Survival Knife Help (also machete and hatchet)

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peterosinski

Joined
Feb 27, 2013
Messages
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Hello,

I am new to these forums but not internet forums in general. From my reading here already I know that this will be similar to other forums I've read (digital cinema cameras and lenses) which is to say that there is a wealth of good information with some die hard brand loyalty and gear snobbery sprinkled on top. I know how to search a forum and have spent a good amount of time reading before making my first post.

Now to the question. I am looking for a good all around survival knife for my BOB. From what I have read people really seem to like ka-bar, esse, bencmade etc but these don't seem to fit what I am looking for.

I am interested in a blade that is 5-7 inches long, full tang, no serrations, about 1/4" thick, and stainless steel. I was originally looking at the esse 6 but it has carbon steel so thats out (I don't want to have to worry about rust when I am bugging out). The Ka-bar is more designed for defense than bushcraft from what I can tell so that's out.

I have started to take a liking to the SOG Force and it seems like all the hands on reviews are good and all the bad reviews are just "SOG Sucks" or one guy who had the wrong knife shipped to him. It is aus-8 steel which is stainless. I have a SOG powerlock multi-tool that has been everything I need it to be and more. I love the build quality but it just won't be able to handle bushcraft tasks.

Can anyone give me a reason why I shouldn't purchase this knife and maybe a place to purchase one? I have seem them offered under $100 all the way up to $180.

I also plan on having a hatchet and machete in my bugout bag and would appreciate help picking those as well. When it comes to machetes I can't seem to find one that doesn't have bad reviews somewhere. I want something strong and 18-24" that can take some of the chopping abuse in place of my survival knife.

For the hatchet I was hoping to find something that is steel from the blade down through the handle, a hammer on the back end would be a plus but is not necessary. One piece steel construction is the most important thing because I don't want to have to worry about breaking the handle when bugging out.

Thank you in advance for your help and I look forward to participating in this forum
 
You are going to get lots of opinions on this, especially on SOG. I am a SOG fan. I own 6 SOGs. Like them all. Fit and finish does vary a bit, but the higher end ones I have are all great. I have the Seal Team which is very similar to the Force. Size, steel, thickness is very close and the handle is almost the same (Seal team pummel is not pointed, which I like for hammering). I don't think you will disappointed if you got the force. A Ka-Bar will be more cost effective though.

I would still look at the ESEE knives. I have the 5 and Izula. I know they are not stainless but if this is truly for a BOB only, seeing little to no use, you will want to oil any knife you intend to keep inactive, ready for a BO. Further, during the BO, if you use your knife, rust will not be an issue (any will come off with use, and a little doesn't impact performance in any way). Also, in My BOB I carry tuf-cloth anyway to oil all sorts of stuff (MY current BOB knife is Aus-8 but I still keep it oiled). Last, Aus-8 will still rust, just not as quick as high carbon. The ESEE is of higher value, has maybe the best warranty in production knives, and is geared much more towards hard use. While I am a SOG fan, I don't like all the ad BS they put into marketing their knives. ESEE marketing is done through actually showing hard use and excellent word of mouth, and they stand by their knives no matter what. I would look at the 4, 6, or Junglas for a BOB. If you got a 4 and a Junglas you may not even need a machete or hatchet.

For a hatchet, I have the long handle version of these: http://www.estwing.com/ao_campers_axe.php . I haven't used it much but like you, I wanted one piece construction.

Hope that helps!
 
Stick with a High Carbon steel. Somthing from Scrapyard 411, Mora (Best Bang for your Buck), Benchmade 162 Bushcrafter S30v (Stainless), Spyderco Southfork in s90v (stainless), Doug Ritter RSK® Mk2 Perseverance . I use a Hogue FX01 5.5 in A2 carbon steel. EESE in 1095 are great do not let the carbon steel scare you its not that big f a deal a bit of nose grease or oil and your fine, jsut keep it dry when you can. A bit of rust will not kill you if you actually need your "Bug out Bag" if the poo ever hits the fan.

