Temper Lines

Chiro75, the way i understand it is that the dish soap helps break the surface tension so the vinegar gets a beter, more even flo and contact on the steel, so it can etch more evenly. Did you clean the blade with soapy water before you did the etch?
 
Terry, that makes more sense. I did clean the blade very well before etching, just like I do before FeCl etch. Part of the problem with the vinegar is that it wanted to sort of "follow" the cotton ball, probably due to the surface tension thing you mentioned, so I'll give it another shot on the next knife. I have three coming up to experiment with, so I will compare the two. For the latest one in FeCl I don;t think I even etched it for five seconds, then I remove most of the etch with another round of 1500 grit wet sandpaper, although I'm going to give something like Simichrome and the vinegar/soap method a run.
 
Terry is right about the dish-soap.

It takes a long time with vinegar.

The blade will just look ugly until you get the oxides off.

You cannot go over a vinegar etched blade with sand-paper, it will remove everything the vinegar has done. It has to be cleaned with very fine abrasive like Flitz.

:) -Nick-
 
I use the white vinegar to etch 'cause it is a little slower and lets me check where it's at. I heat to about 100-110 and put it out ion the direct sun. You can watch the process going on. From time to time, I'll agitate the blade a bit. With the heat, that seems to speed it up a little. When it looks right, I neutrilize and wash with detergant, the use the OOOO steel wool to smooth. Final step is gentle rubbing with Flitz. It's worked pretty well for me to get the hardness lines showing and the gray patina over the blade.
 
I tried the vinegar & dishsoap last night again and the soap made a big, big difference. I couldn't find Flitz or Simichrome anywhere, but I did get some Mother's Mag and Aluminum polish at the auto store. Seems very gentle, but maybe it does too much? Anyway, I did the vinegar and soap with a cotton ball, but I didn't time it. Once I got some dark oxides forming (interesting that it really didn't darken the hardened part whatsoever), I wiped it down with the Mother's. It left a very, very light hamon. I liked the way it looked, but it was almost too subtle for my customers, I think. I will keep experimenting with it, maybe leaving it in the solution for a while and seeing what happens. I tried a FeCl etch (about 3 seconds) on another knife, then wiping down with Mother's instead of going back with 1500 grit sandpaper and that worked out nicely. I didn't perceive the vinegar picking up on activity in the hamon that the FeCl doesn't, but this may be a difference that is more important for guys like Nick who are forging and subjugating the steel to multiple thermal cycles, whereas I am doing stock removal.
 
just remember that the vinegar is a lot slower and will take more times of doing it to bring out the subtleties.
 
Nick -- what are you using to get up to 6000x and what type of paper or stones? I like to keep my "pores" clean and use EDM stones up to 400, but switch to Norton paper after that, and am hoping I'm not ruining the stone work with the higher-grit sandpaper. (I hope that made sense). :)
 
Terry, are we talking minutes, hours, days? I etch in FeCl for literally less than five seconds, sometimes 2-3 seconds. I probably worked the vinegar in for 10 minutes, maybe? Should I wait for it to get as dark as FeCl etch would be? I liked the way it turned out, but it was probably more subtle than my customers, who tend to by my knives for the hamon in part, would be looking for, but I may not have given it enough time. I may just hang the blades in straight vinegar and see what happens. I'd prefer to fogure out vinegar and not use FeCl anymore, anyway.
 
the more times you etch and clean, etch and clean the more pronounced the hamon will be. Nick can tell you better about how long it takes, i havent paid attention very well to how long it takes, but i usually do the etch and clean several times til i think it stands out the way i want it. and with vinegar the hamon is usually white.
 
Heres a cool one I just got....Double hamon. I also have nice wharnie blade that has an identical hamon in 1095. This is 1084. Deep etch, selectively buffed. This one is now finished and has a mirror hardened section, while leaving the part above the hamon with some darkening and rougher....i love it. Ive really been toying with the idea of an artsy knife where I will put resist on all the hardened section and somehow etch it for a day or two, leaving a pocked and deeply scarred back to the tang, then finishing the hardened section up to 3000 or so grit.....
hamon.jpg
 
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