Swordmaking - Distal Taper

D

Dave Hamilton

Joined
Feb 3, 2020
Messages
107
I'm currently working on my first European sword, a Viking era blade. I'm in the process of grinding in the distal taper and have a few references out there, two decent ones based on historic swords. One calls for a 5mm thickness near the hilt to 2.5mm nearing the tip. I'm more or less following this idea on my stock removal, .2575" 80CRV2 blank. I'd like to see what others think on distal for a European sword while I'm grinding away, which seems to take quite a long time at 36 Grit belts.
 
I just took measurements after letting the steel cool down. 30" blade length, every 5" starting at the hilt. thickness as follows: 6.05mm, 5.8mm, 5.2mm, 4.5mm, 4.3mm

Been at it for about four hours, on my second fresh 36 grit.
 
I found my old thread if you want to avoid some of my pitfalls.

Viking Sword Design - WIP - finished - COOP Photo added

After having so much fun making a katana I have decided to attempt a viking style sword. I found an amazing old thread by Phillip Patton that spanned about 2.5 years. He made a beautiful pattern welded sword: https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/pattern-welded-sword-wip.620581/ I dug up some...
www.bladeforums.com www.bladeforums.com
 
Richard338 said:
I think you are on the right track. I did a viking style a few years ago in 0.25" 3V and took measurements at several points as you are doing. I didn't find it as tough or go through multiple belts though...
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Thanks Richard338. Good to know I'm in the right direction. I thought it was taking a long time. I'm using 80CRV2 from NJ Steel Baron, maybe it came a little harder than others. I'm just working it on the flat platen.
 
Richard338 said:
I found my old thread if you want to avoid some of my pitfalls.

Viking Sword Design - WIP - finished - COOP Photo added

After having so much fun making a katana I have decided to attempt a viking style sword. I found an amazing old thread by Phillip Patton that spanned about 2.5 years. He made a beautiful pattern welded sword: https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/pattern-welded-sword-wip.620581/ I dug up some...
www.bladeforums.com www.bladeforums.com
Click to expand...
Will give it a good read!
 
Dave Hamilton said:
Thanks Richard338. Good to know I'm in the right direction. I thought it was taking a long time. I'm using 80CRV2 from NJ Steel Baron, maybe it came a little harder than others. I'm just working it on the flat platen.
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I will confess to running it under my 8" contact wheel. It removes material more quickly, but can make some small ripples visible in reflection, so you need to finish on the platen.
 
Richard338 said:
I will confess to running it under my 8" contact wheel. It removes material more quickly, but can make some small ripples visible in reflection, so you need to finish on the platen.
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I get that. I oonly have the platen the grinder came with, so I'll keep plugging away. I see in your build thread you milled in the DT as well? My fuller on this one is my first ever, little wave, where it terminates towards the tip is a little jacked up but I'll clean it up somehow once I'm tapered.
 
The attempt at milling was a failure. We just couldn't secure and support the piece well enough. In the end it was mostly grinder.
 
Dave Hamilton said:
My fuller on this one is my first ever, little wave, where it terminates towards the tip is a little jacked up but I'll clean it up somehow once I'm tapered.
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I got a length of PVC as a sandpaper backing and did a lot of clean up on the fuller by hand.
 
Looking good! I see you are running the fuller under the guard which is common, but it makes it tricky not to leave a gap.
 
Many repros I've seen are gapped, never have seen originals though. New measurements, hilt to tip: 6.0mm, 5.45mm, 4.60mm, 3.9mm, 3.94mm.
 
Final dimensions: hilt 5.93mm, 5.23mm, 4.39mm, 3.88mm, 3.91mm. To anyone, how's these specs sound?

The last 3rd doesn't taper as much, more straight but for my bevel skillset I'd rather have more. Never did a double edge before, let's see how I do there.
 
Richard338 said:
Looking good! I see you are running the fuller under the guard which is common, but it makes it tricky not to leave a gap.
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If you're trying for a museum quality repo, there are often gaps in the historical examples, all through the middle ages, both on knives and swords.

The obsession with perfect fit up is a modern thing.

D Dave Hamilton

I think you're doing the right thing, using historical examples to get your distal taper right. Often modern makers taper it so it feels "good" to our modern hands. But that's not how the originals were built, they were made with a particular use in mind, for a particular style of combat.

A Viking/migration era sword shouldn't handle like a cavalry saber.
 
A.McPherson said:
If you're trying for a museum quality repo, there are often gaps in the historical examples, all through the middle ages, both on knives and swords.

The obsession with perfect fit up is a modern thing.

D Dave Hamilton

I think you're doing the right thing, using historical examples to get your distal taper right. Often modern makers taper it so it feels "good" to our modern hands. But that's not how the originals were built, they were made with a particular use in mind, for a particular style of combat.

A Viking/migration era sword shouldn't handle like a cavalry saber.
Click to expand...
I'm using several references, modern and historical for the design of this blade. At the end of the day, this is just for fun and to learn. I've found larger blades more enjoyable to make than small knives and I've learned more with larger blades. I am dreading shaping a five lobe pommel though, the amount of fine work... but it'll be an exercise in shaping steel!
 
Yes, when I said a gap is common I didn't mean to imply that it is wrong. Most examples I could find have a gap there.
 
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