Street prices

D

DullKnife

Joined
Jan 22, 2007
Messages
3
Hey Folks,

I was wondering in general terms how much custom dealers discount from advertised prices on new/used knives.

I understand high end market prices are set by how much somebody is willing to pay. I also know that in the high end market, there is advertised price and going price. I'm thinking about making a purchase on a Terzuola listed as new, but I don't care to pay more than the going market price.

I've specifically left out the model name as I'm not yet ready to pull the trigger....doing my homework first.

Thanks
 
Hi Dull Knife,

Custom knives are not like factory knives, there is no standard discount like a wholesale price.

Street price is determined in large part by demand for the knife makers work in correlation to the availability of said work.

Unless you buy the knife from Bob or get a pre-owned one you will more than likely pay more than retail price. Why? Because Bob gives only a very small discount to his dealers.

Which leaves you with a couple of choices

1) Order from Bob directly (6-12 month wait)

2) Go to a show where Bob is at. Of course you then have to factory in show associated costs. Also, that Bob may not have the exact model you want. Or that he sells the knife before you get to his table.

3) Order what you want from a dealer and pay a premium. You can balance the premium against show related costs to determine which will be the better deal.

Unlike Factory knives which few if any one pays retail. With custom knives full retail and the possibility of a premium are the standards.

WWG
 
Thanks for your post.

While custom Guitars may not be custom knives, they do come out of custom shops with very high prices, sold at retailers, but very seldom at suggested retail prices. They may not be discounted deeply, but they certainly sell for less than suggested retail and often less than the dealer quote over the internet and they are every bit custom built. I guess it's all supply and demand.

More opinions based on experiences?

Thanks
 
You probably won't get any answers better than the one from WWG, since he is one of the most respected dealers of custom knives in the industry.

It never hurts to make an offer, but don't be surprised if the answer is sorry, but the price is the price. Some makers offer very little discount to dealers on the price they regularly sell their knives for. Some offer none at all. Even the largest discount offered to dealers by makers is far below the margin seen in production knives.
 
Bob is diverse and makes a bunch of models. I was curious and looked through about ten sites that had some of his knives. Low of just under $500 for one model and high of well over a thousand. Scale materials, and damascus blades make a BIG difference, as does the size of the knife.

He's in demand and highly regarded, so pricing may exceed your wishes.

Saw some real good values over on RCC's site, FYI. You may need to place an order though, to capture the deal on some models. Probably well worth the wait.

Best deals are always found on a mint pre-owned knife, but your selection and immediacy are compromised.

Coop
 
HI Dullknife,

You answered your own question. The "custom" guitars that came out of a custom shop are not custom.

What you are seeing is a semi-custom model being sold with "Value Pricing".

Value pricing is used to go after people from whom price point is a real concern. Subsequently, the company sells their semi-custom guitar at an inflated "retail" price. Then allows their dealers to buy at wholesale anywhere from 50 -60% depending on the volume they buy. They can then sell for 25% under "retail" and appear to be giving their customers and excellent deal.

The Guitar company understands that the guitars are not meant to be sold at retail price. No where is Value Pricing more evident than in the car business. We all learn very quickly that the sticker price is never really the "real price". Which is why no one pays the MSRP for a car.

This is not the case with custom knives.

If you do find a maker who routinely discounts their knives off of retail, you may want to reconsider your purchase. The problem is that there are no secrets in custom knives. Eventually people find out. Subsequently, as you can imagine those who paid full retail only to find out you got your knife at a discount are not to happy. Additionally this "discount" price quickly becomes the after market price for the knife.

Bargains are out there and as Coop pointed out the after market is an excellent place to look.

WWG
 
You make an offer, the maker/s say yes or get lost, you buy or move on to another maker.

The makers are tough guys you won't hurt their feelings by asking. Also there are a lot of great knife makers and a lot of great knives but the custom market is not like production its much smaller.
People willing to pay more for personal craftsmanship are fewer, many of those people will pay more for that speacil one that a maker has really exspressed their craft in but they don't oftne buy many knives.