Im a huge fan of a hatchet. I keep them in all of my cars and trucks its the right tool for the job and the hammer end is invaluable. I use Estwing Sportsmen axes. they are
All steel construction.
Head and handle forged in 1 piece.
Fully polished with genuine leather grip and sheath.
3.25 in. cutting edge.
Overall length: 14 in.
Weight: 1.6 lbs.
Made in the USA

IMG_0136.jpg

I have been eyeing up a Mora Bushcraft Survival, Black Carbon Steel, Ultimate Outdoor Knife and they only cost 65 bucks. I think it comes in a Stainless version also but I prefer high carbon for my bushcraft knives.
Razor sharp 3.2 mm thick Swedish High Carbon Steel blade with a distinct tip.
All-weather Morakniv Fire Starter
Integrated Diamond Sharpener.
Two Belt Clips
 
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Welcome.

It would help us if you defined what "survival" means to you. It's kinda just a marketing term now, and if we know what you expect to do with the knife, it will help us help you.

Are you looking for a bushcraft knife? That SOG Force really isn't one of those. Not sure what it is....kinda military/tactical. On top of that, I don't know where you have been reading but the SOG negative reviews are not just "gear snobbery" or "SOG Sucks." Many intelligent experienced knife users don't like SOG. Many do.

That said, I do like the SOG NW Ranger for an outdoors knife (again, not sure if "outdoors knife" is what you mean by "survival knife"). It's built to do the tasks that people do outdoors. I'd reccommend that if you want to go SOG.

I'd also suggest not carrying a hatchet AND a machete. That's kinda doubling up on weight. Unless you have no idea where you are going (Am I going to a pine forest or the rain forest?) there's no need for both. One or the other will work fine.
 
If you're going to also have a hatchet and/or a machete, I see no need at all for a knife 5-7" long and 1/4" thick. In that case, I would much prefer a blade 4" long and 1/8" thick (maybe even less in both regards)... it will be much, much handier for fine tasks.

No 5-7" blade on the planet will chop wood as well as a good hatchet... nor will it clean fish/small game/whittle/carve etc. as well as a smaller, lighter blade.
 
peterosinski said:
Hello,

I am new to these forums but not internet forums in general. From my reading here already I know that this will be similar to other forums I've read (digital cinema cameras and lenses) which is to say that there is a wealth of good information with some die hard brand loyalty and gear snobbery sprinkled on top. I know how to search a forum and have spent a good amount of time reading before making my first post.

Now to the question. I am looking for a good all around survival knife for my BOB. From what I have read people really seem to like ka-bar, esse, bencmade etc but these don't seem to fit what I am looking for.

I am interested in a blade that is 5-7 inches long, full tang, no serrations, about 1/4" thick, and stainless steel. I was originally looking at the esse 6 but it has carbon steel so thats out (I don't want to have to worry about rust when I am bugging out). The Ka-bar is more designed for defense than bushcraft from what I can tell so that's out.

I have started to take a liking to the SOG Force and it seems like all the hands on reviews are good and all the bad reviews are just "SOG Sucks" or one guy who had the wrong knife shipped to him. It is aus-8 steel which is stainless. I have a SOG powerlock multi-tool that has been everything I need it to be and more. I love the build quality but it just won't be able to handle bushcraft tasks.

Can anyone give me a reason why I shouldn't purchase this knife and maybe a place to purchase one? I have seem them offered under $100 all the way up to $180.

I also plan on having a hatchet and machete in my bugout bag and would appreciate help picking those as well. When it comes to machetes I can't seem to find one that doesn't have bad reviews somewhere. I want something strong and 18-24" that can take some of the chopping abuse in place of my survival knife.

For the hatchet I was hoping to find something that is steel from the blade down through the handle, a hammer on the back end would be a plus but is not necessary. One piece steel construction is the most important thing because I don't want to have to worry about breaking the handle when bugging out.

