What would you guys recomend for my first knife? I plan on doing stock removal, cause I don't have a set up for forging. Also, I would like to heat treat it my self in the kitchen oven. What kind of steel would be best for this? I don't have any particular use in store for the knife, so the only criteria are the two previously stated.
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- Thread starter Cauldra
- Start date
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- Aug 16, 2008
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- 222
Cauldra,
Your kitchen over will not get hot enough to heat treat any steel. It will, however be hot enough to TEMPER the steel after it has been hardened. To harden steel, you have to take it up the the neighborhood of 1400°. You can do this with charcoal and a leaf blower blowing on the fire if you're using simple steels. For a first knife, I would recommend 1084. The heat treatment is dirt simple. File or grind your knife to final shape and bevel first. Drill any holes you need to drill. Heat it just to the point a magnet will not stick (red hot) and quench it in oil. Canola oil will do for now. After the knife is cool, it will be as hard and brittle as glass. Temper it in your oven twice for two hours at ~400°, cooling in between.
You can get 1084 from a few places, but if you're doing stock removal, get some of the Hot Rolled 1084 bars from Admiral Steel. Just call them. They have some 1/8" x 1" HR1084 bars on sale right now. You can also get 1070/1080 bars from them if you want different thicknesses. Same heat treat.
Check out the tacked threads at the top of this forum. There is a wealth of info there.
Your kitchen over will not get hot enough to heat treat any steel. It will, however be hot enough to TEMPER the steel after it has been hardened. To harden steel, you have to take it up the the neighborhood of 1400°. You can do this with charcoal and a leaf blower blowing on the fire if you're using simple steels. For a first knife, I would recommend 1084. The heat treatment is dirt simple. File or grind your knife to final shape and bevel first. Drill any holes you need to drill. Heat it just to the point a magnet will not stick (red hot) and quench it in oil. Canola oil will do for now. After the knife is cool, it will be as hard and brittle as glass. Temper it in your oven twice for two hours at ~400°, cooling in between.
You can get 1084 from a few places, but if you're doing stock removal, get some of the Hot Rolled 1084 bars from Admiral Steel. Just call them. They have some 1/8" x 1" HR1084 bars on sale right now. You can also get 1070/1080 bars from them if you want different thicknesses. Same heat treat.
Check out the tacked threads at the top of this forum. There is a wealth of info there.
Cauldra, to start grinding my own blades (after I played enough with kit knives) I ordered 1095 bar stock from Jants Supply. It is very cheap: 1/8 x 1 1/2" x 18" bar costs just $6.95. So for $50 you can get a lot of steel in different sizes. It is annealed and soft enough to grind even on my $30 Harbor Freight 1"x30" grinder (decent 60 grit belt suggested). You will need a forge to heat treat your blades which is very easy to make without any experience. You can use a coffee can or a small metal tube. There are a lot of tutorials and suppliers online - just search for "coffe can forge" or "mini forge" and you'll find it.
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- Oct 6, 2008
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If you want to do stock removal with stainless or tool steels, you can send the nearly finished blades out for HT. Google Paul Bos or Texas Knifemaker Supply. There may be a machine shop in your town than can do it, too.
1075/80 is close enough, but I would suggest your heat for hardening be about 50° above non-magnetic. That will give you a little better hardening. Some of the heat in the steel is lost getting from the heat source, to the quench. The magnet should only be a guide for you to know that the steel is in the process of going into the austenite condition. With the 1075/80, another 50° will pretty much guarantee that it does.
Earlier today UPS delivered my 1070/80 steel I ordered from Admiral steel!
I'm in the middle of getting a small gas forge together to HT it, and yesterday I finally had the time and proper weather conditions to try and make micarta. I think it turned out rather well, but I'm gonna give it a few more days to make sure it is completly dry. I probably won't get to work on the steel for atleast a day or two!
I can't wait! I still don't know what kind of knife to make, though.
I'm in the middle of getting a small gas forge together to HT it, and yesterday I finally had the time and proper weather conditions to try and make micarta. I think it turned out rather well, but I'm gonna give it a few more days to make sure it is completly dry. I probably won't get to work on the steel for atleast a day or two! I can't wait! I still don't know what kind of knife to make, though.
- Joined
- Oct 6, 2008
- Messages
- 4,076
Take some time to think of the knives you like best. What do you like about them? What would you change? Draw a couple designs on paper or cardboard, cut them out and start to get a feel for them.
If you "screw up" a piece of steel, don't kick yourself! Steel is relatively cheap. Chalk it up to experience... no one gets it perfect the first time. So-called "mistakes" can sometimes be your best teacher. And for cryin' out loud, don't forget to have fun with your projects
Otherwise you might as well be a robot... and that's pretty boring.Go for it, and don't hesitate to ask questions here. These folks are an absolute gold-mine of knowledge and experience. You may never meet a group of people that are more willing to help!
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- Jan 2, 2006
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You can not heat treat in a kitchen oven. You will need to reach 1500 degrees to successfully heart treat this steel. And you will need to be set up for quenching the steel in oil.
Then you will need to temper the steel using a toaster oven. You can use the wife oven but I do not think she will appreciate the odor in the home. In temping that will be 350 to 400 degrees for two hours then let cool down naturally in room temperature. :yawn:
But it would be better if you could visit some other knife maker in your area and see how this process is done and you would have a better understanding in the equipment need to do the job. I do not know the thickness of the steel you will be heat treating but remember its one inch per hour. So, you will need to do the math.
I hope this was of some kind of help. If someone else wants to add to it. Go-For-It. :thumbup:
Terry
Then you will need to temper the steel using a toaster oven. You can use the wife oven but I do not think she will appreciate the odor in the home. In temping that will be 350 to 400 degrees for two hours then let cool down naturally in room temperature. :yawn:
But it would be better if you could visit some other knife maker in your area and see how this process is done and you would have a better understanding in the equipment need to do the job. I do not know the thickness of the steel you will be heat treating but remember its one inch per hour. So, you will need to do the math.
I hope this was of some kind of help. If someone else wants to add to it. Go-For-It. :thumbup:
Terry