steels?

[bearcut]

what you are looking for is basic information on steels, and blade geometries. beyond this is a world of mental illness. p.s. get knife you think you need, and forget about the rest.

Actually, I'm trying to find out if the terminology is wrong. Words aren't real useful if they don't mean anything or have apposing definitions.

This post did get off base from it’s original question though.

Maybe a new posting is in order?

As far as mental illness goes, why are you reading this?
Still in aftercare?

 

[Larrin]

Does this mean we need to change the terminology? Otherwise, this is going to get confusing.

It seems to me that the standard meaning of 'wear resistance', in knife blades, includes resistance to abrasion.

This definition extends from knife manufactures catalogs, to articles written by KnifeKnuts such as Joe T. and Blade magazine writers. Would you agree with that statement?
In fact, I personally have never read anything contrary to this until your thread.
----------------------------------------------------------

"The crossed-cylinder is a type of adhesive wear test."

Is this a 'Charpy' type of test? What I mean is, does this have anything to do with how knife blades really act, or is this a metalurgical method of testing bar stock?

I'm not saying you are wrong, I am simply saying that what we've been told concerning wear resistance equating to abrasion resistance, in knife blades, seems to contradict what you are saying.

By the way, I usually go with what the honest knifemakers say about steel. When all is said and done, the blade either performs with similar charateristics of the 'steel chart' ratings, or it doesn't. i.e. 1095 is pretty tough, but doesn't hold an edge very long due to wear.

Like I said, the chart I submitted was intended as a baseline. From my experience, the steel ratings were pretty close to what I see happen with my knives.

You seem to think I'm making this up as I go. Here is the wikipedia page on wear, if you'll notice adhesive and abrasive are the top two types of wear: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wear There are of course more scholarly places to look than the wikipedia, but that should get you started. Adhesive wear has nothing to do with Charpy.

 

[3Guardsmen]

Bearcut,
I would highly suggest you drop the "know it all" attitude, especially when dealing with Larrin, who is, for all intents and purposes, an expert when it comes to knife steel and properties thereof. Listen to what he has to say and you may learn a thing or two.

Regards,
3G

 

[wutitiz]

what you are looking for is basic information on steels, and blade geometries. beyond this is a world of mental illness. p.s. get knife you think you need, and forget about the rest.

Great line you got off there- 'beyond this is a world of mental illness.' I will remember that one.

I often say that it is difficult for me as a user to tell the difference among S30V, ATS-34, VG-10, AUS 8, etc.. I am convinced that S30V is the best overall from that group, just based on the charts and fact that that is what the quality-oriented manufacturers like Blade-tech and Chris Reeve use.

Suppose that someone gave me 4 knives with blades of the above 4 steels, and didn't tell me which was which. If I used each for say a month, at at the end of 4 months I would not be able to say which knife was which steel.

ZDP is a different story--I can tell as a user that it cuts better and holds an edge better. I've never had an S90V knife, but I'd guess that it is in the same category.

Bottom line is that you can't go wrong with S30V on a folder from a reputable maker or company. But you will be well served with any of the other steels, including 440C which is kind of regarded as yesterday's steel. If you want something that is of perceptible difference, you have to go to ZDP-189 or probably S90V. It is really unnecessary for a user to know any more about steels than that.

 

[bearcut]

You seem to think I'm making this up as I go. Here is the wikipedia page on wear, if you'll notice adhesive and abrasive are the top two types of wear: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wear There are of course more scholarly places to look than the wikipedia, but that should get you started. Adhesive wear has nothing to do with Charpy.

I never meant to imply that you were making things up. The thought never crossed my mind.

I was aware that the Charpy test is not a wear test. Sorry to confuse you.

Thank you or the Wikipedia link, it was very informative.

 

[enderwiggin]

Great line you got off there- 'beyond this is a world of mental illness.' I will remember that one.

I often say that it is difficult for me as a user to tell the difference among S30V, ATS-34, VG-10, AUS 8, etc.. I am convinced that S30V is the best overall from that group, just based on the charts and fact that that is what the quality-oriented manufacturers like Blade-tech and Chris Reeve use.

I think that's an inherent problem with blade steels. Some users will immediately notice the difference between, say, S30V and 154CM.

I started on my foray into 'good' knives with a couple types of Griptilian, then at some point purchased a Harsey T1. The steel just blew me away on the T1, and on every other S30V knife I've had after that. I bought a Ritter Grip because of the blade steel--I had to have my favorite knife in my favorite steel.

Point is, there are two steel camps: end users who can't really tell the difference between steels or just flat-out don't care, and end users who can feel a difference when they're using a steel, notice that some take a keener edge than others, and some hold an edge for a longer period.

I think a lot of you like to call us "Steel Snobs."

If you don't notice a substantial difference between steels, consider yourself--and your pocketbook--blessed.

The problems and arguments arise when people decide to assert that there really are no or very little difference between types of steels.

...Or when folks claim that low-end, very durable but poor edge-holding steels are comparable to or superior to steels specifically designed for making knives.