Thank you in advance for your help and I look forward to participating in this forum
Click to expand...

Bark River Bravo 1.5 available in carbon or stainless steel.
 
The one mistake that a lot of people make when making a "BOB" is to throw the kitchen sink at it as to "cover all bases." That's great and all but they forget they actually have to CARRY the "BOB." If you want my advice you should structure your cutting tools like this:

1) EDC pocket knife of your choice. Multitool would be a good choice.
2) Small light fixed blade under 5 inches long and under 3/16 inch thick. A stainless mora is what I would recommend but any good manufacturer will do. Stay away from scandis greater then 3/32 inch thick.
3) A condor machete OR an estwing hatchet. Not both. I chose a Silky pocket boy saw in this role as it's lighter and considerably more efficient for the cutting I would need to do.


YMMV
 
Since knives and hatchets have been covered already I'll speak to the machete. It is a chopping tool, not a prybar or splitting maul. You want long, thin, and wide: Long for velocity, thin to bite when it hits, and wide in order to get mass behind that thin cutting edge. I like the bolo and panga style machetes for chopping. In order get one at a reasonable price you are probably limited to carbon steel, but you can oil or wax it to prevent rust. If you really want stainless you can go with 420HC, but the price at least doubles. I like the Imacasa 24" Panga the best. I've carved the handle on mine to fit my hand comfortably. Please note that working class machetes will be delivered dull. A few minutes with a carbide puck sharpener will fix that, and allow you choose your edge to suit your style. The Condor line of machetes will arrive sharp, with a sheath, and a couple are available in stainless, but their longest blade is only 20".
 
Keep in mind that stainless steels are generally more brittle than carbon steels due to their higher hardness and many knife companies tend to coat their carbon steel blades with something to make up for the lack of corrosion resistance.
 
I love my Svord Kiwi Machete. Its made of L6 steel which is awesome its farily short though (I take mine backpacking a lot) but that makes it easier to carry.
 
peterosinski said:
...I know how to search a forum and have spent a good amount of time reading before making my first post.

Now to the question. I am looking for a good all around survival knife for my BOB...

I am interested in a blade that is 5-7 inches long, full tang, no serrations, about 1/4" thick, and stainless steel. ...I don't want to have to worry about rust when I am bugging out ... bushcraft ...

... SOG Force ...

...bushcraft tasks...

... I also plan on having a hatchet and machete in my bugout bag ...

... machetes ... something strong and 18-24" that can take some of the chopping abuse in place of my survival knife.

For the hatchet I was hoping to find something that is steel from the blade down through the handle, a hammer on the back end would be a plus but is not necessary. One piece steel construction is the most important thing because I don't want to have to worry about breaking the handle when bugging out.
Click to expand...

I am curious if all the reading that you did helped you, and also why you want to pack a 1/4"-thick 5-7" blade + multitool + long machete + all steel hatchet. In your reading, did you come across concerns about weight and also redundancy? What saw do you have with you? (Or are you packing multiples?)

All metal hatchets are very heavy, and heavy where weight isn't needed (i.e. not the head) and as a result do not chop nearly as well as wood-handled hatchets of the same weight. They also transfer a great deal of shock during use, and they cannot be comfortably 'choked-up' on for finer use. For outdoor use, you'd be better off with a Fiskars or decent wood-handled hatchet... But why again are you taking a hatchet?

I love a good machete in the woods, but an 18"-blade is the longest I'd use amidst wood - in grasses, vines, massive jungle leaves, the extra length may be handy, but not amidst the woods. Machetes are best thin. As such, they penetrate wood deep and tend to bind. To avoid this, one can alter the angle of incidence on a strike but then risk glancing off. Machetes are light but have a large profile and can be awkward to carry. But why again are you taking a machete (and of the length specified)?

