Talon hole uses

jharpphoto

jharpphoto

Joined
Jan 22, 2011
Messages
284
I've seen a couple (not many) of photos of users with paracord woven through the front and rear talon holes on Busse blades. Where could I find a resource to show me how to do this. I'd like to try that on my ASH -1
 
JohnTheTexican said:
The functionality doctrine says you can't trademark features that serve a useful purpose.
The Talon Hole is a registered trademark of Busse Knife Co.
Therefore, a Talon Hole does not serve any useful purpose.

QED.
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Registered trademark, like a Spydiehole on a Spyderco is used for identification.

Since Busse and Spyderco have both sent out paperwork to other knifemakers to stop them from using it due to it being used for identification, one can argue that the Talon Hole and Spydiehole both serve a useful purpose, if only for Busse and Spyderco.
 
Also note that 15 U.S.C. § 1052(e)(5) says you can't get a trademark for something that "comprises any matter that, as a whole, is functional." All those alleged uses for a Talon Hole involve it functioning as a hole, which simply cannot be.​
 
NJBillK said:
Registered trademark, like a Spydiehole on a Spyderco is used for identification.

Since Busse and Spyderco have both sent out paperwork to other knifemakers to stop them from using it due to it being used for identification, one can argue that the Talon Hole and Spydiehole both serve a useful purpose, if only for Busse and Spyderco.
Click to expand...

I think the Spyderhole's days as a registered trademark are numbered for a couple of reasons.

First, Spyderco says on its website that the Spyderhole was originally covered by a utility patent, which in itself can be fatal to an attempt to protect the same feature by way of trademark. Even an incontestable trademark can be invalidated if it fails to pass muster under the functionality doctrine, and it's pretty hard to show that something that was originally covered by a patent due to its utility is really nonfunctional. You can read a bit about that here (it's not specific to Spyderco, but it's informative nonetheless).

Second, Spyderco advertises the Spyderhole as a functional feature, which is another thing that can kill even an incontestable trademark. You can read a recent article (blog post, really) about that here (it's specifically about Spyderco and is also quite informative).

I expect that's why I've never seen anything from Busse touting the usefulness of the Talon Hole, and I also suspect that we won't be seeing the Holy Terror making a comeback any time soon.
 
Apples and Oranges argument. Of course trademarks are useful to companies. You’re mincing John’s comments. John’s intention was to state that the trademark rules inhibit the concept of it having a utilitarian purpose...for those common folk like myself.
 
So it is not feasible for Spyderco to try to defend theirs, since it has a function. As opposed to Busse defending their Talon Hole, since it is left to be decorative and serve solely as an identifier.

Thanks folks.
 
JohnTheTexican said:
I think the Spyderhole's days as a registered trademark are numbered for a couple of reasons.

First, Spyderco says on its website that the Spyderhole was originally covered by a utility patent, which in itself can be fatal to an attempt to protect the same feature by way of trademark. Even an incontestable trademark can be invalidated if it fails to pass muster under the functionality doctrine, and it's pretty hard to show that something that was originally covered by a patent due to its utility is really nonfunctional. You can read a bit about that here (it's not specific to Spyderco, but it's informative nonetheless).

Second, Spyderco advertises the Spyderhole as a functional feature, which is another thing that can kill even an incontestable trademark. You can read a recent article (blog post, really) about that here (it's specifically about Spyderco and is also quite informative).

I expect that's why I've never seen anything from Busse touting the usefulness of the Talon Hole, and I also suspect that we won't be seeing the Holy Terror making a comeback any time soon.
Click to expand...

There's a finer distinction to be drawn under the functionality doctrine, though. Both the talon/spyderholes are still properly protected as long as the same basic functionality can be obtained without infringing on the source-identifying aspect of the specific trademark. A different-enough-looking hole in the spine of a folder/hole in the guard just below the choil are probably never going to survive a functionality defense if there's an infringement suit. But the more like the specific type of hole that's trademarked they are, the less force the 'but it's functional' argument has. Still, there are only so many ways to put a functionally useful hole in a blade blank ;)
 
Only just saw this thread .
I like to do something similar with mine did you ever see the scene in freddy got fingered where rip torn walks in and tom green has sausages tied to his fingers thats all me lol.daddy would you like some sausages lol
 
Seriously though, couldn't one argue that the talon holes can be used as latching point for paracord etc?
 
Ironkid883 said:
Only just saw this thread .
I like to do something similar with mine did you ever see the scene in freddy got fingered where rip torn walks in and tom green has sausages tied to his fingers thats all me lol.daddy would you like some sausages lol
Click to expand...

I'm not really a Tom Green fan, however that scene was truly inspired crazy genius.
 
jharpphoto said:
I've seen a couple (not many) of photos of users with paracord woven through the front and rear talon holes on Busse blades. Where could I find a resource to show me how to do this. I'd like to try that on my ASH -1
Click to expand...

I used to put a loose paracord through the rear hole, then around my wrist, but have started to put it through the talon hole, after seeing videos of people in cutting competitions. Will report back when I either make a decision on which is better, or injure myself, which ever comes first.
 
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