Storm II, Lock Issues?

[yerscattergun]

The Storm II has been my favorite "cheap knife" for quite awhile.
Recently, I have been looking for another one because my old one
has the sandpaper grip inserts and I wanted to try one with the new
"softer" inserts. Well, I have never noticed but the locks on every one
I have looked at can actually be pushed all the way to the opposte
side! It does not take much pressure on the frame lock to do this.
I am quite surprised that they do this and was wondering if this is how they are supposed to be? If taking a white knuckle grip the grip will make
the lock wedge in real tight. To get it touching the opposite side liner you
have to intentionally push it, however.

Almost all the Storm II's I have looked at do not have any blade play
however. They are over all a very impressive knife but I'm a little
dissapointed they do this. Thomas, can you please advise if this
is how they are supposed to be? Thanks...

 

[CRAIG GREEN]

I am not sure why you have an issue with being able to push the lock over to the other side of the lock - you have to untentionally do this on your storm (from your post)- does this mean to you that this is a poor quality knife ? Does the lock jam or does the blade have up and down movement when locked ?

Or is this just your personal thoughts on this ? Just curious.

I can tell you that we build our folders out of the best materials and to the tightest tolerances (for the money) we charge.

I hope you are not trying to compare a $50 retail folder to a CRK Sebenza $400+.....

Please let me know, perhaps I'm way off base here.

Other thoughts on this issue ?

Craig.

 

[trimcut123]

Of the few storms i had they all did this as well. However i don't believe its a lack of quality, its just the way it works. A few of my other frame locks do this also from other companies. However it never sticks when pushed over, and it will also go all the way over when i do a very hard push cut. With that said , there was never any blade play, and never did i have a lock fail on me or with a spinewhack. Still my favorite knife in that price range...
Matt

 

[yerscattergun]

I am not sure why you have an issue with being able to push the lock over to the other side of the lock - you have to untentionally do this on your storm (from your post)- does this mean to you that this is a poor quality knife ? Does the lock jam or does the blade have up and down movement when locked ?

Or is this just your personal thoughts on this ? Just curious.

I can tell you that we build our folders out of the best materials and to the tightest tolerances (for the money) we charge.

I hope you are not trying to compare a $50 retail folder to a CRK Sebenza $400+.....

Please let me know, perhaps I'm way off base here.

Other thoughts on this issue ?

Craig.

I never stated that it was a poor quality knife. I did say it was my favorite
"cheap" knife. I also know not to compare it to a Sebenza and I never did and
I also stated that none of the Storms I have looked at had blade play. I
think perhaps you should read my post a little more carefully.

I don't think you are off base, but the tone of your post is a little
confrontational. Did you see towards the end of the post that I said
overall that it is a "very impressive knife"? All I wanted to know was
if this is normal with this knife because I have never seen a frame lock
travel all the way to the opposite side liner by a simple push with
the finger. Maybe you can answer my question since it sounds like
you are an employee of Kershaw. Thanks...


By the way,I still like the knife and will buy another....

 

[kneedeep]

Craig is an employee of Kershaw.

The truth is, we had no American made factory a decade or so ago, and Craig was brought on to build one. He bought every piece of machinery we currently have, and built the factory from nothing to the awesome state it currently sits in today. Future factory plans and expansions are in the works with Craig leading the charge.

In my 25 years in this industry, I've personally never met another individual I would put ahead of Craig as far as knowing their way around a plant and more importantly running a factory on a day to day basis. He also has a great understanding of knives.

In my dealings with him I have found that he takes personal responsibility for the quality of the knives that come from Kershaw. I can understand why you feel that his tone is confrontational, however I do think that there are a few points in your original post that would make him want to ask more questions about why you question whether or not there is a quality issue.

While I know you meant "cheap" in a positive sense, the word always has negative connotations when describing a product (a word most manufacturers hat having their product described as). Inexpensive is probably a better term to use.

You definitely did praise the Storm II throughout your post, but you qualified the statement by saying that you were disappointed that the lock bar has so much travel. Since you weren't sure if the lock is supposed to do this or no, it is confusing that you would be disappointed that it does.