There are buyers willing to pay top dollar and they adverage out with those on tight budgets that just can't do it. In the end prices in the cusotm maker except for very high end knives are not that much diifferent that production.

Production IMO has been going up in price every year at a much faster rate than custom. The production makers pay higher material cost but buy in volume and get discounts while the custom makers can't so facter that cost in and the custom makers margins are way out of proportion to the production companies.

or at least thats how I see it
 
To further confuse those unfamiliar with knife shows there are custom makers who charge MUCH more for their knives than they will generally bring to the educated secondary market. This is because many makers sell almost exclusively to dealers at who receive large discounts off of table prices. Many popular makers fall into this group and some of the best work you'll ever see falls into this category.

These are my observations, many will disagree.

If a maker almost always has knives for sale at the end of the show...chances are his table prices are too high and the true demand for their work might not be as high as it seems.


If a maker always sells out quickly at a show, and people (including known dealers) are standing in line to buy at table prices...chances are his prices are too low and the maker's work is in high demand.


The knife maker, as a businessman, has to decide on a pricing strategy that works for them.

There are so many considerations on the pricing of custom knives...that it boggles the mind.



To further confuse matters...people will lie to you:D


The bottom line to me is: I'll buy it if I like it and I don't always expect a return on my investment. It's nice when it happens though!
 
Don't get me wrong here, Woodwork, but I think you are placing a higher value on kives vs. guitars on account of your personal involvment. Any product made in sufficient numbers, as Terzuola's are, are subject to opinions as to their "custom" label. Truely, they are unique and highly sought after, but he does have a model line-up. He may not be stamping them out, but they are similar enough that they are in some form of "production". This same thing is true guitar building as there are truely "custom" guitars and then there are "boutique shops". I would consider BT's knives in the "boutique shop" category as far as my comparison goes.

I'm not trying to ruffle feathers. I still think it's all a matter of supply and demand and obviously, Bob's knives, and there appear to be many out there, are in high demand.
 
Hi Dullknife,

It is exactly because of my personal involvement with custom knives. That allows me to compare and contrast custom knife pricing vs any other commodity. Im not comparing guitars and knives. I was only explaining why you were seeing the pricing structure that you were with the guitars. Simply there is no similar pricing structure in custom knives.

Your questions and thoughts are not unusual, most collectors who come into custom knives from the factory side of the house think there is a "wholesale" price.

Enjoy the knives and the people and good hunting.

WWG
 
Yes, there are a lot of Terzuola's out there. Afterall, Bob has been making knives for over twenty years- and he's been doing it fulltime. I'll have to completely agree with WWG here- the pricing structure for custom/handmade knives is nothing like that for productions. In the case of Bob Terzuola (I've got close to 20 of his knives) I know that he does not extend a large discount to dealers, less than most other makers. I know he would love to extend no discount at all.

As far as "haggling" with dealers, it generally doesn't work. Most dealers out there are selling brand-new knives from the maker. Some occasionally take in new/mint condition knives in trade, etc. Sometimes there may be "room" with a traded knife. I'm not a dealer so I don't know everything.

I do know that the salesman has to eat too. Most dealers spend a lot of time and money developing relationships with makers, traveling to shows, and running their websites, phone numbers, etc. The plus for us is that dealers kind of permanently have knives on order from makers who are in demand. If I want a new Terzuola tomorrow, I can get one tomorrow (if it were up to me I'd get one everyday!)- but I know I'll have to pay that dealer markup and that's OK. I've purchased Terzuola knives through just about every conceivable method: dealers, at shows, on order from him and the secondary market. By far the best all-around deal for a new custom knife is going to a show. You get to meet the maker, see all of his/her knives, get your knife right away, not pay shipping etc. Of course, as WWG said, you need to factor in the costs of the show. If you need to fly, get hotel rooms, meals, etc any substantial savings may be long gone. Other than a show, the secondary market can offer some great values as well. As Coop said though, the selection is more limited. On a fairly regular basis, there are mint condition Terzuolas out there for sale. Don't forget you could always send a "used" knife to Bob and he'll make it look like new again- and that won't take 6-12 months!
 
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