The "Ask Nathan a question" thread

Why do we like particle metallurgy steels? They don't have the large primary carbides that tend to propagate cracking and chipping. They tend to be processed in a way where they're clean, fine grain and don't have pesky structures like excessive grain boundary carbide, nonmetallic inclusions, and alloy banding. <--- PM steels are so associated with these positive attributes that people tend to think the correlation is causation. The reality is the PM process allows certain alloys to be made such as high vanadium alloys that wouldn't be practical due to difference in melting temperatures of various ingredients, and if the properties of that certain alloy aren't needed sometimes a very clean, cross rolled electroslag remelt can out perform PM steel in some ways. Infi is a good example of an old technology that performs very well.

People often think the best steels have to be PM steel, but, like Infi, AEB-L is a moderate alloy, moderate carbon relatively simple steel that would not be enhanced by the PM process. And, what it lacks in abrasion resistance it makes up for in edge stability. This is true in any application where the loss of the edge is due more to chipping and yielding than one of the abrasion processes. Despite artificial results like you see in cut testing like CATRA testing that give a strong preference to abrasion resistance, for most people in most real world applications edge stability is king and this is where AEB-L shines. You have a stain resistant steel that works great at hardness in the low 60's and in thin geometry. It's clean, it can be fine grain, it loves narrow edge angles and rewards good geometry and a good heat treat with world class edge stability. What's not to love?
Thanks Nathan, ^^^^Mat this is a quote from Lorien on the DEK-1 I expect the FK2 to be of slightly thicker stock than the DEK1, and for it to be made from 3V. The DEK1 will be AEBL Entry 1730 this thread:thumbsup:
 
Nathan- I've noticed that my last two purchases, a hdfk and edc2, have a darker blade finish than my older knives. The older knives seem to have a more satin stonewash versus the newer knives dark stonewash. Are you finishing the blades with a different media? Just curious. Cheers!
 
Nathan,

Even though this project is a ways out on the schedule, I would like to hear your initial thoughts on the DEK 1 design from Lorien now that you have the prototype in hand. What features stand out to you in comparison to the EDC and FK? Is there anything about the design that surprised you when you first felt the knife in hand?

Thanks!

Phil
 
Hey Nathan, I was going though an old WIP you posted in 2014. I was wondering if you ever showed how to construct a set of soft aluminum vise jaws for milling flat bevels? I can't find it if you did. Awesome WIP by the way. It's awesome you took the time to put your techniques out there.

PS: thanks for the help a few post back. Got my damascus billet nice and precision milled.


This vise jig is what I'm talking about:

 
Nathan, what are the differences other than the handle scales, between the weaponized BC which you had originally for Jo / KoD and the weaponized BC which you are doing for Jonny's upcoming appearance?
 
Nathan- I've noticed that my last two purchases, a hdfk and edc2, have a darker blade finish than my older knives. The older knives seem to have a more satin stonewash versus the newer knives dark stonewash. Are you finishing the blades with a different media? Just curious. Cheers!

Different media, different tumbler, different person doing the tumbling (Mark, not me) and different chemicals. Our process has evolved.
 
Nathan,

Even though this project is a ways out on the schedule, I would like to hear your initial thoughts on the DEK 1 design from Lorien now that you have the prototype in hand. What features stand out to you in comparison to the EDC and FK? Is there anything about the design that surprised you when you first felt the knife in hand?

Thanks!

Phil

I like the new concept. It isn't 100% ready for prime time just yet but we all agree it's an exciting new pattern. We will jump into it once the FK2 is out of development.
 
Hey Nathan, I was going though an old WIP you posted in 2014. I was wondering if you ever showed how to construct a set of soft aluminum vise jaws for milling flat bevels? I can't find it if you did. Awesome WIP by the way. It's awesome you took the time to put your techniques out there.

PS: thanks for the help a few post back. Got my damascus billet nice and precision milled.


This vise jig is what I'm talking about:


There are a number of different ways to cut angled jaws. I surface mill them like once would do to cut a mold. Slow but simple.
 
Nathan, what are the differences other than the handle scales, between the weaponized BC which you had originally for Jo / KoD and the weaponized BC which you are doing for Jonny's upcoming appearance?