When maintaining the quality of your product is a major part of your job, you tend to focus on the negative points brought up. Craig hasn't posted a lot here (yet ) so we should cut him a little slack on "tone" (I think you have since you used the smiley). It's definitely something that can take a bit of time to get the hang of. Having said that I look forward to seeing Craig post more often.

Most frame and liner locks that I have intentionally tried to push the lock to the other handle have done it. I think the true sign of quality would be not being impossible to unlock it in this state. For a lock bar to not do it (travel to the other side), I would think that it would have to be incredibly rigid or it would have to not engage very far in the first place.

Hope this helps.

 

[CRAIG GREEN]

I didn't think I was being confrontational. Sorry if you took it that way

I was simply asking questions and letting you know how I feel on this Lock issue.

Thomas and I have had that discussion MANY times and I am interested to hear from everyone in regards to the lock issue ( Lock creep/ pushover).

Craig

 

[sixfoot7]

I didn't think I was being confrontational. Sorry if you took it that way

I was simply asking questions and letting you know how I feel on this Lock issue.

Thomas and I have had that discussion MANY times and I am interested to hear from everyone in regards to the lock issue ( Lock creep/ pushover).

Craig

Who exactly did you think was a creep/pushover?

 

[kneedeep]

Thomas and I have had that discussion MANY times and I am interested to hear from everyone in regards to the lock issue ( Lock creep/ pushover).

As long as the knife doesn't become dangerous (or much too difficult) to unlock, I don't really see it as a problem.

Although it is one more reason I prefer the stud lock.

 

[SPXTrader]

All 3 of my MC Ti's locks will push over with a white knuckled grip. My index finger will push it all the way over, and keep it there. No problems unlocking them. In fact, with the lock fully engaged, I feel confidant that it will not fail, and I will remain with all my fingers attached as intended.

 

[Kohai999]

I was simply asking questions and letting you know how I feel on this Lock issue.

Thomas and I have had that discussion MANY times and I am interested to hear from everyone in regards to the lock issue ( Lock creep/ pushover).

Craig

The Sebenza, Scott Cook's Lochsa, and the first ti/zdp Leek that I got have all had the issue of the lockbar being pushed fairly easily to the opposing side, in some instances, completely.

My Sebenza was sent back to CRK for this issue, and they said it was normal, and sent it back, uncorrected. Maybe so, but I find it unacceptable....because it is annoying. I can forgive Kershaw this point in the lower priced knives, of which the Storm II is, but would not necessarily purchase it, either...if that makes sense.

The bottom line is that it is hard to engineer a framelock for the correct tolerances and angles....in a lower priced knife, it is something to be expected, if not accepted. At the higher price points, everyone must try harder, as we know that this can be worked out with the right effort.

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson

 

[Thomas W]

The Storm II has been my favorite "cheap knife" for quite awhile.

I have never noticed but the locks on every one
I have looked at can actually be pushed all the way to the opposte
side! It does not take much pressure on the frame lock to do this.
I am quite surprised that they do this and was wondering if this is how they are supposed to be?

Well it seems as if it hasn't been much an issue for you, if the Storm has been your favorite for quite a while.

I would turn the question around and ask you, do you feel it is an issue?
Then again, maybe you already answered that.

Almost all the Storm II's I have looked at do not have any blade play
however. They are over all a very impressive knife...

 

[svrider3]

My Ti Leek will push over with some effort, However I don't see it as
an "issue". I can say it damn sure ain't gonna close on me at this point.

 

[Thomas W]

My Sebenza was sent back to CRK for this issue, and they said it was normal, and sent it back, uncorrected. Maybe so, but I find it unacceptable....because it is annoying.

Interesting.

I can forgive Kershaw this point in the lower priced knives, of which the Storm II is, but would not necessarily purchase it, either...if that makes sense.

Knowing your standards this makes sense.

 

[Thomas W]

My Ti Leek will push over with some effort...

I would certainly not recommend folks using effort to see if they can push their lockbars to the opposite side.

 

[svrider3]

I would certainly not recommend folks using effort to see if they can push their lockbars to the opposite side.