What I don't like about the SOG is the hollow grind on such a long, stout blade. The thickness and length of the blade lends it to use for prying and batoning, but the hollow grind risks catastrophic failure if excessive lateral force (e.g. knot in the wood, cutting into bone) is applied where the blade is thin. I don't know how thin it is, but the thinner and softer it is at the edge, the more likely you'll experience edge deformation if cutting into hard media. Be prepared for edge maintenance. If it is sufficiently robust in the blade, I'd wonder why you'd bother with a hatchet where the 5-7" blade + baton would suffice, covering more tasks with less pack weight, but to each his own. Why, again, are you taking a long knife? What about a 4"-blade knife?

Where (climate, environment) will your BOB reside? What eventualities do you expect? Why are you taking the tools you are choosing? More questions than answers, sorry. :o
 
Opinions will be many on this question. There are many a set-ups that you simply can't go wrong with. The list is really endless. Some that i have & would use:

BK&T BK9 & BK16 & a Condor Woodworker axe, an Ontario or Condor machete & a Victorinox & maybe even a Bahco Laplander folding saw. I have a folding saw but it is not a Bahco.

BK&T BK7 & BK16 & a Condor axe.

Ontario SP51---1/4" thick & SP2 & a Condor axe.

Ontario SP53---1/4" thick & SP2 & a Condor axe.

Tops Alaskan Harpoon---1/4" thick.

The list is really endless. I own all the ones i listed & a lot more. I would trust my life to any of those combos.

I have a SOG Fusion but am not fond of their knives. You can do better for the same or less IMHO.
 
I will most likely not be taking all the items listed on foot. Right now I live in the mid atlantic region of the US and my plan for tools was as follows:

Trunk of BOV:
Hand Saw - Basic 24" or so from Lowe's
Axe - Full Size, probably from Lowe's

Bug Out Bag
Multitool - SOG Powerlock
Short Knife (3") - TBD
Long Knife (5-7") - TBD
Machete - TBD
Hatchet - TBD

Multiple Blades: I need multiple knives. I will probably will be with people who will not have their own tools and I won't necessarily have time to share if we need to multitask.

Hachet vs Machete: I would normally prefer a hatchet because you get the added benefit of using the back end as a hammer but in my area we have a big problem with storms and fallen tree branches. They block roads, down power lines, etc. and If I need to hack some shit out of the road that is too thin to hit with a hatchet I want to be prepared and able to work quickly which is why I'd like to include a machete.

Big Knife/Small Knife/Machete First of all I drive a Hyundai Elantra at the moment so I can easily see myself getting stuck somewhere and needing to get out and walk. Depending on where I go there is always the chance of running into cops and having them confiscate the machete (legally or not, they probably just don't want people walking ) while I'm on foot and that way I'll have some back ups.
 
wow nevermind my original posts I have it solved.

Becker Combat Bowie (bk9)
Becker Companion (bk2)
Becker Necker
 
If you plan to carry a hatchet/machete and/or saw (or if you live in a desert climate), the only "Survival" knife you should ever need is a Mora Companion MG (I prefer the Carbon Steel version, but their Stainless holds an edge nearly as well) for doing the fine work that requires a super sharp blade. It will handle that as well or better than any other knife, and it's only ~$12 plus shipping.

If the blade thickness worries you get a Mora Companion MG Heavy Duty for ~$19 - it doesn't cut *quite* as well, but anyone unfamiliar with Scandi grinds won't even notice the difference - either one will most likely cut just as well or significantly better than the knife you're wearing right now, no matter what it is.

They even handily beat my old school X-ACTO knives in fine detail work in my testing, and that's something no knife has ever done before in my experience.

I usually carry the regular Companion MG, a cheap machete or reconditioned hatchet, and a Coghlan's Sierra Saw - $10 made of SK-5 High Carbon steel, and much tougher and more effective than it looks. Silky and BAHCO are other well known low cost high value options for folding saws.

Keep it light and effective - your feet will thank you!
 
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