The Bone of Contention!

[waynorth]

I am referring to the debate that turned up in the Bose thread, about the material that was sold a ways back, as Remington Bone. It's on the right knife (pun intended!). Looking at these knives, it's no wonder there is some confusion out there.
I don't collect Remingtons, but I went out and bought this Muskrat, just so I could stir up a little sh. . . . . .
I mean, so I could start a dignified discussion, about who made the bone, who used the bone, who lied about the bone, and what this bone is connected to!
I mean, would you look at this comparison . . . . .really look at it???
Boggles the mind I tell ya!
I trust you can all read the tang stamps, but just so there's no confusion, the left knife is the Remington, the middle one is a Schrade Cut. Co. switchblade, and the right knife (pun still intended) is my T.Bose WT.
What I am missing is a Remington switchblade. Is there such a thing?? If so would someone kindly post a pic of the appropriate angle so we can see what it looks like next to these guys?
Don't hold back now! Let 'er rip! We must resolve this Traditional knife detail in a folksy and considerate manner!:thumbup:

 

[ken erickson]

To my eye the jigging on the Schrade and Tony Bose look more like each other than the Remington. The Remington jigging is spaced just a bit more open. My impression anyways. The jigging on the Remington has a bit more "cross" look. However the difference is very subtle to say the least. It could be that all 3 examples were jigged from the same source. Just a different day, different machine setup, different operator?

Ken

 

[Blues]

The Schrade and Bose seem to have a distinct family lineage. The Remington appears to be clearly different to my eye.

 

[Dr Bill]

I agree, the jigging on the Bose & Schrade look the same.
The dye of the Remington & Bose look similar.

Maybe time to sacrifice some for DNA testing, electron microscopy, carbon-14 dating, and other analysis. Those dead cows came from somewhere. . .

 

[fewpop]

The Schrade and Bose look more homogeneous to me. The tag end of the jig furrow (don't know what else to call it) on the Bose and Schrade looks more consistently pointed to me...not unlike conifer treetops. Just my .02.

 

[ken erickson]

The tag end of the jig furrow (don't know what else to call it) on the Bose and Schrade looks more consistently pointed to me...not unlike conifer treetops. Just my .02.

I noticed that same thing.

Ken

 

[KnifeHead]

I vote all three jigged by the same company and here's why...

The Remington has more of the jigging removed so it makes it difficult to compare it to the others unless you look beyond the stark similarity of the Schrade and Bose. Those two are obviously alike. But if you look at the pattern and shape of the cuts that are made in the Remington that we CAN see, they are so similar to the other two I would have to say it was done on the same machine setup at the very least. Worn cutters, heavy buffing, etc. could account for the difference.

It's a working theory anyway.

 

[d.parker]

I know of 3 distinct different patterns on Remington spring back knives, that I have in my possession. 1 bone supplier to Remington was the Rogers Bone Co. Rogers Bone is one of the Scale covers on several Remington Knifes I have in my possession. None of the 1920-40 Remington Knives I have and I have a quite a few match the Wilfred Works Trapper. The bone on Charlie's Bose Trapper is Geo. Schrade Bone. I'm not educated enough to explain the differences in the jig pattern and dye chemical make up, between the scale covers on the Remington spring back knife and the 2 other knives shown in the scan of Charlie's 3 knives. It is quite plain to me that the Jig pattern is the same on the scale covers of the Geo Schrade knife and the Wilfred Works Trapper, and these 2 knives scale covers do not match the Remington scale cover, shown in the scan (photo)....

 

[d.parker]

I vote all three jigged by the same company and here's why...

The Remington has more of the jigging removed so it makes it difficult to compare it to the others unless you look beyond the stark similarity of the Schrade and Bose. Those two are obviously alike. But if you look at the pattern and shape of the cuts that are made in the Remington that we CAN see, they are so similar to the other two I would have to say it was done on the same machine setup at the very least. Worn cutters, heavy buffing, etc. could account for the difference.

It's a working theory anyway.

I respect your view, but as you stated it is your theory, and it's certainly not working with me.

 

[JatMat]

I vote all three jigged by the same company and here's why...

The Remington has more of the jigging removed so it makes it difficult to compare it to the others unless you look beyond the stark similarity of the Schrade and Bose. Those two are obviously alike. But if you look at the pattern and shape of the cuts that are made in the Remington that we CAN see, they are so similar to the other two I would have to say it was done on the same machine setup at the very least. Worn cutters, heavy buffing, etc. could account for the difference.

It's a working theory anyway.

I run a manufacturing plant, using all sorts of presses and forming equipment, even though the equipment is the same, different operators will often more times than not produce different results with same setup. The amount of pressure exerted on certain forming operations by different operators will produce similar items but different at times. The equipment has to be adjusted for each operator. I think the same situation may have existed at the Remington factory. We may never know for sure, but you do have a good working theory IMHO.
Jim

 

[jonet143]

it appears the remington has less jigging per square inch. and they are a wider cut.