Not saying I do it for the sake of doing it. I've just noticed when really
gripping down hard on it, it will. Again I don't see it as an issue.

I don't abuse my Keshaws Coach. You know me better then that.

 

[yerscattergun]

Well, based on the comments here by those in the know I would
say it is normal. Thanks for the replies from the Kershaw
honchos and everyone else. I will go get me another Storm II at Wally
World tommorow but I'll get one in the box instead of those darn blister packs.
If only you guys could tell me why the Leeks blade is so darn
fragile.... And how about a Leek X 1.5?

Love your knives....

 

[dedguy]

All 3 of my MC Ti's locks will push over with a white knuckled grip. My index finger will push it all the way over, and keep it there. No problems unlocking them. In fact, with the lock fully engaged, I feel confidant that it will not fail, and I will remain with all my fingers attached as intended.

I think that may be more an aspect of Ti than the lock itself as my Ti Leek will do this but the SS frame lock and G-10 liner will not on my other Leeks.

 

[reholli]

This issue came up in September of '07 with respect to ZDP-189 Mini-Cyclones. Most owners of that knife in this forum at the time noticed the same behaviour, and it was considered normal for the knife.

However, Craig mentioned looking into a solution anyway, at least for the Ti-based frame locks, probably to eliminate customer concerns because, afterall and thankfully, we know Craig and Thomas and company do respond to our concerns. At the time Craig talked of changing the flat 7deg plane of the lock-up area to a radiused arc.

I was wondering if that change was ever implemented in any of the models, or perhaps it turned out not to be effective?

 

[svrider3]

And how about a Leek X 1.5?

Love your knives....

You might want to take a look at the Shallot.

Also just wanted to note, I have several Leeks and have never broken a tip.
Of course I don't use it as a pry bar are a screwdriver either.

Edit: I just noticed post 700 for me......Hang around awhile.....I forsee a Shallot give away in the future.

 

[3Guardsmen]

The Storm II has been my favorite "cheap knife" for quite awhile.
Recently, I have been looking for another one because my old one
has the sandpaper grip inserts and I wanted to try one with the new
"softer" inserts. Well, I have never noticed but the locks on every one
I have looked at can actually be pushed all the way to the opposte
side! It does not take much pressure on the frame lock to do this.
I am quite surprised that they do this and was wondering if this is how they are supposed to be? If taking a white knuckle grip the grip will make
the lock wedge in real tight. To get it touching the opposite side liner you
have to intentionally push it, however.

Almost all the Storm II's I have looked at do not have any blade play
however. They are over all a very impressive knife but I'm a little
dissapointed they do this. Thomas, can you please advise if this
is how they are supposed to be? Thanks...

I am not sure why you have an issue with being able to push the lock over to the other side of the lock - you have to untentionally do this on your storm (from your post)- does this mean to you that this is a poor quality knife ? Does the lock jam or does the blade have up and down movement when locked ?

Is that really what you got from what the OP stated?

"Almost all the Storm II's I have looked at do not have any blade play however. They are over all a very impressive knife but I'm a little dissapointed they do this."

Or is this just your personal thoughts on this ? Just curious.

Well, I didn't see the OP attribute his post to anybody else's "thoughts," so I would assume they are in fact the OP's "personal thoughts." FWIW, If I were the OP, I'd be very hesitant to share any more of my personal thoughts or questions here, after the response given!

I can tell you that we build our folders out of the best materials and to the tightest tolerances (for the money) we charge. I hope you are not trying to compare a $50 retail folder to a CRK Sebenza $400+.....

Again, is that really what you got from what the OP stated?

"The Storm II has been my favorite "cheap knife" for quite awhile."

Please let me know, perhaps I'm way off base here.

I'm going to go with "off base!"

Other thoughts on this issue ?

Craig.

Yeah! Don't push away your customers by failing to even attempt to answer their questions/address their concerns and by being confrontational!

I have always supported Kershaw/KAI USA with both my money and my word of mouth (including here on these very forums), but from what I've seen here of how some Kershaw representatives have addressed their customers' concerns, that may change.

3G