Strongest Folding Knife Lock?

[sooner7nc]

Cold Steel Pocket Bushman. Ugly as sin and crude. Very strong I think...and not because stupid Lynn said so.

 

[mtangent]

What do you all think is the proven (via testing and everyday use) strongest folding knife lock-mechanism?

By strongest I mean the locking mechanism that makes a folder as close to a fixed blade as possible, and which could handle the greatest levels of closing pressure as possible, with current manufacturable materials?

See? That's the point. You try to argue that lock strength is subjective then bring up the different experiences. Experiences can't change material properties. They are what they are.

Lock strength is an emperical value that is the result of the materials and engineering. It may vary from different specimens but there is a range that manufacturers aim for. Just because one triad is defective does not mean that triads are weak even if you personally experienced failure. They are still probably one the strongest locks today by design and your experience won't change the stress points one bit.

Same with the opinel. Just because a user didn't lock it correctly doesn't mean all others are weak. If you incorrectly lock an opinel, that doesn't make opinel's lock weak. It's operator error.

When an airliner crashes because of pilot error, it doesn't make other planes of that particular design unsafe.

Say you have a triad, whether you need the strength or not doesn't change the material properties. No amount of wordsmanship will change the material properties of a concrete object. At least in this reality.

The OP was asking for a judgement based on materials and engineering. An answer that doesn't address that is off topic and an answer that dismisses the question is trolling. Trolling is trolling whether or not it derails the thread.

No, the OP asked for strongest, proven in the real world, not strongest in an engineer's calculations.
Real world use takes into account operator error, IMO. If it is hard to operate, it is less safe in certain circumstances.

If a plane crashes due to pilot error, that is pilot error. But if a plane is so hard to fly that pilots keep crashing, month after month, people might call it poor design, rather than pilot error.

Real world results are often different to designed results.

 

[Alnamvet68]

I would have to say this folder has the strongest lock....

[video=youtube;8ofdIu9CSvU]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ofdIu9CSvU[/video]

 

[singularity35]

No, the OP asked for strongest, proven in the real world, not strongest in an engineer's calculations.
Real world use takes into account operator error, IMO. If it is hard to operate, it is less safe in certain circumstances.

If a plane crashes due to pilot error, that is pilot error. But if a plane is so hard to fly that pilots keep crashing, month after month, people might call it poor design, rather than pilot error.

Real world results are often different to designed results.

Took you a few days to come up with a reply eh?


Proven or not, lock strength is not dependent on the user. It's dependent on the materials and design.

It's like asking for steel hardness, it doesn't change depending on the user. One user may cause the steel to fail but it doesn't change the measurement.

Say a tri ad can hold 200 pounds in a hang test, that won't change whether or not a user will go beyond or not.

A lock strength measurement is like a blade length measurement, it doesn't change with the user.

If a well designed plane crashes because of pilot error, it is the pilot that's unsafe. The design of the plane doesn't change from safe to unsafe. If such were the case, then every plane that crashes would be grounded because the design has changed to an unsafe one.

 

[mtangent]

Took you a few days to come up with a reply eh?

No

Proven or not, lock strength is not dependent on the user. It's dependent on the materials and design.

It's like asking for steel hardness, it doesn't change depending on the user. One user may cause the steel to fail but it doesn't change the measurement.

Say a tri ad can hold 200 pounds in a hang test, that won't change whether or not a user will go beyond or not.

A lock strength measurement is like a blade length measurement, it doesn't change with the user.

If a well designed plane crashes because of pilot error, it is the pilot that's unsafe. The design of the plane doesn't change from safe to unsafe. If such were the case, then every plane that crashes would be grounded because the design has changed to an unsafe one.

You didn't mention "well designed" before.
You refuse to leave the theoretical frame of mind, & deal with what the OP asked for. Goodbye.

 

[singularity35]

You didn't mention "well designed" before.
You refuse to leave the theoretical frame of mind, & deal with what the OP asked for. Goodbye.

It's you who can't seem to accept that lock strength can be measured and are in fact measured in the real world. These measurements are empirical and just vary within a range.

Even if we talk about a poorly designed lock, it's strength will still be measurable in the real world. That measurement still wouldn't change depending on who uses it.

The OP is getting an answer: many people are trolls; most people don't care how strong the lock is; lock strength depends on the user using it properly.
If troll's played it straight, & just gave an answer, it would sound believable. Wouldn't you rather just know they were a troll?

Here's what you said.

The OP asked about lock strength.

