The 1075 eBay bandit strikes again

JTknives

JTknives

Blade Heat Treating www.jarodtodd.com
Joined
Jun 11, 2006
Messages
8,630
So I’m just going to leave this here for future posterity. short back story, Customers 1075 blades all cut from the same bar. Industry standard normalization and a quench in parks 50. This is after a 300° temper. These blades where processed at Exactly the same time. are adding a section to the website where you can select where you got the steel from. I am doing so tests on the failed blade to see if we can revive it for the customer.

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So I have an update. I re normalized it at 1900-1950 with a good soak. Then normalized at 1600 with same soak time. Then 1500° and quickly into parks 50 and agitated. Cleaned off the scale and gave it a 300° temper. Ground a nice deep test area and what do you know 38.5rc.
I’m now even unhappier then before because even doing this process should not have to be done. “This steel should harden from being tossed in a camp fire and dropped in your coffee”, quote from Geoff lol. So now I ask my fellow forum members if thy think it would be inappropriate to put a warning on my website about said vendor and their steels. The wife and I have decided to look into stocking the steel for our customers because of these continuing issues.

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Put the warning up.

You are offering a heat treating service. You provided a heat treating service twice now. The results you get from that service are dictated by the properties of the steel you receive and you knowing those properties so that the ht recipe can match it and you can't harden lc steel. You have no way to confirm the steel before hand and your not going to spark test the blade and damage the profile. The customer is responsible for what they send you. If they buy from an unreputeble source than the risk is on them.

Id be honest and say you have multiple customers with eBay steel that didn't harden. Maybe provide a picture of a spark test so customers what to look for when grinding but that could be a double edged sword as I would assume that most ebay buyers are new and won't know what they are seeing.

I just realized read your post and that all 3 are from the same bar. Is that even possible that the carbon is so poorly distributed?
 
Was this steel from outside NY? I hate to say it but put up a warning or at least a notice. I know its not your job but have you contacted said vendor? I'm sure he knows about it but notice that its still ongoing (or possibly just old steel?) may twig them to do something.
 
Stocking in-house from a reliable source sounds like a good idea. If it were me, I'd get legal advice before committing to verbiage on my business site.
 
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DanF said:
Stocking in-house from a reliable source sounds like a good idea. If it were me, I'd get legal advice before committing to verbage on my business site.
Click to expand...

This is sound. However perhaps modify by adding a list of "approved" vendors for the steel with a warning if your customer strays from that list its on them. If you have to do additional work like you did here there are additional charges.
 
Doesn’t seem to matter, people still keep buying it and recommending it.
You could tell people you won’t heat treat the steel from that vendor.
You don’t want your reputation tainted by something that’s out of your control.
I’m glad you’re speaking up though, it says a lot about your character.
 
I would warn people about it because they are not saying nothing to nobody about it. If I ground out a big bowie out of 1075 for a Hamon Say out of 3/8" stock and I couldn't get it to hardin, I would be beyond mad.
 
Steel that won't harden even when done professionally isn't worth a stocking of s@#t to knife makers
I'd go the approved vendors route like Dan and horsewright said tho
Or stock tried and trusted steels yourself JT.can only do your business good
 
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60, 62, 38 from the same bar?

That is just weird
 
Yo strike me as a solid guy and I understand your reluctance to name names, but think about it this way. How much did this cost YOU? $20 plus minimum in revenue just for this one little "experiment?" Even though the other two blades from the same bar hardened, would you expect your customer to trust them in hard use?
 
I am beyond frustrated with steel failing to harden in my own shop using steel from the same source. If you're losing money doing a few tests think about the shops like mine that have a lot of money tied up in these steels. Put up the warnings and approved vendor lists.
 
I think an appropriate warning to the community about the vendor wouldn't be crossing any lines, especially if this is now the 2nd separate incident with a different piece of steel from above mentioned vendor.

If you got 2/3 of the steel to harden correctly and the steel from said vendor is cheap enough, some folks may be willing to take that chance to save a few bucks.

To me, how or if you want to deal with said steel in your business is a completely different conversation.
 
I really hate being that guy that has to send the email that says sorry you blade(s) are junk. The wife asked me why I did the test at 1900-1950 I said because that’s what NJSB says to try.

THIS STEEL WAS NOT FROM NJSB
 
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This result looks odd...

Perhaps, asking your client to permit hardness test near the front of the 3 blades, if seeing hrc gradation - which would/might provide additional confidence in accepting 3 blades are sourced from the same 1075 bar.
 
Were they all Austenized together?
If so, what sequence were they quenched?


Were they all tempered together?


Any decarb protection for when normalizing?
If you ground deeper would it be harder?

What are the readings on your Wilson test block from 5 tests?
 
JT, thanks for posting the screen shot - I guess that's a simple and low key to let us know the vendor. From all I've heard about that vendor, he will wish to know about this issue. He's always had such a high reputation for quality steel.
 
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