 

[d.parker]

I am referring to the debate that turned up in the Bose thread, about the material that was sold a ways back, as Remington Bone. It's on the right knife (pun intended!). Looking at these knives, it's no wonder there is some confusion out there.
I don't collect Remingtons, but I went out and bought this Muskrat, just so I could stir up a little sh. . . . . .
I mean, so I could start a dignified discussion, about who made the bone, who used the bone, who lied about the bone, and what this bone is connected to!
I mean, would you look at this comparison . . . . .really look at it???
Boggles the mind I tell ya!
I trust you can all read the tang stamps, but just so there's no confusion, the left knife is the Remington, the middle one is a Schrade Cut. Co. switchblade, and the right knife (pun still intended) is my T.Bose WT.
What I am missing is a Remington switchblade. Is there such a thing?? If so would someone kindly post a pic of the appropriate angle so we can see what it looks like next to these guys?
Don't hold back now! Let 'er rip! We must resolve this Traditional knife detail in a folksy and considerate manner!:thumbup:

Charlie a question if I might? Where did you get the Remington Muskrat ? There's something about that knife that just doesn't look kosher to me. Could you post more scans of the other side and blades open please ?

Thanks,

 

[Durwood]

This simply proves some people will believe what they want to believe regardless of the facts presented. And the reasons for not believing don't outnumber all the reason$ why Tony has already said that the person who sold him the bone said it was Remington bone, but he didn't believe that it was. Since he called it Remington bone (most) everyone believes that it is-- despite the evidence otherwise. The scenarios folks are coming up with to perpetuate the myth are almost as precious as the knives.

 

[waynorth]

More scans Darrell? Or will these do?

 

[d.parker]

Charlie, To the best of my knowledge, about Remington Muskrats. There are 3 variations of the R4593 Muskrat pattern. Some had pattern numbers, some were never marked, some were ink stamped and this usually wore off. The absence of a pattern number on the muskrat is really no big deal. There are 2 pattern with square bolsters as the one you have scanned. One square bolster muskrat has ease out notches for the nail nicks on both sides of the knife. The other square bolster muskrat hasn't any ease outs for the nail nicks,but this knife has a front side saber muskrat blade. The 3rd muskrat pattern is rounded on the top and end of the bolster ( rounded bolster ) and to my knowledge this pattern hasn't ease outs for the nail nicks.

I don't know for sure but I think the knife you have pictured should have a saber blade and I have some doubt about the scale covers ?? Just my opinion...

 

[KnifeHead]

This simply proves some people will believe what they want to believe regardless of the facts presented. And the reasons for not believing don't outnumber all the reason$ why Tony has already said that the person who sold him the bone said it was Remington bone, but he didn't believe that it was. Since he called it Remington bone (most) everyone believes that it is-- despite the evidence otherwise. The scenarios folks are coming up with to perpetuate the myth are almost as precious as the knives.

Damn! You caught me perpetuating a myth in the face of overwhelming evidence. Thank you for helping me see the light.

I asked Tony for a piece of that bone that we could sacrifice and sand the surface of the jigging off for a more fair comparison of the other two BUT I don't see the point of it now, since our nefarious plot has been uncovered.

 

[Durwood]

KnifeHead, didn't Tony say in the other thread that he didn't believe the bone was really Remington bone ? Paraphrased of course.

Now all of the sudden it is again With a reputation for knife making like Tony has is it really necessary to use the term "Remington Bone" even if there is a .00001% chance it isn't?

 

[mendezj]

Ok, fine, not a problem, anyone who doesn't want his/her whatever bone Bose knife can give it to me. I'll take 'em all more than gladly.

 

[KnifeHead]

KnifeHead, didn't Tony say in the other thread that he didn't believe the bone was really Remington bone ? Paraphrased of course.

Now all of the sudden it is again With a reputation for knife making like Tony has is it really necessary to use the term "Remington Bone" even if there is a .00001% chance it isn't?

I thought we were comparing the bone on those three knives.
I didn't say, "Yep, that Schrade and Bose both have Remington bone." I think the Remington knife pictured has Remington bone on it but I honestly don't even know THAT for sure. I do know that the jigging on the Schrade and Bose are almost totally untouched except for the outside edges SO it's easy to compare them. A person that knows nothing about knives could easily compare their color and textures and would likely say they are a perfect match.

The Remington knife looks like the surface bone has been ground down a bit which potentially caused some jiggin to be removed. I'm going by the images that have been presented and saying that the jigging looks similar to the other two knives. If Tony has some of that mysterious bone to sacrifice, we'll sand it down and see what it looks like underneath all that jigging so that we can have a more fair comparison and I will share that here.

As to the other stuff, I don't speak for Tony nor can I speak intelligently about the ramifications of calling it "Remington Bone". If you like, you can go to Boseknives.com and look at the upper right hand corner for the phone number and get the straight poop right from Tony.

 

[d.parker]

Kerry I think John Hanlon has a supply of the bone in question ? Perhaps he can supply you with a few pieces to experiment with.. At least he has offered me a set or to for sale...