Jonny is a bigger person than Jo, though Jo is a very experienced competition cutter. Different people with different needs.

Jo and I made her knife very thin and light with thin shallow hollow grinds and weight taken out from the blade everywhere.

Jonny's has a very shallow S grind. It is the final bevel geometry iteration we developed with Dan for the racing knives. Convex up 1/4" from the edge, .003" hollow in the center, convex at the shoulder. Very deep penetration, minimal binding, can pop a chip out of a target, optimized for water bottles and rope it will cut things like a chicken or fish with minimal drag which is important on a hanging target.

We made Jonny's with a minimal swedge, a deeper belly and more robust bevels to tolerate harder hits.

Jo's was 17 DPS, Jonny's is 18.

Jo's was so thin it was too thin for me and I managed to bend a bevel the first time I swung it. Jo knows how to use very thin knives very well.

Jonny wanted more weight than Jo and he got it. His BC is several ounces heavier. It also has the more fully developed new handle scales and his are in rubber, Jo's were micarta.

Jo's had a pronounced swedge and a pointy tip for stabbing. We thought there might be more stabbing because the blades were referred to as "weapons". Jonny's is more of a chopping profile.
 
Ebonite Hard Rubber


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"Hey Nate, what's the deal with Ebonite hard rubber" asked nobody...

Once upon a time, a long time ago (as in the 1800's) you could make stuff out of wood, bone, stone, glass and other natural materials. There was no "plastic".

Someone recognized there was a need for a waterproof synthetic material to substitute for Ebony for certain applications such as reed musical instruments (think oboe) because ebony was getting spendy and it cracks when it gets wet a lot.

Someone thought to vulcanize the hell out of natural rubber to make a hard semi-plastic. Like phenolic (micarta) this is an old polymer that crosslinks into a hard thermosetting material, but unlike other hard man made materials it is natural rubber base and is still slightly flexible.

Real Ebonite like this is not used much anymore at all because it has some real disadvantages compared to modern alternatives such as nylon, Delrin and other modern thermoplastics, though it is still used in musical instruments, pipe stems, and things like some high end fountain pens etc. Applications where cost isn't a driving factor and properties such as tonal or tactile are important.

Disadvantages:
It's made of natural rubber, being a natural product there can be inconsistencies such as areas that can look a little splotchy.
Being real rubber, it does not tolerate ozone or (years of) extended sunlight. It can check and fade over time if it's stored next to an electric motor that generates ozone in use, or kept out in the sun for a long time.
It's not as strong as some modern alternatives. If you pound on stuff with your handle you're likely to damage it where micarta is tougher.
It smells a little funny at first because it is highly vulcanized which means a faint sulfur and burnt rubber smell. It's not obnoxious, but if you're accustomed to a highly sanitized scent free world you might not like it.
It's expensive because someone has to literally go cut and bleed a rubber tree to acquire the raw material. I'm offsetting this expense some for now because this is prototype development work, but you can expect that once I have Ebonite dialed in it won't be cheap.

Advantages:
With a much lower durometer than other synthetic materials it gives a pleasantly dead "thunk" in an impact compared to modern alternatives. This is nice in a chopper.
It has a pleasant smooth warm feel coupled with nice grippy tactile traction like only rubber can give. It is super pleasant in the hand. This is nice in about anything from a chopper to a small EDC and everything in between.


A long time ago the core of Ebonite brand bowling balls were actually made of real ebonite. They're not anymore, it's polyurethane. But some antique bowling balls were the source of the original Ebonite I used for prototypes. Moving into beta build production I imported Nikko Ebonite from Japan. That's what this is, current production Japanese Ebonite. It's a little harder than the antique ebonite we started with. I have mixed feelings about this.

Being rubber it benefits from a larger screw head to hold it down, so the Ebonite scales will come with a natural color titanium screw with an oversize head. Nothing fancy.

Jo uses Ebonite in her competition chopper instead of terotuf or rubber.
 
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I like the idea of this stuff, curious as to how well it works for a knife handle
 
Nathan,

Time, place and quantity of tomorrow's Ebonite handled goodness? Thanks boss!

Marc
 
Hey Nathan, when will we be seeing what you have been working on for HT and using AEBL. Also which models will be using it? Thanks
 
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