Steel FAQ follow-up discussion

[twistedneck]

S125V is also probably way to coarse grained for that light an edge, you want a really fine grained steel for that low because the edge simply can't be stable unless is is very fine grained.

Yet another key to a fine edge, fine grain size at the edge. A very good heat treat (low Austenetize temp, fast salt quench, etc.) can produce the finest grain possible.. High alloy steels like S3V or other stainless just cant achive fine grained due to huge alloy content.. are there boundary conditions for grain size vs. edge dimensions?

 

[Cliff Stamp]

...are there boundary conditions for grain size vs. edge dimensions?

Carbides can range from 0.5 to 50 microns from very fine grained steels to really coarse ones. One thousand of an inch is 25 microns. Now the carbides also have to be held in the edge which means the edge has to be *much* thicker to have enough steel around the carbide to hold it in place, just think of rocks in concrete.

As for the steel for a hawkbill, the point of a hawkbill can easily take a violent shock because a cut basically turns into a heavy stab. I would look away from steels like D2 which are designed for abrasion resistance and to steels which are designed to take impacts and have decent flexibility. For example A2 would be much better than D2 in this regard.

-Cliff

 

[ccdog]

Thanks for your work here as a teacher!
I would like to know what you think of the new steels that were not yet out during the earlier discussion. Steels like ZDP 189, S125V, CPM 3V, CPM M4. How do they compare to the previous best liked? Thanks again for your time and help.

Yes, this would be great. I'm esp. insterested in some discussion of ZDP as well as Damasteel powder stainless damascus with RWL-34 and 12C27.

Thanks!

-john

 

[DGG]

JT - Thanks for all the great info. I'm one of your biggest fans and think anyone wanting to join BladeForums should have to read your posting and take and pass a test. It would sure increase the quality of the postings, IMHO.

Two steels that I think deserve more attention are an old one and a new one.

The old one is VG-10 (Spyderco steel I call it since they seem to be the only company to use it in quantitiy). It seems to my layman's eye to be an unusual steel because it (and ATS-55) are the only ones that I know of that use "Cobalt" as an alloying material. Everyone seems to compliment on how well it sharpens but that may also be the result of Spyderco's hollow ground blades.

The new steel is th ZDP-189 which has gobs of carbon and chromium and not much (if anything) else. 3% carbon, and 20% chromium. Getting lots of knife knut press releases lately.

I think a little more emphasis on handle materials, blade/knife safety (blade guards), and general size characteristics would be helpful. Is a good EDC size 2.5, 3.5, or 4.0 inches, etc.

Lastly, I think that in about 25 years all the steel info will be obsolete and all our knives will be interesting historical relics because we will all be using some form of a laser knife which is already used in the medical field. To sharpen, just replace the battery. We can debate laser types and styles then.

Again, thanks for taking the time to educate me with your great posts.