Stainless Mule

gnius · Dec 28, 2008

Has there ever been a stainless-steel Mule? Or more importantly, is there going to be one coming up shortly?

I've been so impressed with the Mule design, that I now want a Mule to be my woods fixed blade, in exclusion of everything else.

I would likely have to pay a forum member to craft handles and a kydex sheath for me, but frankly, I think it'd be worth every penny.

However, while tool-steel Mules must cut very well, I simply don't think that I have the discipline to take care of a non-stainless blade. I've heard the rumors of the 8Cr13Mov (Tenacious steel) Mule. Can anyone shed some light for me?

Thanks.

Maribor · Dec 28, 2008

How about an H-1 Mule. That would suit me fine. About a 4 inch blade will do.

yablanowitz · Dec 28, 2008

Sal has already posted that the next Mule release will be S90V, which is stainless and holds an edge like you can't believe. He also plans on a run of S110V mules as well as a Chinese stainless steel (I don't recall the exact name, only that it wasn't the 8Cr13MoV of the Byrd line).

So no, there aren't any stainless Mules yet, but there will be.

DWRW · Dec 28, 2008

gnius said:
Has there ever been a stainless-steel Mule?

No. Both 52100 and M4 used in Mule1 (aka M1) and Mule2 (aka M2) were non-stainless.

gnius said:
Or more importantly, is there going to be one coming up shortly?

The current rumor is that the next Mule will most likely be S90V which "IS" stainless. But, "shortly" is a relative term. We don't know how long till the next Mule will be released. Sal and Spyderco are obviously VERY busy with MANY different knife projects.

Based on the time between M1 and M2, I would guess another 6 - 12 months for the next Mule release. But, that is just a wild guess.

gnius said:
I've heard the rumors of the 8Cr13Mov (Tenacious steel) Mule. Can anyone shed some light for me?

The current rumor is that the next 3 Mule steels have likely been chosen. It may actually be a fact, but I can't confirm personally. So, I will call it a rumor and let somebody else call it a fact or confirm it.

Anyway, the rumor is the next 3 Mules will be made with:

S90V
ZDP 189
9Cr18Mo

The following thread discussed some possible options for different steels:

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=596872

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Maribor said:
How about an H-1 Mule.

There is no confirmation that I know of confirming H-1 as being a steel chosen for the Mule project. But, I would think there is a reasonable possibility for H-1 being used for such a "test" project considering the unique properties and characteristics of H-1.

Maribor said:
.... About a 4 inch blade will do.

The Mule's blade is about 3.25".

The shape, size, blade geometry and dimensions of the Mule knife has been set and won't change. It is intentionally the same size and shape for all Mule knives and different steels so that there are not variables when comparing the different steels.

The Mule project was created to "test" different steels - Not different knife designs and sizes.

.

yablanowitz · Dec 28, 2008

A side note on H-1. Sal has posted in the past that they cannot flat grind H-1 due to work hardening of the stock during grinding. That's why all the Salt series knives are hollow ground. Since the Mules are flat ground, I doubt we'll see one in H-1.

DWRW · Dec 28, 2008

yablanowitz said:
A side note on H-1. Sal has posted in the past that they cannot flat grind H-1 due to work hardening of the stock during grinding.

Strange... I guess I don't get it. But, whatever the case, I am NOT a fan of hollow grind knives.

Give my FLAT GRIND every day on a folder and either Flat grind or convex on most fixed blades.

About the only type of blade I like Hollow grinds on are for aesthetics or for knives I don't really use like fighters - where weight savings in the blade may have some justification for blade speed. Otherwise, I always prefer the flat or convex.

Since I don't "Need" so much corrosion resistance as H-1 and since there are many other great steels and many sufficiently stainless if I need stainless, I don't really see H-1 in my future.

...... but, that is me. No gripes from me when others have there own preferences. :thumbup:

.

DWRW · Dec 28, 2008

I am still curious to learn more about how S110V compares to S90V.

Josh K · Dec 28, 2008

yablanowitz said:
A side note on H-1. Sal has posted in the past that they cannot flat grind H-1 due to work hardening of the stock during grinding. That's why all the Salt series knives are hollow ground. Since the Mules are flat ground, I doubt we'll see one in H-1.

Why not shape the blade like that initially? Instead of grinding it how about laser cutting in sections? I don't know about the accuracy of most plasma cutters, but if you could fine tune that I'm sure you could get it to work. How do they get all the swedges out of the Rock Salt?

S90V Mule will be expensive. I hope it comes out in 6-12 months, I have to save.

steelscout30 · Dec 28, 2008

I too am eagerly awaiting that S90V Mule.

yablanowitz · Dec 29, 2008

Josh K said:
Why not shape the blade like that initially? Instead of grinding it how about laser cutting in sections? I don't know about the accuracy of most plasma cutters, but if you could fine tune that I'm sure you could get it to work. How do they get all the swedges out of the Rock Salt?

S90V Mule will be expensive. I hope it comes out in 6-12 months, I have to save.

The way Sal explained it, flat grinding is done one side at a time. By the time one side is done, the piece has hardened enough to be very difficult to grind. Hollow grinding is done on both sides at once. As far as I know, the swedge on the Rock Salt is hollow ground the same way as the main grind. I know the outline of the blade is cut with industrial laser cutters, but I don't think you could cut the flats of the blade that way.

SparkyMark86 · Dec 29, 2008

How about an H-1 Mule.

That would be sweet! My thoughts would be for a 3" blade. (damn local laws LOL)

Ben Dover · Dec 29, 2008

yablanowitz said:
Sal has already posted that the next Mule release will be S90V, which is stainless and holds an edge like you can't believe. He also plans on a run of S110V mules as well as a Chinese stainless steel (I don't recall the exact name, only that it wasn't the 8Cr13MoV of the Byrd line).

So no, there aren't any stainless Mules yet, but there will be.

That, sir, is the answer to a prayer! :thumbup::thumbup::
:thumbup: :thumbup:

Josh K · Dec 29, 2008

yablanowitz said:
The way Sal explained it, flat grinding is done one side at a time. By the time one side is done, the piece has hardened enough to be very difficult to grind. Hollow grinding is done on both sides at once. As far as I know, the swedge on the Rock Salt is hollow ground the same way as the main grind. I know the outline of the blade is cut with industrial laser cutters, but I don't think you could cut the flats of the blade that way.

I thought those were flat ground swedges.

I was thinking of taking simple bar stock and putting it in a vise, then laser cutting both sides at once.

But that would make sense, because H1 work hardens, it would be tough to grind. I thought someone said that they had tested H1 with a hardness of 67-69 Rc on the very edge of the blade. It'd be like grinding S125V for fun.

Maribor · Dec 29, 2008

We all have our dream knives (H1 Mule) but rarely a reality. Sv90 sounds sweet and tough. I wonder what that will set us back? I might jump on this one. I was considering a Fallkniven F1 and this might be good competition....or get both. I like the endless possiblities of getting a handle for it. Semi custom.. Thanks Sal and Gang I am looking forward to it.