Steel selection for competition cutter

It's easy to build a knife that can compete and cut well. It's not so easy to find an athlete that can absolutely kick butt with it.

Watch a few competitions and you will quickly notice that, like a drag race, they are generally won or lost by fractions of a second.

The precision cuts are obviously important in terms of points, but more often than not, it's the elapsed times in the heavy/power cuts (2X4 chop) that really separate the winners from the losers. There is usually a 2x4 at the beginning and end of every course, and at least one heavy rope-cutting requirement in between.

You may also notice that there are no weight classes, and every BladeSports winner in the last several years is a big ol' boy... 6-footers/200-pounders are pretty much par for the course, and it only goes up from there. It is not at all unusual to see a 300# man simply beat the snot out of a comp cutting course with pure power and focus.

There ain't too many 90# weaklings bashing through a 2x4 in a minute or less, no matter what knife they carry. That kind of work requires a great deal of explosive strength and inertia, and not much endurance. In football terms, we're talking about linemen here, maybe linebackers... not quarterbacks or wide-receivers. It's a quick, brutal, in-the-trenches kind of sport.

In the last few years, the knives have also been getting heavier and thicker... there are a few folks making and using CC knives as thick as 3/8" at the spine, even approaching 1/2"! All in the search of power... I don't know of anyone who's actually won with a knife like that. :rolleyes:

I think that trend has run its course, and I suspect the sport's fans will generally put that nonsense in the past and ease back into almost all competitors using blades with 5/16" spines, and maybe even as thin as 1/4". Dare I predict 3/16" thick knives and lighter, faster competitors?

There's no records left to beat, except those that require strict speed and precision.

Personally, I would like to see a weight class division in BladeSports. Say, over/under 200#, with the same maximum specs for the knives, and the same courses... perhaps with more precision cuts. Quite honestly, the sport has gotten a tad boring... the really big guys have sort of evened-out the field amongst themselves. No one is gonna beat Dan Keffeler in the World Record 2x4 chop anytime soon... so... what's left?

I'll hazard a guess that lighter, nimbler cats would use lighter, faster knives... but that remains to be seen.
 
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Years back we had this same thread discussion about competition cutters. Most agreed that mass was a key factor. My humorous suggestion was a maximum allowed size hybrid blade with a depleted uranium spine attached to a stellite edge. It would take a real he-man to wield it, but the sheer mass would make short work of any chopping cut.
 
from the feedback i have been getting on my knives made from the 1075 i use, i think if i make one it will be from the 1075 i use and with my heat treat, it should be a beast.
 
Have you talked to Dan Keffeler?????

No offense to any of those that have replied, but IMHO it's pretty easy to say what should work in theory... whereas knowing what works in application is a much different beast.

If you look at Dan's competition cutters, they are built like tanks. They're very far removed from what most folks think of as a camp knife--- they are purpose built knives with very specific geometry.

Add in the fact that Dan is a very powerful guy, and has worked really hard at cutting comps... And you see the elements needed to succeed. IMHO.

That is why I would try to talk to Dan about this if I were you. :)


This video says it all!!! :eek: :eek: :eek: :cool: (I didn't think it was even possible, until I heard about this!!!)----

[video=youtube;8_SNB66-wBA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8_SNB66-wBA[/video]
 
I love that video of Dan. IF you watch it closely you see all the technique in it. He gets his whole body into is so well...rise up and drop the weight down with the chop.
 
I love that video of Dan. IF you watch it closely you see all the technique in it. He gets his whole body into is so well...rise up and drop the weight down with the chop.

Right, it's sort of like a heavyweight boxer crouching down so he can use his legs to add power to an uppercut - only backwards.
 
Hello all.

I have been making knives for several years. I recently watched a few of the Bladesports cutting competitions and I decided I want to try my hand at building myself a competition cutter. Ultimately I will build one out of M4, but for my first one I would like to use something that is a little more forgiving and less expensive to make my initial mistakes on. I have built knives from M4 before, but a competition cutter is a whole different breed.

I am thinking I will use either O1 or 1095. Both are readily available, cheap, and both have solid reputations. In addition, I can easily differentialy heat treat them, which may increase performance in this application. I respectfully ask your opinion regarding steel selection, as well as any other pointers you may have regarding competition cutters.

Thank you
Blademange

I would suggest 52100. I don't know what your knife making background is but I would suggest getting the blade heat-treated by Peters heat treat. If you do this you will have a blade with a steel and heat treat that have both proven to have the properties that make a good competition blade.

Dan
 
Have you talked to Dan Keffeler?????

No offense to any of those that have replied, but IMHO it's pretty easy to say what should work in theory... whereas knowing what works in application is a much different beast.

If you look at Dan's competition cutters, they are built like tanks. They're very far removed from what most folks think of as a camp knife--- they are purpose built knives with very specific geometry.

Add in the fact that Dan is a very powerful guy, and has worked really hard at cutting comps... And you see the elements needed to succeed. IMHO.

That is why I would try to talk to Dan about this if I were you. :)


This video says it all!!! :eek: :eek: :eek: :cool: (I didn't think it was even possible, until I heard about this!!!)----

[video=youtube;8_SNB66-wBA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8_SNB66-wBA[/video]
Nick
Thanks
I know you are really busy but when the weather gets a little bit nicer it would be neat if you could come down to Portland and do some cutting.I'm really curious to see how your W2 performs in person.You're welcome to bring your dogs, There is a great dog park with water around here where we can take our dogs.
Dan
 
Nick
Thanks
I know you are really busy but when the weather gets a little bit nicer it would be neat if you could come down to Portland and do some cutting.I'm really curious to see how your W2 performs in person.You're welcome to bring your dogs, There is a great dog park with water around here where we can take our dogs.
Dan

Ahh, you're a dog person. That only makes you a cooler.
 
Hi Nathan,

In my opinion you have the best, absurdly tensile recipe, for a blade. You have developed what is the most beautifully purpose built piece of steel!

How about an easy challenge?

What can you make starting with simple leaf spring 5160, at least 25% 5160 (folded or combined in with anything else)?
When you have the time of course

Let's see what you can do - (cmd) Chris Dolack
 
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