites into my fingers. One is at my pinky finger, and the other is at the index finger in the finger pocket. The finger pocket on the Hinderer is also a touch cramped because of the way the flipper tab curls back so much. It's more neutral on the Spydie. I always thought the Southard handle would not be tall enough, but it is. I also like that the show scale on the Southard is cut back at the lockbar access. I am almost convinced I am going to cut some relief (just a very small amount) on my Hinderer, which will give better lockbar access, and maybe relieve some of the bite on my index finger in a hard grip. Advantage Spyderco.

The Southard is CTS 204P steel. I believe this is a premium steel, but I have zero experience with it. Hinderer is CPM 20CV and I really like this steel. Advantage Hinderer only because of experience with one and none with the other.

The Southard is a thinner blade, hollow grind. I am sure both can be made to be very sharp. Both of mine are wearing factory edges at the moment, but I have a hunch the Southard blade geometry is a performer, whereas the Hinderer is a bit of a brute here (a known feature). Advantage Spyderco, I think.

Flipping action, lockup and centering on both are perfect. I made an "armorers tool" and a flat screw driver out of 1964 Nickles (coin silver, softer metal), so I can adjust the pivot on the Hinderer. I got both blades flipping nicely and both are dead center. The flipper tab on the Hinderer is sharp at the point. The Spydie is slightly rounded. They have the same flipping action but I like the tab on the Southard. Advantage Spyderco.

Pocket clip on these both are nice, but my Southard came with the deep clip installed. I am not going to put the stock clip on it. I like them both and don't have any preference here. Neutral.

Cost - I bought these both on the secondary market at about a 3 to 1 price difference. Advantage Southard, by a large margin!

Oh, one more thing. The scale cutout on the Spydie puts your thumb right where it needs to be to disengage the lock. On the Hinderer my thumb slipped once when I was closing the knife and the blade clacked down on top of my knuckle and bit me pretty good. I need to be careful. Not a fault of the Hinderer design, I just need to pay attention. But the Southard cutout just seems smarter to me.
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Cts 204p is the same steel as 20cv.

Southard is an excellent knife. It’s only flaws I see are the very thin support washers the ball bearings roll on. (Between the bbs and the inside if the Ti)
 
Spyderco is not as clunky as the Hinderer XM-18. I guess it depends on how much weight you want to haul around all day. Both will cut!!!
 
I remember being blown away by the quality of the southard when I got one. It blows away a lot of other more expensive knives IMO.
 
KVT said:
More importantly, why are there scale screws on the lock side of the XM instead of nuts?
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More important than what?

They are screws from both directions, on both knives. Not sure I get the question. I haven't taken either apart, but both have turned standoff spacers, looks like the same type of construction.
 
That is not typical of Gen6 XM Hinderers, at all. Usually it’s lock side nuts passing through stand-offs with show-side scale screws.
Definitely the most interesting thing in this thread, for me anyway. It’s the little things.
 
KVT said:
That is not typical of Gen6 XM Hinderers, at all. Usually it’s lock side nuts passing through stand-offs with show-side scale screws.
Definitely the most interesting thing in this thread, for me anyway. It’s the little things.
Click to expand...

Well that is interesting. I just did a quick search through sales threads and other posts looking at gen 6 Hinderers. The only one I find with the screw (socket head fastener, at any rate) is on a CPM 20CV bladed XM-18. The M390 bladed knives appear to have nut-fasteners.

Anyone else care to wade into this?

@whitty do you happen to know what standard fastener is on the lock side of the above Hinderer?
 
The steel is the same on both, as others have mentioned. They both also share the ability to have new clothes slapped on them for a different look, which IMO sets them apart from the all-titanium crowd:

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I guess I don't have to tell you which of the two I'd prefer. ;)
 
I was surprised that the Spyderco Southard was discontinued. Particularly with all the interest in flippers. Wasn t this Spyderco s first flipper?
Fine knife.
 
And I do have to admit that the Southard is quite a knife. Its hard to believe the Hinderer is twice the money . It must be just because of the name more than anything else. Plus Hinderer is more in the realm of semi-custom right?
 
Paul L. said:
And I do have to admit that the Southard is quite a knife. Its hard to believe the Hinderer is twice the money . It must be just because of the name more than anything else. Plus Hinderer is more in the realm of semi-custom right?
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"Mid-tech" maybe. Certainly customizable. I personally prefer production/mid-tech in folders. I think they can have better (more consistent) QC, and a better price, than a custom or semi-custom. Purely my opinion on this, but I'd take this Hinderer over just about any custom or semi-custom folder. I know what I'm getting.
 
I was going to say mid-tech but wasn't sure . i agree with the QC thing, many people have got Spydercos with bad QC including Southards and any flippers that used the caged bearings with those .004" washers . My Southard is mint and also my Domino. But like my Mantra I have some issues and actually am in the process of making my own replacement washers to replace them . I found some hardened bearing washers that might just work. But not 100% sure yet . Got a digital caliper and everything, that's why I knew they were .004".
 
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