I'm not talking theory. I'm talking about actual measure lock strength in the real world. I'm saying those measurements won't vary within their range no matter who uses them.

Well designed or not, actual real world lock strength won't change whoever is the user.

You're trying to argue that safety depends on the user. I agree.

Lock strength and lock safety are entirely different things. I'm guessing that that's what you refuse to wrap your head around.

Or maybe you're just trying to be difficult because this shoe fits....

Agreed. It always amazes me that a lot of people troll this simple question with the "if you use it as a knife should be used..." objections.

 

[FCCBCT]

The Extrema Ratio RAO AVIO has a pin you insert, in addition to the lock, to make it practically impossible to close without blowing apart the handle. But that begs the question if you need that level of strength why not go with a fixed blade?

I've been using the RAOII for a while now, Extrema Ratio's latest model in that RAO series and should say I'm a fixed blade guy but wanted to see what this folder could do. it really surprised me as I did put it through tests similar to what I'd subject a similar fixed blade to. I guess I can carry this pretty much un-noticed in the pouch it came with as to me it does glare "look he's/she's got a knife" bit diff to do with a fixed blade strapped to your pack or belt. You can carry it folded too in your pocket (yes it's big and heavy- but I did walk around with it like this for a while to see how it was for practical carry). And as you say in the fixed position with pin inserted, the mechanism and handle would have to completely fail for the blade to move. Check this little vid re some lateral strength of the RAOII for strength.

[video=youtube;Y0R5YdUV06M]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0R5YdUV06M[/video]



FCCBCT

 

[FCCBCT]

It's you who can't seem to accept that lock strength can be measured and are in fact measured in the real world. These measurements are empirical and just vary within a range.

Even if we talk about a poorly designed lock, it's strength will still be measurable in the real world. That measurement still wouldn't change depending on who uses it.



Here's what you said.

The OP asked about lock strength.

I'm not talking theory. I'm talking about actual measure lock strength in the real world. I'm saying those measurements won't vary within their range no matter who uses them.

Well designed or not, actual real world lock strength won't change whoever is the user.

You're trying to argue that safety depends on the user. I agree.

Lock strength and lock safety are entirely different things. I'm guessing that that's what you refuse to wrap your head around.

Or maybe you're just trying to be difficult because this shoe fits....

Yes you can measure empirically lock strength, once one defines and states the type of test, which of course must be repeatable. (But this is still a "laboratory test") However to be applicable to the "real world" these tests must reflect as close to possible real world situations and simulate human biomechanics otherwise any test that means anything to the lay person will be irrelevant and also irrelevant to the scientist/engineer, materials scientist, applied physicist, designer. Subjecting any knife, fixed or otherwise to some sort of destruction test that in no way resembles what might be realistically encountered via human movement is really a waste of time and serves only to fill the social media sites with pseudo science that seem to propagate (like light LOL!) endlessly.

 

[FCCBCT]

Nice!

 

[singularity35]

Yes you can measure empirically lock strength, once one defines and states the type of test, which of course must be repeatable. (But this is still a "laboratory test") However to be applicable to the "real world" these tests must reflect as close to possible real world situations and simulate human biomechanics otherwise any test that means anything to the lay person will be irrelevant and also irrelevant to the scientist/engineer, materials scientist, applied physicist, designer. Subjecting any knife, fixed or otherwise to some sort of destruction test that in no way resembles what might be realistically encountered via human movement is really a waste of time and serves only to fill the social media sites with pseudo science that seem to propagate (like light LOL!) endlessly.

So I guess crash tests must only be performed out of the lab and in real life to be relevant?

Of course any measurement must start at the lab and real world use will confirm(or not) the measurements made at the lab.

Besides the OP asked for the strongest folding knife lock. That's a question that can only be answered empirically and not with anecdotal opinions, which are only what you get in "real life".

What's really funny is that the people who require rigid laboratory results, charts, and micrographs when comparing steels, will immediately dismiss lab tests and mention "real world" when it comes to lock strength.

These same people will also declare to all and sundry that a folding knife is a broken knife and when somebody tries a remedy by introducing a stronger lock, these same people will again loudly declare that lock strength doesn't matter.

So you think those vids of mechanical tests of lock strength don't reflect the strength in the real world? What lock do you think are the strongest according to your "real world" use?

 

[aaron1972]

Op is going fishing in the pond, getting lots of bites.

 

[singularity35]

Op is going fishing in the pond, getting lots of bites.

OP is long gone. We're just arguing for argument's sake. We often do that here.